Should a wax be applied after cleaning?


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carsonbm
September 5, 2007, 01:34 AM
Is it all right to wax a blued gun after cleaning, if so what kind of wax?

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Moonclip
September 5, 2007, 01:40 AM
If for storage just to look pretty it might be ok but I do believe if you shoot a gun that is waxed, the pretty wax finish will turn brown when it gets hot.

sm
September 5, 2007, 03:47 AM
Johnson's Paste Wax has been used forever to protect blued guns used for daily carry and use while in the elements hunting.

Be sure to remove stocks and protect under there.

Carnuba Car wax has also been used this way for a long long time.

1911 guy
September 5, 2007, 09:01 AM
A protective wax such as sm suggests won't hurt and will in fact help you keep the finish on your piece. It's not required, however, and I must confess to have never used wax on any of my firearms. I must also confess that the most heavily used of my pistols look very heavily used.

Geno
September 5, 2007, 09:43 AM
1911guy makes a great point that heavily used pistols look heavily used. Mine are no exception, and it is that appearance that I find attractive. JMHO.

Too, it would give me great pause to apply any water-based wax to steel. Steel is porous at a microscopic level, and I would be concerned about opening the door to deep rust.

The Bushmaster
September 5, 2007, 10:40 AM
If you are after protection from the elements just wipe them down with a gun oil saturated T shirt once or twice a day when in the elements. I have never had a problem with corrosion in the woods using this technic. And I hunted the Nortwest most of my life. It's even worse here in Missouri and it still works.

I agree with Doc2005. I have a Colt SAA that I bought in 1966 that has been carried as a hunting backup and for handgun hunting. It shows the wear to prove it. I have grey hair and I'm proud of it. I earned every one of them. My Colt SAA has earned the right to look well used, but cared for also...

lance22
September 5, 2007, 01:00 PM
Just a thought ... if the coating rubs off in the holster it could produce grit / deposits that could contribute to increased wear on the finish.

skeeter1
September 5, 2007, 01:56 PM
I wouldn't wax any of my guns. I've never even heard of the practice. If I want to protect them, that's what Breakfree CLP is for, and I know it won't hurt anything. You might be able to use wax on the hardwood furniture, but I'd keep it off of the blued steel.

sm
September 5, 2007, 02:48 PM
Ain't no only way to go something, just one needs to be open minded.

Blue Steel and Wood stocked guns have been around a long time. Somehow these guns worked, stayed functional, and are still being used and can be viewed in Museums.

Renaissance Wax being one of the more favored protections used by the way in Museums. :)

Blackpowder Guns have been around for a bit now, and with corrosive concerns, these guns are still being kept up and maintained as they were in yesteryear.

I mean let us face it, BP guns and petroleum products don't get along well.
There was no CLP back in the day, heck there was not even a Flathead Ford to steal the oil from a dipstick to "oil one down".

Natural Products worked then, and still work today.

Duck Capitol of the World and it gets wet, cold, sleet, rain, and Folks used Wood Stocked , Blue Shotguns to fell Ducks.
Johnson's Paste Wax, protects Wood and Metal.
Mentors were protecting guns before I was born in the mid 50's with the wax in the yellow can, the same can used to protect wood floors and other uses n the home.

This is mirrored all over , using Johnson's Paste Wax,which if memory serves come about circa 1900, or similar product under another name.

Police were issued blued Model 10s back when I was a kid.
If I have seen it once, I have seen it a thousand times.
Police officers applying Johnson's and if you asked them they said that was what they used on their sidearms and shotguns.

It gets real hot and humid here in the South. Like 105* F then add the heat index, and bump it up to 111* F.
It gets cold, maybe not as bad as some places, still to us, 15* F in the rain, sleet and snow hunting ducks, deer and whatever else, is cold.

See that long gun on the tractor? The wood and blue one? It has either Johnson's Paste Wax or RIG [Rust Inhibiting Grease] which come out in 1935.

Both of these products have been successfully used forever.

Want another "wax" product? How about Ballistol.
Interesting history and this product is non-toxic, had Medicinal Grade Mineral oil and the extract of Anise in it. It gets a "waxy" appearance, and protects wood and blue - This is what the German Army was issued, as it was designed to do so.

"Wax" gets used out of context. Not all "wax" is like B-Day Candles.
I do not know why it gets a negative response as it does.

Carnuba wax comes off the leaves of Palm trees, and is the hardest wax, harder than a brick.
Hence the reason many folks use Kit, or some other car wax with carnuba to wipe down and protect guns.

Beeswax, goodness, so many uses. BP folks use this and seamstresses use on needles.

See blue guns have some advantages over "stain"-"less" guns.
Your Grandpa's old Model 12 is still blue and rust free pretty much, it has some wear.
How many posts do we see about "My Stainless gun has rust!"

One the metallurgy differs, to get that deep blue, means a craftsman that knew how to polish , which is real important in the preparation to bluing , finished out the metal - proper.

Bluing is a form of controlled rust. My gunsmith prefers stainless from a gunsmiths perspective for customers.
Easier and less hassle to finish out, and if a customer needs work done, just sandblast or whatever.

"Textured finishes hide a lot of sin". Less money for the customer wanting gidgets and gadgets done, if on a steel gun.
Customer is not out his time, skill, prepping the metal, finishing it out, and re-bluing.

Sandblast over a imperfection and done.

Leather, just like back in the day, are going to give holster wear, just a fact of life. Stainless "resists" but they get wear just like blue ones.

Acids in leather , just a natural thing. Tanning hides been going on forever.
Ever worn a new pair of boots and noticed your socks were stained?

Well when chemicals mix, like the acids from leather and some oils, chemical reactions occur. Ever seen a stainless gun with a newfangled gun oil turn orange and there is rust?

Ever seen a synthetic holster do this as well? Oh yeah, plastic is made from petroleum as well.

Just because something is "old" does not mean it is "bad".

Blackpowder folks use hot water, soap and on guns, and natural oils - never petroleum.

Just because something is "new" does not make it "better".

The pie for firearm related stuff is only so big, and everyone wants their slice of their pie to be bigger.

Marketing is a huge tool to alleviate folks from their money.
Buzzwords mentioning Police and Military, or "Figures" like a Gun Smith, Shooter, or Competitor.

Wheaties tm - The Breakfast of Champions All sorts of sports and sports figures on that box over too many years.

Stick a 3 Gunner , a Trap Shooter, Lady Bulls-Eye Shooter , Bench Rest shooter, Little Lady with a Pink Crickett, young man with a Henry Golden Boy...etc. On that box and folks would want a "Wheaties Forum" on THR
:D

Wax on a gun?

Go ask some old timers about this.

One of our best Natural Resources are the Older Members of Society.

AndyC
September 5, 2007, 03:21 PM
Now that was a fascinating read - never knew all that :)

bhk
September 5, 2007, 04:18 PM
Johnson's Floor Wax is the ONLY thing I have found that has prevent my Sako 75 barrel from turning red in a month or so of storage, even when kept in a dehumidified safe. I don't think the bluing process was properly 'stopped' at the factory and it is the only gun I have this problem with. No other recommended rust preventative seems to work, and I think I have tried every one of them. Wax on this Sako made the problem disappear, even when the gun is hunted hard all winter long. I just put a couple of new coats on once a year.

CWL
September 5, 2007, 05:32 PM
What sm said.

Wax will turn brown if it gets hot? You mean it is bad for all those millions of cars that have been waxed and left in the sun for months at a time, not to mention the hoods which have to endure the combustion heat generated by car engines? Somebody better alert the car wax companies that their product doesn't work.

Folks, wax is good for protecting metal from the elements as well as your greasy fingers. Car wax is great, never tried floor wax, but I also use Renaissance Wax on all my guns & knives. If the Winchester Museum uses it on the thousands of guns in their collection, I think it's safe to rub onto my guns and knives.

Oh yeah, I rub melted beeswax into my leather holsters and knife sheaths (let soak into both outside and inside). This makes them outright waterproof. Be careful about pooling water into closed-bottom holsters though. If done correctly and fully absorbed into the leather, I don't think that they would hold any more grit than unwaxed leather.

sm
September 5, 2007, 05:56 PM
Thanks for the kind words.

Now there is more to life than guns. :eek:

"Boy about half crazy"
Maybe so, still shut up - we liable to learn something else"

Now that the guns have been inspected and maintained, with whatever product you choose. Get off the Internet for a bit.

Got your yeller can of Johnson's Paste Wax ?

"YES! But now what?"

Got a nice hardwood floor and pair of really soft cotton socks?

"Told you the boy was a whole lot off plumb"
"Shut up- I got my yellow can, hardwood floor, and socks".
<mind picture>

Sweep floor, get on knees and hand rub the wax into floor. Buff the haze, slip on the sock and in Sock Feets, Slide-baby-slide!
:D

Listen, you have to get the kids in on this, this is being a responsible firearm owner by passing forward.
Ain't a darn thing in the "Passing Forward Book" that says everything you pass forward has to be about guns.

IF the wife comes in, and catches you and the kids having a good time.

Kids : We were helping daddy polish the floor.

Dad: Just parenting the kids honey, passing forward you know! They are big enough to understand and appreciate inspecting, maintaining hardware floors, which includes Johnson's Paste Wax being applied and buffed to a nice polish.

Wimmin usually don't know what to think, much less what to say.

Best to keep the wimmin still reeling about all this, I suggest you get her on her butt, on the floor and pull her around the floor some...

If momma is sliding on the floor, she can't fuss!

Sheesh!

The things I do around here to ejumacate you folks...;)


Oh, you guys have a problem with the wimmin folks sneaking around in the wee hours, maybe thinking about taking one of your guns for her own?

That waxed floor is a Great Security system. Wimmin get up to pee in the middle of the night, got them fuzzy slippers and slide into door facings and walls.

You catch where she hides the chocolate, and her sneaking in to get that cute Model 36 you just bought.

You are welcome kids and dads.

45ACPUSER
September 5, 2007, 06:07 PM
Some people need to get enlightened. I have used wax on guns before and I will continue to do it. Hunting sticks need all the help from the elements they can be afforded. Going from cold to heated truck cab can creat a lot of condensation. I got tin of paste wax in amongst my cleaning gear.

W.E.G.
September 5, 2007, 06:17 PM
I don't fool around with waxing any of my guns.

I only use my guns for waxin' fools.


OK. Back to serious. The NRA museum uses this stuff to keep the rust-away from their collection.

http://www.brownells.com/aspx/NS/store/productdetail.aspx?p=236

http://www.brownells.com/Images/Products/053050200a.jpg

Ala Dan
September 5, 2007, 06:45 PM
On blued guns that I shoot in all kind's of weather conditions, I simply apply
a light coat of Blue Wonder Armadillo; after cleaning each weapon. Not as
shiney as wax, but it sure helps protect your investments~! ;):D

novaDAK
September 5, 2007, 07:36 PM
Hmm maybe I'll try this on a few of mine. Right now I just wipe 'em all down (two blued, two black phosphate type, and three stainless) every week or two with either a rag of breakfree CLP, Outers gun oil, or Gunslick gun grease (an old tube but it still works :) ) Now that I'm away from home (damn college :D) and I had to leave them all back home (no evil guns on campus) I only make it home every few weeks so I'll see if I can try the wax sometime :)

strat81
September 5, 2007, 11:40 PM
it would give me great pause to apply any water-based wax to steel
Wax is a type of lipid and does not dissolve in water and I have never seen a wax that contained water. The separation you might see when you come across liquid wax that has been sitting is a type of oil. Most waxes are mixed with petroleum distillates, not water. Carnauba wax, one of the most common automotive waxes, is incredibly hard in its pure form and even the best waxes use only about ~30% carnauba in their formulas. Anything harder and you wouldn't be able to apply it. A water-based wax is analogous to water-based motor oil: no such thing.

Just a thought ... if the coating rubs off in the holster it could produce grit / deposits that could contribute to increased wear on the finish.
You should not be using that much wax to begin with. The layer of protection wax offers is microscopic. If you are chunking it on, you're doing it wrong. "Dusting" that occurs on freshly waxed vehicles is the excess that was buffed but left on/near the car. Go to a Concours-level car show and see how much wax is left on a car to rub off. None. I'd be more concerned about lint, hair, dust, and deodorant dust ending up in my holster.

If for storage just to look pretty it might be ok but I do believe if you shoot a gun that is waxed, the pretty wax finish will turn brown when it gets hot.
:what: :scrutiny: Where do people come up with this stuff? Thousands, if not millions, of people have waxed white cars. You know what happens when they park them in the sun? They get hot. They do not turn brown. If they do turn brown, whatever you're using is NOT wax. I'd be more concerned about chunking it on and getting too much in roll marks, grooves, or other textured surfaces. Some waxes dry white when chunked on.


That being said, be VERY careful what product you put on your guns. There are dozens of automotive waxes out there.
Some are "pure" waxes... Meguiar's #16, S100 and P21S, Pinnacle Souveran, and Mother's Carnauba Wax (NOT cleaner wax). These waxes can generally be layered, creating a deep luster.
Most waxes are cleaner waxes, meaning they have chemicals in them to help remove paint oxidation and leave a layer of wax protection behind. Some also contain minor abrasives in addition to or instead of chemical oxidation removers. They generally cannot be layered since the cleaners will remove any wax that's already there. Many of these have silicone fillers in them to fill minor swirls and scratches.
Then there are sealants. Regardless of what's on the label, detailers generally consider natural products to be waxes and synthetic products to be sealants. Both form a microscopic layer of protection on top of a surface to resist oxidation and even fingerprints. The side effect is that this layer of protection has certain refractive qualities that give a surface that pleasing "just waxed" look. Of course, the best results are from proper surface preparation, not the final product.

For more on wax and auto detailing: www.autopia.org. They love shiny cars as much as we love guns.

tkendrick
September 5, 2007, 11:42 PM
Been using Johnson's on my guns since my first gun back in '62.

Didn't know you could use it on floors till I joined the Army!!!

Seriously, I build black powder muskets and rifle-guns and such for fun in my spare time. Once the linseed goes on the wood and the browning on the barrel, the whole gun gets 4 or five coats of Johnson's.

The Renaissance is nice stuff, use it some of my smaller wood working projects, and it'll really shine up with a terry towel on a lathe at 3000+ rpm. But it's incredibly expensive and not much better than the Johnson's IMHO.

Robert Hairless
September 6, 2007, 12:04 AM
I've used Johnson's Paste Wax (in the yellow can) since about the time SM was born. (That fact does not make me feel good, by the way.) It doesn't turn brown or any other color when the gun is fired nor does it attract holster grit or do any other wierd things. It does protect the metal. As someone else said, it's also useful under the grips of a handgun. I also use it on wood stocks of rifles and shotguns I want to protect. Good stuff.

Renaissance Wax is a product I've heard much about from knowledgeable people for some time. Each time I hear about it I intend to get some and try it. And each time I forget.

PotatoJudge
September 6, 2007, 12:16 AM
Wax is also a good lubricant that helps avoid some of the smaller scratches. This is it's main purpose in woodworking (it's a poor finish on it's own).

Recommended reading on the subject:
http://www.amazon.com/Understanding-Wood-Finishing-Select-Finish/dp/0762106212/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/104-3187797-9049568?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1189051861&sr=8-1

Kimber1911_06238
September 6, 2007, 11:25 AM
I've never used wax, oil does the trick. not sure how effective it is at protecting the finish, but others seem to say that it will. Seems to me that it would make a mess

tkendrick
September 6, 2007, 12:55 PM
I've never used wax, oil does the trick. not sure how effective it is at protecting the finish, but others seem to say that it will. Seems to me that it would make a mess


Lessee...oil comes off every time you handle the gun. Wax doesn't.
Oil stains every thing it touches, wax doesn't. Oil will eventuall seep into the poors on any wood stock, wax doesn't.

Oil is less messy.....how?

sm
September 6, 2007, 04:24 PM
Speaking of spooking game with the glint of blue steel -

We didn't.

Back in the day we had wood stocked shotguns, that real deep bluing, fixed choked shotguns.

We grew up learning to shoot, the habitat and the critter.
Doves, Ducks, Geese, and Turkey's to name a few have greater eyesight than humans.
Ducks for instance, they can spot the white of eyes from a really long distance, hence the reason "don't look up".

So there we were, just like decades before us, using these wood and blue
guns in cold, freezing cold, rain, sleet, ice and snow.
Using these guns in cold bright sunny weather.

We did not have a problem with guns enduring the weather, not did we flare the ducks. Just wearing natural earth tones, waxed cotton coats and them $29 Hodgdon waders.

Great Equipment Race was starting up.
Gun Magazines "said" :
-you HAD to have Camo Tape on that gun, especially the barrel or you would flare the ducks.
-you HAD to have "high brass shells, because they were more powerful".

Horsefeathers & Bullchips.

Just to name a few of the Had to Haves of the day. I mean one was a gall-durned fool if they did not do what the gun magazine said, and the folks at the diner, and that bunch that hung out doing that.
HS kids outside for a smoke and making fun of another "you don't know about camo tape and camo gear?"
If a person replied "No, my family does not do all that"
That family was nothing but Old Fogies and Idiots.

Mercy be! You should have seen folks at the Gear Getting Places.
First up, the old Mom & Pops shook heads and "sorry, we don't carry that crap, you don't need it no how..."

So the young bunch bad mouthed the Mom & Pops and headed over the New Fangled Stores that had this new fangled stuff.

Dude! I got my camo tape , camo hat, camo jacket, and high brass shells, I am going to slaughter them ducks!
No he didn't, he could not hit the inside of a 55 gal drum if he was standing in it.


We just used 2 3/4" shells we had patterned, and with all the shotgun shells we shot at skeet, were good to go on that note.

Johnson's Paste Wax, and just applied, NOT buffed, leaves a real nice dull, no glare , protective finish on them wood stocks and really nice deep blued guns.


Funny how some stuff don't change, including how convenient the magazine folks "just happen" to have the product Advertised on the same page of the Must Have item of the week.


I ever get rich, I am going to pay to have a Gun magazine put in an article, that wearing Pink and Yellow Polka-Dotted Underwear makes one a better shooter/hunter, turns them into Casanova's and they will be able to drive like Mario Andretti.

Bottom right corner of that article, there will an Ad for Pink and Yellow Polka-Dotted Underwear.


Bro! I got my Pink and Yellow Polka-Dotted Underwear, I am going to Slaughter them Ducks/ Win at 3 Gun/ Be a Champion ISPC Shooter/ ...

Henry Bowman, make a note of my idea for copyright,or whatever one is supposed to do...;)

Checkman
September 6, 2007, 09:22 PM
Lots of clever, folksy, writing on this post. So among all the Garrison Keillor wisdom I think I'm getting that it is okay to apply wax to firearms? Yes?

FieroCDSP
September 9, 2007, 07:05 AM
SM sounds old enough to know what he's talking about.:D Stick with the Johnson's or Renaissance and you'll be fine. Use something else and SM will chase you off his lawn, dag-burn kids...

New_geezer
September 9, 2007, 04:41 PM
As was said, you don't gob a ton of wax on your gun, you apply a thin wipe down. When I wax my shotguns, I start with the wood and rub it down first. After I finish with the wood there's enough wax in the cloth to rub down the metal. The nice thing about paste wax is it doesn't harm the finish on either wood or the metal. It acts as a very mild surface cleaner and protects all surfaces. Using it properly is a no lose situation.

CajunBass
September 10, 2007, 09:42 AM
"Pledge" furniture polish works great.

And it smells good too.

Rick O'Shea
September 10, 2007, 12:29 PM
Anybody use this stuff: http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=118623&t=11082005 ?

The Bushmaster
September 10, 2007, 12:34 PM
Look...It says "water based"...A bit worrysome...

PotatoJudge
September 10, 2007, 07:59 PM
Wax won't build up. The paste contains a wax solvent that incorporates new and old wax in the protective layer just like french polishing or shellacking. Apply a coat on all surfaces then go back with a clean rag and wipe until wax is no longer visible.

tasco 74
October 5, 2007, 11:41 PM
how do i keep the wax buildup out of the fine checkering on the barrel rib and top strap on my s&w model 27??

sm
October 6, 2007, 02:22 AM
Toothbrush

JohnBT
October 6, 2007, 08:21 AM
Floss?

I'm lazy, it's a RIG-RAG and RIG grease for me. It reaches into the nooks and crannies with a simple wipe.

John

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