[Felonious Monk]

I'm interested in a relatively inexpensive, VERY reliable mid-sized .380.
It'll live an easy life. Probably be a safe queen, get some range time, and maybe see some nightstand or "car gun" duty.

That said, both of these appear to be highly thought of.
If you could ONLY have one, which would you choose and why?
Does one have better... sights/safeties/durability/fit/finish/accuracy/action/capacity?

Anyone own both? If so, can you compare/contrast for me?


Thanks for your help!!!
Felonious

[Litlman]

If you check the search funtion, Stephen A Camp has some good range reports on Maks. and the Bersa Thunder. Very good reviews on both. You should be able to make a good comparison. Good luck!

[38snapcaps]

I had a Russian and an E. German Mak, both are gone. I currently have a Bersa Thunder .380 with no desire to go back. Here's why:

Maks are heavy and kind of big for their caliber.
Mak's recoil is snappy, hurts after half a box.
Mak's sights almost worthless.
Mak's mag release is that dumb european heel style.
Double action trigger is heavy. Single action is quite good tho.

Bersa is lighter and slightly smaller, better for carry.
Bersa recoil is light and you can painlessly enjoy practicing.
Bersa sights are adjustable with three white dots, easy to see.
Bersa mag release is where an America is used to, on the side of the grip.
Bersa trigger is smooth and just right in both modes, double or single.
Bersa accuracy is slightly better.

Both have decockers, both are totally dependable, ammo for both is inexpensive, and both look cool.

But, from my experience, when you factor in everything, the Bersa is easily the choice.

[Stephen A. Camp]

Hello. I voted "Mak" simply because one can get 9x18mm Mak ammo very inexpensively and the weight means nothing if a house gun or just being used at the range. Were I picking one of the two for daily carry, I'd have gone with the little Bersa.

Best.

[firestar]

I didn't vote because I don't own either gun. I do own a Bersa 23 which is like the .380 but in .22lr caliber and it has been a great little gun. If I were to choose one for carry, it would probably be the Bersa because of the lighter weight and lighter, smoother DA trigger that I have felt on the Bersas.

If your not going to CCW, I think either gun would work for you based on reliability that I have heard. Both guns seem to be very reliable and accurate. The Bersa does have much better sights which are windage adjustable and easier to see. I have never met someone who was unhappy with their Bersa but I have known people that were unhappy with their Makarov. That doesn't mean anything because it is such a small sample group but I'm sure you wouldn't regret the Bersa.

The Mak safety can fall out if you push it up rather than down, I think that might be a problem for a self defense gun. Also, gun tests did a review on the Mak and they had serious problems with the gun they tested.

I will probably get flamed for daring to speak anything but praise for the Mak but someone has to provide some context on these guns. The Maks have a cult following and I don't trust anyone that gets emotional about their gun. Often, when a gun or anything has a clut following, it is because the object in question has some good qualities but also some drawbacks, otherwise it wouldn't be a cult following, it would just be a following.:D

That being said, I have never owned one because I didn't like what I saw on the few that I handled that were for sale. I have only seen Russian Maks, I hear the Bulgarian is a little nicer. If Stephen A. Camp, votes for them over a Bersa, that trumps any opinions I may have, he knows more about guns than I do and he actually owns both guns. Heck, I may change my mind and get a Mak instead of a Bersa.:D

[Stephen A. Camp]

Hello, sir, and thank you for the kind words, but I'm no expert at anything.
I seem to recall that the Maks having problems with the safety levers coming loose when pushed upward a bit far might have a shallow detent in the slide for the spring-loaded plunger that holds the safety in the proper position. I could sure be wrong on that, but seem to recall folks speaking of it and the cure over at www.makarov.com .

I continue to shoot the Bersa and do think it's a peach of a three-eighty for folks wanting to carry a compact, light little gun that still has enough barrel length to get decent velocity. I share your appreciation for the better sights on the Bersa right out of the box.

Best.

[David4516]

I carry a Makarov and have been very happy with it. It is solid and reliable. I also like the caliber. 9mm Makarov is superior to .380

[Stephen A. Camp]

Hello. I've got an article on each at the link below if of interest:

http://www.hipowersandhandguns.com/OtherHandguns.htm

Best.

[Felonious Monk]

Thank you, Mr. Camp!

I will read both with great interest. I appreciate your input on this!

FM

[Berg01]

Neither; I'll take a CZ 83 in .380 ACP instead

[Stephen A. Camp]

Hello. In the thread from the link below, I posted an older range report done on the CZ-83. Though a bit thicker in the grip than the Mak or the Bersa, it is one heck of a .380 in my opinion.

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=3144&highlight=Range+Report

Best.

[Felonious Monk]

Hi, sir.

I'm not going to add it to the poll at this late stage, but do you feel the CZ-83 is WORTH the additional $100+ that you will pay for it, vs. either of the other two?

Thanks,
FM

[Stephen A. Camp]

Hello. Yes, I do. I like and respect all of them, but each has its particular weakness as well as its strong points. I like things that work. All three of these pistols do work in my view. The CZ is a very nice pistol and one I truly enjoy, but I think the Bersa's more to my liking for carrying. The CZ is a very fine pistol and I really like cocked and locked as my preference most of the time is for a single-action automatic, namely a Hi Power or 1911. The CZ is quality made and shoots very well, but its size precludes pocket carry so if I'm gonna tote a belt gun, it's usually one that is not much bigger if any, but more potent so to speak. The Makarov is a tough little shooter that I find comfortable and believe will last for lots of shooting of relatively inexpensive ammunition. The Bersa' s light and flat, but has enough barrel to keep decent velocities with the .380 round.

I like them all. I really don't think you'd go wrong with any of them. Again, they all have strong and weak points. What's right for me might not be quite the right decision for you.

Best.

[Spot77]

I voted Bersa only cuz' of the great reliability of mine.

I think it sounds much cooler though, to say to my non-gun owning friends, "Yeah, I've got a Russian Makarov".

The CZ is a great firearm, but if it's really going to get the light duty you expect, the extra $100 might better be spent on other fun stuff like 1,000 rounds to put through the Mak or BERSA. :D

[braindead0]

Having never owned a Bersa..but a long time owner of a Mak...(in .380) I like the Mak, it's easy to do a trigger job on it (and improve the DA/SA dramatically) and quite frankly after 10's of thousands of rounds I've had one that failed to cycle.. it was a reload I picked up at a gun show and was obviously under-powered.

[itgoesboom]

I'm voting for the Bersa (WOW two Bersa threads tonight), and that is what i purchased when i made the decision. Although i liked the feel of the Mak, and i think that there will be one in my future, it didn't meet my expectations for my first carry piece. I wasn't really comfortable with the mag release, the trigger wasn't as nice as the Bersa's, and the holster i planned on getting wasn't available for the Mak.

That said, i think either one would be a good house or truck pistol, and honestly, at some point i would like to leave a Mak in my truck.

I.G.B.

[denfoote]

Pistolet Makarova!! :D

[9x19]

I voted for the Bersa only because it has better issue sights than the Maks.

I put Novak rears and dove-tail fronts on my Maks, and think them much improved, but having that done by others is rather expensive.

[matsaleh]

I have a Bulgarian Mak. My first gun (still only one of two). Great shooter, very accurate. Kinda stiff trigger, but lots of info on Makarov.com and eslewhere on how to tune it up. It's really fun to work on, and quite a learning experience. When I took mine apart I was amazed to learn it had only 27 (or thereabouts) parts. Most parts have multiple functions. I learned a lot about semi-autos and hobby-level smithing doing that, which makes me a more educated consumer and shooter. This is good.

I have handled the Bersa .380 and it feels great in my hand and has a great trigger. Price is also right. I would not turn my nose up at it, but the 9x18 is just a little more gun, and its simplicity and ruggedness can't be beat.

Plus, there is something just really cool about using a former tool of Soviet oppression to defend my Constitutionally-guaranteed freedoms.

[BowStreetRunner]

Excerpt from soviet Makarov instruction pamphlet:
"Remove the safety,
At the deserter, shoot!"

just kidding
anyways i like having ex-commie guns........kinda like a souvenir of the cold war, which we won, cause, well, capitalism the better

:D

[firestar]

I am surprised at how many people voted for the Mak. Its not that I don't think the Mak is a good gun, its that I figuired that more people would have been exposed to the Bersa since it is in almost every gunshop I visit and can be found at every gunshow. Maks are a little harder to find around these parts for whatever reason.

I have heard a few bad things about both guns both the vast majority of reports have been very positive. Its too bad that the Bulg Mak isn't a C&R or I would buy one right now.

[David4516]

firestar, you should get a Mak, you won't be sorry. When I got my Mak I wasn't expecting much from such a "cheap" gun, but I was very pleasantly suprised! These pistols are amazingly dependable, and I think that is why there is such a cult following. I have never seen an autopistol that could match the reliablity of the Mak...

[gbelleh]

Bersa:
Better trigger,
better sights,
lighter weight.

Mak:
More powerful round,
Mak holds 1 more round,
probably more durable.

I have one of each and those are the main pros of each as I see them. Both are 100% reliable and very accurate.

[WhoKnowsWho]

My wife has the Bersa but we have yet to fire it. And I have a Mak

I think if I had to have one, I would get the Makarov while they are inexpensive and available, and get a Bersa Thunder later.

And you can fire cheap Wolf in the Makarov!

[Dorrin79]

I have a Bersa .380.

It's a great gun!!

The only advantages the Makarov has over it, in my opinion, are it's legendary reliability and the marginally better ballistics of the 9x18 Mak round.

Those advantages are offset by its weight, higher perceived recoil, and inferior sights.

If I were going to carry a .380, it would probably be the Bersa (still waiting to see how those nifty Kel-Tec P3AT's turn out)

[CZF]

Bersa vote. I hear nothing but good things about the gun on THR.

I actually checked one out today. Very nice pistol for $269.00

The browning type mag release is better for me. I liked the sights.

Still feeling that the CZ83 is yards ahead of both guns. I'd opt for
the Bersa for deep concealment.

Having only seen Russian MAks here in Idaho. And an assortment
of MAKS years ago in Herzogovina. I've always found them to be quite
crude in workmanship. Eric assures me that the Bulgie and E.German
MAKs are much nicer.

Given that most test guns for the 9mm MAK are longer than the .380
guns, and that you can purchase .380 +P ammunition. I don't feel
that the MAKAROV caliber is that much superior.


I don't think i'll be trading my hi-capacity '83 in soon:)

[Saber]

I voted for the bersa....if you decide to get one and it's as good as the one that I own then you will have done well. Mainly the choice has to be decided by you...handguns like all things in life, feel and handle differently for each person. What works for me, might not work for you and visa versa. It truly is a struggle to find the right handgun, maybe thats why some of us own so many before finding a something that we are truly happy with, and some like myself just like them all to the point that there is not just "one gun" its just the gun in our collection that we just happen to be carrying or shooting today. I hope you find something that will serve you well, and if not then maybe it will help you decide on what features you will look for in your next handgun purchase.

Best of Luck and take care.......

Saber

[Rick Blaine]

Felonious, my old friend,
Interesting that you are doing the same research that I am. I'm leaning toward the Mak because it appeals to my MacGrioghair-ish instincts. Seems like Maks have a following as loyal as the fierce Keltekians. Special greetings to a bro, and hoping for the best for his bro, from a bro. <><

[Felonious Monk]

Thanks you guys!!!

I think "WhoKnowsWho" got it right, when he suggested to buy the surplus stuff now, the Bersa's will be around for a lot longer.

So I'm inclined to WANT the Bersa more, but will BUY the Mak first.

Rick Blaine, a tip o' the Tam O'Shanter your way, bro! Thanks for the thoughts for my brother. He's doing better...but still needs an Epiphany (no, not a cheap Gibson). Maks'll make us bonny Scots good range guns, car guns, gun guns, and go right along with those Hi-Point Carbines!!!
Still owe you pics and an xls so I can get your input on that filthy luchre.

Flyer, as usual you're on the money.
Not at your usual haunt, but the current one:
Never have so many given so much shyte to one so undeserving of it as you.
Hope you get out of jail soon at the other crib! I need some covering fire.

Big respect and word up to all who have offered me their sage wisdom.
Thanks!
FMonk--Fig

[clubsoda22]

Go bersa. Better than the walther at a fraction of the price. As far as power goes, the fact that the 9x18 is slightly more powerful than the .380 is offset by a good +P 380. The Triton or CorBon 380+P give the same energy as the makarov loads.

Mak holds 1 more round

Not anymore. The new bersa magazines fit 9 where there used to be 7