[Slugless]

My friend has a old Model 10, bought it used a couple decades ago so as to have more oompf than the .22 revolver she used to drive off a couple of bad men with bad intentions.

Since it's still a backup gun, & it had a bent extractor rod, I took it to the 'smith & he checked it out & got it reliable again. Since I've been playing with it, I noticed the funny markings on it, something like "8 US Property ?HD". Serial # 13XXX.

It's obviously been dropped on some rocks a couple times & the trigger seems way too nice for GI issue.

When was this pistol made? Any issues about it once having belonged to a man named Sam?

[XavierBreath]

It sounds to me like she has a Smith & Wesson Victory Model M&P revolver (http://coolgunsite.com/pistols/victory_model_smith_and_wesson.htm). These were the wartime (WWII) equivalent of the Model 10, produced long before the Military and Police revolver was named the Model 10. The .38 Special Victory Model had a four inch barrel (a rare few were two inchers), a parkerized finish, a lanyard loop, and smooth walnut grips. The finish was a bit rougher than S&W's prior standards, to provide adequate production during wartime. Smith & Wesson also produced the 38/200 Victory Model in .38S&W with a five inch barrel. Those were shipped to Great Britian. Many made the trip back stateside being poorly converted to .38 Special to garner a better place in the US market.

There should be a V prefix to the serial number. The actual S&W serial number is found on the steel butt of the grip frame. I suspect the number you have provided is an assembly number from inside the yoke. Her gun is indeed GI issue, thus the US Property mark. The "8" is actually a bomb, a US ordnance mark. The ?HD is likely the acceptance mark of Ordnance officer Guy H. Drewry. From approximately V300000 to end of production in 1945, G.H.D was stamped on the left top strap. No issues about "Sam" having owned it........He ain't coming back for it.........We hope.

Victory Models were not supposed to be sold off as surplus after WWII, and many of them remained in military inventories up until at least 1991. I remember our pilots in VFA151 were issued Victory Models in the first Gulf War. They opted to privately order and carry Glocks instead. Thus, I know Victory Models were around at least that long. At any rate, many made it out into the surplus market over the years, regardless of contractual obligations with Smith & Wesson. Others were crushed (http://xavierthoughts.blogspot.com/2007/02/crushed-victory.html), torched or otherwise destroyed. For a long time the de-milled guns were available for $50 or so. Nobody really wanted them, but they were cheap, effective and reliable self defense weapons. Many were hardchromed, cut down and gussied up. Bubbaized. Ruined. Today, a 95% or better Victory Model will generally sell for $350-400. Expect those prices to continue to rise, perhaps rapidly. If your friend's gun has the original finish, grips, and is otherwise in collectible shape, you may want to advise her to preserve it. She holds history in her hands.

In the photo below, the third revolver down is a Victory Model. The rest are variations of the Model 10 line from 1899 to 1972.
http://www.bayourovers.com/MilitaryandPoliceAnthology.jpg

Here are my two Victory Models.
http://www.bayourovers.com/SandWVictoryModels.jpg

Crushed Victory Model
http://www.bayourovers.com/CrushedVictoryModel.jpg

[Slugless]

Xavier, thanks so much! I had wondered why it wasn't marked as a Model 10.

It's a 4", S/N S2676xx. The GHD stamp is on the top left strap 'though it's below the 300,000 mentioned in the linked article. .38 Special. Parkerized finish, original grips. Not the best collectible - it's got a very wide trigger front pinned to what seems to be the original case hardened trigger. Trigger is clean, crisp & light.

Besides the dings & bent extractor, you can see from the pics that the finish is in otherwise good condition.

I've only shot it once. Because the extractor system had bent & loosened up I retired it & bought the lady a SIG. Now that it's fixed it's a backup. I'll shoot it soon.

How would it take an occasional diet of +P's?

[XavierBreath]

Slugless,
Her revolver is obviously a U.S. Victory Model. There should be a V prefix to the serial number. Sometimes it is on the other side of the lanyard loop. The S portion of the serial indicates this revolver was produced with the updated hammerblock safety, designed and installed after a Victory Model was allegedly dropped and discharged, killing a sailor.

According to the SCS&W (http://xavierthoughts.blogspot.com/2006/12/supicas-third-edition-is-out.html), the GHD mark occurs from V85000 to end of production, not V300000 as I first quoted from Ty's article. I'd go with the SCS&W on that.

I have to inform you that your grips are not original to the revolver, although they are S&W grips. Correct Victory grips would be the smooth walnut ones as shown in my photos above. These sell on ebay for $25-35 a pair. Buy a set, and then resell the ones on your revolver. You will get the correct grips and break even at least.

The trigger probably feels so smooth because of the wide trigger shoe attached to it, although Victory triggers are nothing to sneeze at. The wide shoe simply provides a greater surface area for your finger, giving the impression of a lighter trigger. If you decide to go the original grip route, remove the trigger shoe as well.

Her revolver is in great shape. With the right grips and that trigger shoe tossed aside, it would present excellently. I would expect it to change hands for the $350-400 sum I quoted above if she were to sell it today with the changes I mentioned (assuming the reverse side is in like condition).

A Victory Model will handle occasional +P ammo if she wants to load the gun with it for self defense. Even so, I would not give it a steady diet of the +P stuff. The gun would likely do fine, but wear would accelerate. What you have is a historical, collectible firearm. I would recommend she replace the grips with originals, remove the trigger shoe and preserve the gun. In five years she may be very glad she did.

[Slugless]

Xavier,

I had seen the V but the lanyard loop had fallen over it while I was transcribing the rest of the S/N. (And I was trying to be more meticulous in describing it too....)

I'll get a pair of grips on ebay, good suggestion.

So it's a collectible. Hmmm. I figured the M&P was a beater model 10 and if I lost it in a burglary, no big deal except for the anger. I just cached my M66 at my property in Colorado. The closest thing in my collection here to the M&P is my dad's Colt Official Police revolver from when he was an Official Policeman (back in 1956 he got a summer job as cop, no lie).

Are you trying to give me a reason to buy a new revolver? :D

[XavierBreath]

Slugless,
There is always a reason to buy a "new to you" revolver! I'd recommend a used Model 10 as a back-up piece. Of course I would be willing to swap a whiplash action Go Get 'Em gun like the ones I mentioned in this thread (http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=296405) for your old clunker.......

Seriously, I'd preserve and occasionally shoot the Victory Model if I were you. Don't jump at the first set of Victory grips. Get a good pair for around $25 or so. They are out there.

[Dienekes]

Concur with the above. I have a soft spot for them as I carried one in the USAF in the mid-60s. I also picked one up from the estate of a very good friend. He got it back in those same years when they were widely available for $29.95 or so. It shot dead on with factory wadcutters and even in spite of being wartime production has a much better feel to it that current production.

Mine is not quite good enough to be collectable per se but a great little piece nonetheless. I have loaded it to the old standard RNL velocities of about 870 fps but wouldn't put anything heavier in it except for flaming emergencies. No doubt it would stand them, though.

[Slugless]

Xavier, I don't like bugging you about this but since you seem to have a passion for it....

http://cgi.ebay.com/WWII-US-NAVY-USMC-ISSUE-S-W-38-VICTORY-WALNUT-GRIPS_W0QQitemZ140163595321QQihZ004QQcategoryZ39425QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

These grips, does the word excellent mean what he thinks it means?

(If you haven't watched The Princess Bride, in plain english are these grips really in excellent condition?)

Thanks

[XavierBreath]

Slugless,
That is a decent set, showing a nick in the bottom and top of the left grip, and a couple of dents. With some oil they should polish up pretty well. They also have the screw......a good thing. I would say that your pistol desreves a little better set of grips, but these are correct. They would not be out of place on your gun, as the grips often became dinged up through constant storage and checking of the guns in armories. $25 is a good price.

To see the difference between "excellent" and "passable" grips, take a look at my two Victories above. Make sure the grip wear corresponds to the finish wear on your revolver and it will present at it's best. Perfect grips on a finish worn gun look very out of place. same goes for beater grips on a pristine gun. Only you can make this determination, really, since you hold the gun in your hands. I've actually beaten up grips to make them more appropriate for an older gun that I do not want to refinish......Yeah, I'm nuts....

If you don't yet know how to snipe an auction, read up on it and get them! If you pass, or are outbid, there will be more...........

FWIW, this forum is for just this type of communication.....bug away. Just don't expect me to answer the phone all peaches and cream....:uhoh: