What gun did you hear raves about online that didn't measure up?


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firestar
July 7, 2003, 03:41 PM
Have you ever bought a gun because of the rave reviews that you heard online only to find out that it was a POS or just not up to what people were saying?

There seems to be a cult of certain guns that poeple online seems to think are great, why don't other people agree in the real world? I am not slamming any gun but I think some guns have a good rep online yet in the real world people don't think much of them. Why is this? Do they just not know how good the guns are?

I bought a M-1969 Romainian .22 trainer. It is an O.K. gun but after all the great things I heard about it, I was expecting much more. It is crude and only decently accurate with a bad trigger. I could have gotten a Marlin bolt action for the same price and had a better gun.

Sometimes it backfires on you, if I had read what people were saying about Kel-Tecs before I bought my P-32, I could hav avoided a big mistake.

I have only bought 3 guns based only on info from the net and 2 out of 3 have been outstanding guns at great prices (CZ-452 and Bersa 23 in .22) yet one was a little lack luster (Romanian trainer).

Here is my list of guns that have a online cult type following:
Bersa .380s
CZ 75
Walther P-22
Makarov

There are more but that is all that came to mind. Are they really all they are cracked up to be?

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Greg L
July 7, 2003, 03:56 PM
Actually the majority of the rave reviews that don't measure up seem to be in the traditional gun rags. Most of the people online (at least in the places that I visit) are people like the average ones here - they just give their honest opinions about what they like/don't like about the particular weapon. They don't have sponsors to keep happy by not panning their product and they don't have to pander to others to get the next free sample. The people here are ones who've put their own money down (or are shooting a friend's piece where the friend purchased it) and have no reason not to give an honest assesment. Usually within the first 10-15 assessments you can get a good feel as to whether the weapon in question is a gem or a dog. I''ve found that people have no problem sounding off if they think that they've gotten taken on a bad deal/weapon.

Greg

Trempel
July 7, 2003, 04:32 PM
Colt 1911 and clones are way overrated, IMO. They're usually more expensive than anything else out there, and in my experience are less reliable than more modern pistol designs. The only 1911 that I've fired that didn't jam up once every two mags and that hit the target with some reasonable accuracy was a Kimber. Don't remember which model exactly, but it was a full-size.

Another one is Glocks. They're accurate and very reliable (for the most part), but they have some major drawbacks. The grip angle was designed by a moron. Any Glock, in any caliber I cannot shoot for more than 100 rnds. My wrist starts to ache. Glocks triggers are horrible. Glocks look and feel crude. I don't mind plastic guns, as long as they don't feel like plastic. SIG Pro and XD pistols have accomplished that. Factory Glock mags are also a problem. On a particular G23 after mags were kept loaded for about a month, they bulged and wouldn't drop free from the pistol when empty. The mags would slide out about half and inch and had to be ripped out the rest of the way. I would expect more out of a $500+ pistol. I think that there's a market for Glocks, but IMO they're worth about half of their actual price.

The hype about Makarovs is all true. They rock!

olyAR73
July 7, 2003, 04:39 PM
1911s and Glocks suck and Makarovs rock huh? Hmmm....:rolleyes:

bogie
July 7, 2003, 04:42 PM
So many things get rave reviews online (from people who've bought 'em, and want to self-justify the purchase) and in gun rags, and they really aren't very good...

If I read another review that raves about a rifle shooting 1MOA, I'm gonna scream.

I've heard about fancy switch barrels, which sound as if they'll be lucky to shoot inside of 2", I've heard about rifles that will kill the critter dead with a near miss, etc., etc....

bogie
July 7, 2003, 04:43 PM
Oh, and I forgot to add in the 15% markup for black paint, and 25% markup for a mix of green, tan and brown...

And anything that's a "brand name" must be better, right?

jsalcedo
July 7, 2003, 04:44 PM
It was the exact opposite for me.

the majority of online armchair gun reviewers were reporting that
Charles Daly .45's were crap.

Even the guys who had never owned or handled one consulted their magic eight ball and came up with "they are crap".

I ended up buying one in a private sale and found out for myself
that it was well made, accurate, and reliable

I'm very glad I didn't listen to the hype.



Yeah, and Makarovs are all that and a bag of chips.

10-Ring
July 7, 2003, 04:49 PM
The 1 gun I bought based on rave reviews & reputation only was the SIG P220. Absolute lemon, even after a failed factory attempt to make it right.

firestar
July 7, 2003, 05:02 PM
I have to say that it is the exception rather than the rule that the online opinion of what guns are good deals is wrong. I have found that most of the time, the best info is found online by private parties that have nothing to lose or gain by their views.

Some people get carried away with certain guns and the hype them beyond reason. The Makarov seems to be suffering from this right now. It is probably a good deal but when people start taking about them, you get the idea that they are going a little over board. How great can a blowback commie gun in an oddball caliber be? I think they are so happy with the fact that they are a good gun and they only paid a few bucks that all of a sudden the gun is not just a good deal but know it is somehow better than any other gun.

I have been guilty of this. Sometimes you get a gun that preforms well at a steal of a price and you start to compare that gun to other guns costing 3-4 times the price and telling people that it is not only as good but better than those guns. Sometimes it is true but most of the time you are streching the truth a little because you are so happy with your find.

jsalcedo
July 7, 2003, 05:12 PM
I bought my Mak for $130 + tax

It is very accurate and has not jammed in 600 rounds.

Double action with a decocker is a plus for carry and silver bear practice
ammo for $4 per box can't be beat.

It is not the price or the hype about this gun that makes it special you just have to own one to be a believer.

If I had to replace my Makarov I would gladly pay over $300 if I had to.

geekWithA.45
July 7, 2003, 05:23 PM
Glocks....


I just don't get them, despite their hugely loyal following.

They're clunky, they've got an awful trigger, they go "sproing" when you fire them, they feel like they're about to fly apart in your hand, and the frame bends when you rack the slide. In short, their aesthetics are horrible, and they have the brassy ones to claim it as "Perfection". And IMO, GG would sell out American civilians in a heartbeat.


Giving Gaston his due: They work, they're reliable, they're accurate.


But isn't that the minimum to be seriously considered in the first place? I mean, if it didn't work, wasn't reliable, or wasn't accurate, what the heck good is it?

HankB
July 7, 2003, 05:29 PM
I bought a Kahr P9 based on gun rag reviews.

What a lemon!

Let's see . . . the slide often failed to lock back after the last round, but sometimes did before the last round was fired . . . the trigger didn't reliably engage the striker mechanism . . . the slide sometimes failed to go into battery . . . the trigger pin started walking out . . . and so on and so on. Kahr tried repeatedly to fix it, until they gave up and replaced it. (good company, really bad product.) I replaced the replacement with a Glock 26. It's thicker, but it WORKS.

olyAR73
July 7, 2003, 05:36 PM
I love all my children equally. Glocks and 1911s. They both have earned a place in the defensive pistol arena. I have wasted too many hours debating the ruggedness and reliability of the Glock. Its a design thats been copied in some form or fashion by most of the major hand-gun makers in the industry. I have found that most Glock detractors have never owned one, or even fired one. :)

CWL
July 7, 2003, 05:41 PM
My Kimber Ultra CDP. a true POS.

The most expensive stock gun I ever bought after my H&Ks.

cool45auto
July 7, 2003, 08:45 PM
I haven't bought the rifle yet I've been reading about on the net, the Beretta CX4 Storm. I hope it doesn't dissapoint.:uhoh:

Sheslinger
July 7, 2003, 11:36 PM
The 1 gun I bought based on rave reviews & reputation only was the SIG P220. Absolute lemon, even after a failed factory attempt to make it right.


Ala Dan? Cslinger? Any other Sigaholics to jump in here?

Seriously, sorry about the P220, don't hear too many negative feedbacks on it.

Sheslinger

Eamonn Wright
July 7, 2003, 11:42 PM
Four SIGS here, 226, 228, 229, 239. Not a hiccup from a single one. Love my Kimber, my Glock isn't for me.

Zundfolge
July 7, 2003, 11:46 PM
When the Taurus Millennium pistols first hit the shelves you'd have though it was the second coming of John Moses Browning and that the Godlike perfect CCW pistol had been forged by magical elves down in Brazil.

I almost bought a PT145, but thankfully an emergency expense came up and I put it off for a month ... in that month the frames started cracking and the pins started wiggling out of the PT111s. *whew* :p


The only gun I bought because of online hype was my Makarov ... it was a good choice :)

JDSlack
July 8, 2003, 12:40 AM
I have to stick up for the Sig 220. I bought one years ago, sold as a Browning BDA. Has bottom mag release, but that gun never, ever hiccupped with anything I fed it. Accurate as well. I rarley shoot it now, because I found how uncommon the Browning marked ones are. I wish I had picked up one in . 38 super when I had the chance.

ACT
July 8, 2003, 01:24 AM
I own a Makarov wouldn't trade it for anything out there excellent little gun, of coarse the one I bought was one of the East German ones so it has a little nicer finnish than some of those made in other Eastern Block Countries.

Another gun I bought was one of the 6.5x55 short barrel Swedes. It's an Excellant Rifle.

Only thing is I bought both before I read any of the hype on either gun, but I've added to the Hype on both as I'm Sold on both.

The one gun that I couldn't understand all the Hype on was the newer Taurus Revolvers until I bought my 44 mag last year, as in the Late Sixties and Early Seventies Taurus had some Real Junk out there that was comparable to some of the other junk the imported to this country under the name of Armorous.

dude
July 8, 2003, 01:53 AM
I have several Glock-fanatic friends and have shot several versions. The full sized versions are very uncomfortable for me as the grip angle is sort of 'forced' on the shooter (the same reason I do not prefer FALs).......while the sub compacts are VERY comfortable for me as they fit 'in' my hand.

I had a fling wiht a Glock 30 for a while but could never quite get comfortable with the trigger/saftey system. Being a P7 man for almost 20 years now, the lack of any sort of a trigger 'de-armer' always made me a bit uncomfortable. No knock aginst the system........it is just not for me.

That being said--If my boss called tommorow and said I needed to bring my own firearm to work on the next go-around (I work fwd deployed for Uncle Sam) it would be a Glock 30 with a nice thigh holster and 10 or so mags!

The P7 is nice for personal defence and everyday fun sending rounds downrange in the woods.................. but not if there is the potential for lots of bad-guys with the incorrect attitude about life, Liberty and the pursuit of a good time for me and my Nation.

swingset
July 8, 2003, 02:41 AM
bought a M-1969 Romainian .22 trainer. It is an O.K. gun but after all the great things I heard about it, I was expecting much more. It is crude and only decently accurate with a bad trigger. I could have gotten a Marlin bolt action for the same price and had a better gun.

I don't doubt your testimony about the M69, but consider my story with the gun. Total price? $49. Nothing comes close to that price, so right away it can't be that bad.

Second, the stock was rough, the metal did need some attention, but again the cheap price negates the negatives. The trigger is rough on these guns, tho I doubt you'll find better with a cheap Marlin. Also, the trigger is very easy to improve. With 1 hour of fidgeting, I lessened the pull by half, and it's now smooth and crisp.

Third, the gun is ammo-sensitive, and I knew that going in from reading reviews. After extensively testing ammo, I found that hi-velocity ammo of any kind didn't sit well with the gun, and the ammo it really likes Remington Target (blue tag). Armed with a modest scope and it's improved trigger, I can routinely shoot dime sized groups at 50 yards....from a $50 rifle mind you.

I don't doubt your disappointment, but my experience was that it actually exceeded the hype.

sig970
July 8, 2003, 02:48 AM
Another vote for Glock

Majic
July 8, 2003, 03:22 AM
Personally I think it is a crap shoot purchasing a firearm based solely on someones advice. Most people have the ability to go to a dealer, even if it means a lengthy drive, to get a chance to handle the model or one like it. I have handled and shot several polymer pistols and found that they really don't suit me. Then the XD came on the market and people raved about it. So I went to the dealer to give one a try and found that that in handling it didn't suit me either. I will not buy a firearm without having a chance to handle one or one like it because everyone has different tastes.

TheeBadOne
July 8, 2003, 03:28 AM
On a particular G23 after mags were kept loaded for about a month, they bulged and wouldn't drop free from the pistol when empty. The mags would slide out about half and inch and had to be ripped out the rest of the way.

This is most likely NOT a flaw. Glocks were designed/made in Europe. In Europe they prefer military pistols that a mag does not drop clean out of a pistol. They want it to pop down and stay put until pulled out with the fingers. This stems from waaay back in WWI when pistols were fired and then mags were dropped....into the mud and lost. The pistol is useless w/o a mag. Newer Glocks have a "US" release. You can also specify which type of mag release you want when you order one. If you have one with a "Europe" release I believe a simple parts change (either mags/frame) will correct this "flaw".

All the best

dude
July 8, 2003, 03:50 AM
actually.............the non-drop free Glock mags were the way the Glocks were designed for the Military contract. The Austrian Army only issed the happy trooper the 1mag for his/her Glock. The logic being one mag is enough to get you out of trouble and it not dropping free made it easier to keep track of. Sounds well reasoned to me!!

Gunhead
July 8, 2003, 05:23 AM
1911s, far ahead anything else...

Mannlicher
July 8, 2003, 09:07 PM
H&K USP Compact .40 S&W. Mine was a total piece of junk.

Zip06
July 8, 2003, 10:36 PM
I think that THR Board hype is way more objective than gun rag hype. In this thread there are two distinctions that need to be made; first, confusing hype with the discovery of a vastly under-rated firearm (CZ-75B, Makarov, Sig 225) and the unashamed touting of a marginal firearm (IMHO, Kel-Tec P-11, Sigma, highly modified anything (unreliable), horribly expensive .45's and fancy new calibers (.357, .454, .45 Glock). Also in the pile of pigs should be included cut down versions of Government Models (less than Commander size). Excuse me now while I get into my nomex.

Majic
July 8, 2003, 10:44 PM
Your age is really showing Zip06 if the .357 and the .454 are fancy new calibers. :neener:

BTW the 45 Glock is a cartridge not a caliber.
Yea yea it's nit pickin, but just sorting things out.

DW
July 8, 2003, 10:48 PM
Kel-Tec p32

bad_dad_brad
July 8, 2003, 11:00 PM
I am a relative newbie regarding handguns. Been shooting them since 1995. Long guns, a lot longer.

I have found Glocks to be above the hype, excellent weapons. And M1911's, although not for me, again excellent weapons. Quality revolvers, Rugers and S&W - again excellent. Maks - no experience. SIGs good stuff. BHPs are sweet. CZs, too big for my hands, but again, outstanding.

Hype on THR (or the old TFL) is hard to find. If hype is expressed, usually it is calmly dealt with.

Good quality weapons are usually just that. You get what you pay for. Every gun I have purchased I have researched before hand, and none such has dissapointed me.

Vladimir Berkov
July 8, 2003, 11:38 PM
The real problem I think on internet forums is the hyping of weapons which are hard to find/expensive, even though most people have never fired or even handled the gun.

The Sig 550, HK G36, and SIG P210 come to mind here.

There are also the groups of people insanely touting some particular gun, such as the P7, the Makarov, the CZ75, and the Glock.

Not that I am saying this is bad, just that these guns seem to have devoted followings.

I might be accused of being in the CZ75 group myself!

JeFF D
July 8, 2003, 11:46 PM
I've bought all of my guns except the first from what I've read online, thats where I research what guns to buy and everything has proved itself I've not yet had a regrettable gun purchase.
I bought a VEPR K just from what I read about them on TFL and THR and all the hype was true I love it.
-jeff

Neal Bloom
July 8, 2003, 11:56 PM
For me the SIG P220 has more than lived up to the raves I read about. I am very impressed with it. The P220 felt like it was made for my hand.

The SIG P225 was a tad dissapointing. The trigger is awfully stiff and felt like I needed a longer finger. My wife does not like it at all. Sort of thought that a single stacker would have a better feel. It is quite accurate once I got used to it and I am sure with time I'll get more comfortable with it.

Pebcac
July 9, 2003, 10:47 AM
I'm going to light a few fires here, but my answer is two-fold:

Glocks AND 1911s.

Both have their raving die-hards, who usually hate each other and bash the other guy's choice. I've found that they're just like every other pistol out there - they have their advantages and disadvantages.

That said, I kinda miss my G19, and my next purchase will be a 1911, likely the new Springfield GI repro.

Now, where'd I put my asbestos boxers...? :p

dhoomonyou
July 9, 2003, 11:22 AM
Just traded it in for a Glock 27.

Had trouble from day one with the mag release, when I carried in a fanny pack the mag release button got pressed and the mag would drop out.
sent it back to Beretta for a fix, they said they replaced a spring, STILL had PROBLEM.

The hammer would wear against the slide.

It wouldnt always feed Hydra shoks.

Didnt give me that warm fuzzy, dependable feeling.

"oh wait Mr. Bad guy while I pop in the mag"

dairycreek
July 9, 2003, 12:32 PM
on a particular weapon over time you begin to get an excellent idea about it. For instance a lot of people are reallly positive about SIG pistols but, from time to time, someone who has had a bad experience (no matter what, that can and will happen) with a SIG will really knock it. So, who do you believe? I try to assess the overall thrust of the input and then make a decision. Overall, I have found the information on the net to be quite helpful in guiding my purchases/non purchases. Good shooting;)

curt
July 9, 2003, 08:49 PM
One of the problems i have with online reviews is that you have no idea what kind of person has written it, at least with the gunrags you know the guy is good enough for someone to pay him.

Online there have been several times when i have read a persons posts and gotten a little hint that maybe, just maybe he's a 30 year old 300lb ninja wannabe living with his mom. If the board allows you to search on posts that the person has posted you can sometimes get a feel for whether they know what they are talking about but i don't have that kind of time.

Luckily this is a pastime where you can usually sell any gun you bought for pretty much what you paid for it, its not like you're buying a $35K car and loosing 5or 10 k when you drive it off the lot.

I prefer to take my info from a variety of sources with appropriate weighting before i buy anything that is over $100.

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