Masked man running around with a 50 caliber in NYC


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GigaBuist
September 26, 2007, 05:03 PM
http://wcbstv.com/topstories/local_story_269152217.html

(CBS) NEW YORK CBS 2 HD has learned police have apprehended a man who was reportedly walking around St. John's University campus in Queens armed with a weapon, and wearing a mask of Michael Myers, the psychotic murderer from the horror movie "Halloween."

...

Police say the man, apparently a 22-year-old Guyanese student, was carrying a .50 caliber rifle inside a bag. Public Safety officers quickly disarmed the suspect and have turned him over to the NYPD.

Personally, I'm betting that the 50 caliber rifle isn't, and there wasn't anybody in danger of being hurt.

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littlegator
September 26, 2007, 05:06 PM
I'm curious to see how big the bag is... And what's up with the Halloween mask. Looking for a little attention? You got it...

damien
September 26, 2007, 05:06 PM
The story identifies the rifle:

carrying a .50 caliber black powder Wolf rifle inside

That is plausable. You can still buy these mail order. Of course, the news media wants us to somehow mistake a .50 black powder gun for a .50 Barrett which is a completely different type of rifle, so they put up a graphic of a Barrett rifle. Is this stupidity, or a willful abuse of the truth?

GigaBuist
September 26, 2007, 05:08 PM
It seems they've updated the story.

Yeah, I don't think anybody set on a killing rampage would be using a BP rifle.

gunsmith
September 26, 2007, 05:11 PM
Of course, the news media wants us to somehow mistake a .50 black powder gun for a .50 Barrett, and I suppose about 80% of the people out there probably don't know the difference.

Make that 99% of most people and 99.99% of New Yorkers:neener:

damien
September 26, 2007, 05:15 PM
Sorry that I changed my text while you were quoting it. For the record, that was what I wrote before I had a second thought about how to effectively convey my message.

In any case, I mostly agree. I think the % of people that understand black powder weapons is probably a little higher than 1% though.

ClickClickD'oh
September 26, 2007, 05:19 PM
But did it have a hi-capacity magazine, bayonet lug or barrel shroud? We may be looking at the next deadly evolution of firearm technology here... the assault muzzleloader!!!!

Rugerman99
September 26, 2007, 05:21 PM
"The suspect was said to be carrying a .50 caliber black powder Wolf rifle, similar to the one shown"
Take a look at the picture in the upper right hand side of the page. This is the caption that goes along with it.:fire:
How are they knowingly comparing a .50 black powder rifle to a to a .50bmg Barrett rifle? There are in no way similar.

gunsmith
September 26, 2007, 05:23 PM
look at the pic
http://wcbstv.com/topstories/local_story_269152217.html
They call it a BP rifle yet show a Barret type.
It's like calling a covered wagon a Mustang

Wheeler44
September 26, 2007, 05:28 PM
Soooo..... why dosn't somebody call the news service and straighten them out. I think that they might like to hear from an articulate firearms enthusiast that politely describes the difference between a BP and a Barret.

littlegator
September 26, 2007, 05:32 PM
But did it have a hi-capacity magazine, bayonet lug or barrel shroud? We may be looking at the next deadly evolution of firearm technology here... the assault muzzleloader!!!!

I'm sure it did...in fact, I think I heard that he had a 2000 round drum in his car, not a hi-cap mag. Furthermore, I believe he had plutonium tipped ammo in those drums. This, of course, is just speculation, but my mother's brothers daughters dog walker said he heard it from a friend of a friend, and I believe it.

Gotta love the media...

SaMx
September 26, 2007, 05:33 PM
I didn't know that Barrets were muzzleloaders :neener:

armoredman
September 26, 2007, 05:34 PM
Wheeler 44, while a good idea, remember firearms enthusiast, or merely anyone who actually knows real facts about real firearms, equals dangerous nutjob, loose cannon, strange-o, wack job, NRA controlled mindless zombie Rush Limbaugh ditto slave. That's what the polite editors would say.

GigaBuist
September 26, 2007, 05:38 PM
Soooo..... why dosn't somebody call the news service and straighten them out.

I hit them up on the contact page a minute ago. We'll see if they change it out.

ilcylic
September 26, 2007, 05:45 PM
I sent a message to the web team.

In your story about the man carrying a rifle in a bag on the ST. John's campus, on the page located at http://wcbstv.com/topstories/local_story_269152217.html, the sidebar says "The suspect was said to be carrying a .50 caliber black powder Wolf rifle, similar to the one shown above." The picture shown above is that of an $8000 long range target rifle, whereas the rifle the suspect was actually carrying is a $140 black powder gun, like the one on this web page: http://www.cabelas.com/link-12/product/0033480215857a.shtml

The difference is similar to that of a 1800's Conestoga Wagon and a 2008 Ford Mustang Cobra GT Convertable. They both have canvas roofs, four wheels, and multiple horses, but the similarity ends there.

It would be far more accurate to show a picture of the second rifle, rather than the first.

We'll see what it gets us.

DigitalWarrior
September 26, 2007, 05:47 PM
Also contacted them.

on a different note:
and wearing a mask of Michael Myers, the psychotic murderer from the horror movie "Halloween." should read "and wearing a mask similar to the one Michael Myers, the psychotic murderer from the horror movie Halloween, wore." Since Mr. Meyers wore a mask.

rino451
September 26, 2007, 06:04 PM
Who did you e-mail? Their site layout is the pits...

perpster
September 26, 2007, 06:05 PM
NEW YORK (1010 WINS) -- A man with a rifle in a bag was apprehended on the campus of St. John's University Wednesday, but no injuries were reported.

Public safety officials disarmed the suspect and turned him over to police, according to a school statement. Police were conducting an extensive search of all buildings and facilities.

Law enforcement officials later identified him as Omesh Hiraman, 22, a freshman at the school. 1010 WINS' reported that police were looking for up to two more suspects.

qbpc
September 26, 2007, 06:13 PM
Black powder/Evil Black Rifle yea I can see the media spin. To bad most people can not.

Wheeler44
September 26, 2007, 06:21 PM
Wheeler 44, while a good idea, remember firearms enthusiast, or merely anyone who actually knows real facts about real firearms, equals dangerous nutjob, loose cannon, strange-o, wack job, NRA controlled mindless zombie Rush Limbaugh ditto slave. That's what the polite editors would say.

Two weeks ago I might have agreed with you. Since then I actually wrote a letter to the editor of a local paper in response to an Anti OP-ED piece. They printed my letter and at least three others with similar RKBA points of view (see my thread in legal) . I was pleasantly surprised.

Wheeler44

lucky_fool
September 26, 2007, 06:24 PM
Here's what I sent them:

In your news story at http://wcbstv.com/topstories/local_story_269152217.html you have a graphic showing a .50-caliber Barrett rifle with the statement that it is similar to the Wolf rifle carried by the man arrested on campus. Aside from the fact that they both fire .50-caliber projectiles the rifles are completely dissimilar. The Wolf rifle is a single shot muzzleloader, functionally equivalent to the rifled muskets used in the Civil War. It in no way resembles a modern semi-automatic rifle. A picture of the Wolf rifle can be seen at http://www.cva.com/products/rifle_wolf.htm.

In the interest of accuracy I ask that you either replace the graphic with a more accurate representation of the rifle described in the story or remove it entirely.

Maybe it'll do some good.

On a positive note, I've been thinking about getting a black powder rifle. I hadn't looked at this one yet but I kind of like it - I'm going to add it to the list of possibilities. See, the news media is good for something. :D

CajunTim
September 26, 2007, 06:28 PM
http://i202.photobucket.com/albums/aa230/spctim11/50Medium.jpg
The suspect was said to be carrying a .50 caliber black powder Wolf rifle, similar to the one shown above.

okiebuckout
September 26, 2007, 07:16 PM
Is it just me or did they take the picture off? I sent them a message about it 30 minutes ago when it was still on there. Now its off...I might actually be impressed with them now. well somewhat.

GigaBuist
September 26, 2007, 07:26 PM
Yeah, they fixed it all up.

These guys (http://abclocal.go.com/wabc/story?section=news&id=5676791) however:he had a 50-caliber single pump-action shotgun and some ammunition.
At least that's garbled up enough that nobody would know what in the world we need a law against. :D

DoubleTapDrew
September 26, 2007, 07:27 PM
In a bag? Like a rifle case? Is that illegal now?
Thank goodness there wasn't a massacre. Someone good with one of those things could get off 1 or 2 shots a minute! Oh the humanity!

Cosmoline
September 26, 2007, 07:41 PM
They seem to be saying it was just a single shot BP rifle now, which makes a lot more sense.

mek42
September 26, 2007, 09:19 PM
The story claims, "The NYPD said Wednesday night the rifle was charged with gun powder, but police were still trying to determine if it was loaded with a live round."

This seems odd - wrong somehow - how much effort does it take for the police to figure out if there is a ball in the gun?

For whatever it is worth, if there was no ball either in the barrel or on the person of the guy carrying it, than I do not believe that it counts as a weapon according to NYS law (no idea about NYC special laws though). I know that while (in NY) you need to register all handguns on a Pistol Permit, that black powder arms are exempt if (and only if) you have the black powder handgun and only one of either powder or balls. If you have all three, it needs to be on your permit, otherwise it doesn't.

Oh - IANAL.

Neo-Luddite
September 26, 2007, 09:39 PM
how much effort does it take for the police to figure out if there is a ball in the gun?

I don't know--the BSA Rifle and Shotgun merit badge pamplet describes the method. Maybe there aren't any Boy Scouts in NY anymore.

GigaBuist
September 26, 2007, 09:42 PM
how much effort does it take for the police to figure out if there is a ball in the gun?
From what little I know about BP guns the only reliable method is to put a cap on the nipple and pull the trigger.

fixyurgun
September 26, 2007, 09:45 PM
Well, Ive heard on the internet(or at a gunshop) that those 50 cal muzzle loaders could shoot down a ford tri-motor! thank god it's off the steets!

Neo-Luddite
September 26, 2007, 09:47 PM
Most often-the charge can be blown out with a shot of co2. They make a little kit for this purpose. But simple answers preclude the drama the media craves.
A wooden dowel can give a person familiar with the type of weapon 99% certainty about the status of loaded or not.

Wheeler44
September 26, 2007, 09:50 PM
Thanks to all who sent a "memo" correcting the news service. It seems to have had some positive effect. Keep up the good work and correct them when you see 'em make mistakes. Maybe, just maybe, they will begin to see us in a different light.

AntiqueCollector
September 26, 2007, 10:11 PM
Umm, this is silly. You'll find the ball or bullet before you find the powder in a muzzleloader. If there's no ball or bullet over the powder it can just be dumped out. Just need to put the ramrod down the barrel to feel and see if it's loaded.

Sharps-shooter
September 27, 2007, 10:45 AM
he had a 50-caliber single pump-action shotgun and some ammunition.

Man, where can I get one of these? A single shot pump shotgun in .50 caliber.
my collection won't be complete without one.

armoredman
September 27, 2007, 11:03 AM
Would that be a rolling block configuration? A rolling block actuated by a pump mechanism? Designed by Rube Goldberg?

230RN
September 27, 2007, 11:25 AM
But did it have a hi-capacity magazine, bayonet lug or barrel shroud? We may be looking at the next deadly evolution of firearm technology here... the assault muzzleloader!!!!

You mean one of those shoulder things that goes up? *

The difference is similar to that of a 1800's Conestoga Wagon and a 2008 Ford Mustang Cobra GT Convertable. They both have canvas roofs, four wheels, and multiple horses, but the similarity ends there.

What a great line!

Well, Ive heard on the internet(or at a gunshop) that those 50 cal muzzle loaders could shoot down a ford tri-motor! thank god it's off the steets!

Another great line!



* =
http://xavierthoughts.blogspot.com/2007/04/carolyn-mccarthy-on-barrel-shrouds.html

(One of many links to this interview with Carolyn McCarthy)

fletcher
September 27, 2007, 11:29 AM
black powder
Now we have to worry about those tactical Evil Black Powder Rifles...

HonorsDaddy
September 27, 2007, 03:05 PM
What exactly did the accused do which was illegal?

Ok - granted, wearing a mask is odd, but not illegal.

Gun was cased and likely unloaded.

I don't see a crime here.

GigaBuist
September 27, 2007, 03:20 PM
I saw somewhere else that the gun was in a garbage bag. A security officer saw the barrel sticking out.

His parents said that he was recently put on some medication that wasn't working out too well for him.

ilbob
September 27, 2007, 03:24 PM
Ok - granted, wearing a mask is odd, but not illegal.
In many states it is, especially if one has a firearm.

JKimball
September 27, 2007, 03:28 PM
What exactly did the accused do which was illegal?

I think the cops determined the rifle was loaded.

At any rate, I think the action taken by the cadet and the cop to disarm and detain him was prudent. What would you have done if you'd seen it? It is one thing to see someone carrying around a cased gun, but while wearing a horror movie mask?

Cacique500
September 27, 2007, 04:27 PM
Better run out and stock up on GOEX before it's too late... :neener:

GigaBuist
September 27, 2007, 04:28 PM
Apparently this guy is just plum crazy. (http://www.wnbc.com/news/14211196/detail.html)

Officials said Omesh Hiraman, 22, is a paranoid schizophrenic. Sources said Hiraman was wearing the mask to hide from who -- in his own mind -- is trying to "hurt him, who is giving him the pain."

The lawyer representing Hiraman said his client witnessed the 9/11 attacks while at high school and affected his mental state. In an interview with WNBC, defense attorney Anthony Colleluori said Hiraman watched the twin towers fall and suffers from a kind of post-traumatic stress disorder. Sources close to the case said in the past, Hiraman had been treated for paranoid schizophrenic issues.

kludge
September 27, 2007, 05:23 PM
Most people never get past the first paragraph...

Police have apprehended a man who was reportedly walking around St. John's University campus in Queens on Wednesday armed with a .50 caliber rifle, and wearing a Halloween mask.


Now the next time some politician talked about banning the .50 they'll remember the "crazy guy" running around campus with a "concealed" fifty caliber rifle.

What we should do is turn it around to show that no matter how many gun laws they pass, they will never be able to prevent "crazy people" from getting guns and taking them into "gun free zones."

GigaBuist
September 28, 2007, 12:16 AM
What we should do is turn it around to show that no matter how many gun laws they pass, they will never be able to prevent "crazy people" from getting guns and taking them into "gun free zones."

I would suggest NOT using this case as an example of ineffective gun laws. The sale of muzzle loading guns are no different than hammers and baseball bats in the eyes of the law, at least at the federal level.

ilcylic
September 28, 2007, 12:59 AM
230RN: *bow*

I was pretty pleased with how it came out, but I have to give credit where it's due; the idea for the line came from gunsmith. :)

I'm thinking a 50 caliber single shot pump shotgun would be like a pump actuated falling block chambered for .500 S&W Mag shotshells. Personally, I'm thinking a 50 caliber single shot lever action shotgun would be easier to use. ;)

gunsmith
September 28, 2007, 09:23 AM
I was pretty pleased with how it came out, but I have to give credit where it's due; the idea for the line came from gunsmith

I thought it looked familiar, only written a little clearer/better.


This seems odd - wrong somehow - how much effort does it take for the police to figure out if there is a ball in the gun?
My brother was NYPD (he lateraled upstate) if he came across one of those
he wouldn't know...he would probably call me.
Most NY cops have little interest in guns and shooting.

RubenZ
September 28, 2007, 09:43 AM
The bottom line though is we have an idiot psycho here with some BS disorder walking around with a GUN and a MASK. Heck any of us could have even shot him LOL.

cyclist
September 28, 2007, 09:43 AM
Powder, bullet, primer/igniter. Pretty basic. If they knew it had powder in it then either just dump it out or assume it also has a bullet or ball shoved down the barrel holding the powder in. I question how they knew it had powder if the didn't know if it had a "live round" in it.

And those CO2 unloaders can still propel a projectile out the barrel at a pretty good rate. Saw a guy use one once at a range and it sent the ball clear down to the end of the indoor range with a good amount of impact when it hit. Made the other guy standing there who was actually thinking of catching the ball as it came out with his bare hand think twice about what he'd been thinking.

Also, as I've heard reference to it before, I believe there is a law on the NYC books against walking about with a mask on or other costume concealing one's identity should the police of prosecutors choose to use it for a particular situation.

2TransAms
September 28, 2007, 09:57 AM
I bet the Gun Guys will have a field day with this one. They sure have a thing for .50's.

30 cal slob
September 28, 2007, 10:17 AM
in NYC, long guns that are not on the proscribed list must be registered with NYPD post-haste.

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