[kestak]

Greetings,

I am new to reloading and I just realized something:

While I was reloading my 45acp with 5gr of #2 on Dillon 550B, I noticed sometimes (maybe 10 times) the primer was going into the primer pocket VERY easilly compared to normally.

The brass was about fired 4 times. I did not wise up and put aside those rounds. they are now part of my 1000 loaded and ready rounds. Do I have to be concerned to use those rounds one last time?

Thank you

[trueblue1776]

If the primer doesn't fall out, I would still use them for range loads. It doesn't necessarily mean anything bad, maybe the other 90% of primer pockets were dirty or burred, so it felt like a few were going in easy.

[The Bushmaster]

If you cleaned all the primer pockets before priming them and found a few that went in a bit easy it wouldn't hurt to apply a bit more pressure when seating them so as to cause the primer to spread a bit in the pocket. Other then that, use them for target practice and not reload them again (if you know which ones they are). If one of the primers were to come out while in the magazine it makes a might of a mess as the powder comes out into the gun works and the flame from a fired round 'can' touch off the loose powder. At the least, mixed with the gun oil make cleaning a bit more bothersome.

[Ghost Walker]

Yes, you do. In a revolver they might stop the cylinder. In a semi-auto the round might not fire the first time you chamber it. Neither consequence is the real issue, however. The real issue is that you should BACK DOWN your loads. AA #2 is a very fast powder! If you're getting blown out primer pockets by the 3rd or 4th reload, whatever you're shooting is way too hot.

[trueblue1776]

Ghost Walker, by my figures, 5.0gr isn't max for #2, even with a 230gr FMJ. I think you are incorrect.

[rcmodel]

5 grains of AA#2 is not nearly a maximum load with any bullet weight in the .45 ACP, so I imagine something else is going on here.

Have you checked & double checked the powder charge your Dillon is throwing on a good set of scales?

What brand of brass are you using?

Is it all the same brand & type?

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j219/rcmodel/KTOG/1224.gif
rcmodel

[strat81]

Was this mixed brass? In my experience with 9mm, certain brands have tighter pockets than others for a given number of firings. R-P and FC tend to be looser than WIN and S&B.

[Ghost Walker]

Come on! It has nothing to do with what is or is not listed as a, 'max load'. Charts don't translate well into real world experience. Assuming that he started with new brass, the OP is getting an unusual result.

You ALWAYS look to the charge first! 'Max load' and, 'right or wrong' have nothing to do with it. As I mentioned, AA #2 is a very fast powder!



Oh, yeah, two other things: What's the primer? It could be involved; and, isn't AA the powder used in Amerc ammo?

What is more, primarily because of experiences with AA #5 and Glock 40 caliber pistols I, also, don't use any AA powder at all; but, you can do whatever you want. ;)

[kestak]

Greetings,

It is 230gr FMJ bullets. The max load is 5.4, I am in .9-5.0 (depending of the imprecision). Also, it is mixed bullets and they have been shot about 4-5 times maximum.

I thumbled them with the primer and I did not clean the primer pocket.

Thank you for the help. I am less scared something bad could happen.

[Koos Custodiet]

Don't listen to the tables, listen to the gun. The tables only give you a starting point.

On my 336 I was 2 grains and 200fps over max, with no sign of pressure, no bulging, no difficulty to extract, no primer issues, and very good accuracy. Oh, and the bang makes people look up from the other side of the shooting points :-)

I backed down to a more sensible load, but still...

On my 357 revolver I started with 200+ Norma cases which the previous owner had reloaded a few times. This was about 14 years ago. I've been reloading them since. And I shoot silhouettes. Work it out yourself, those cases have been reloaded many times. Some primers go in easier than others. I'm not too worried. Not going to use it for carry ammo, but hey :-)

[Ghost Walker]

Originally posted by Kestak
It is 230gr FMJ bullets. The max load is 5.4, I am in .9-5.0 (depending of the imprecision). Also, it is mixed bullets and they have been shot about 4-5 times maximum.

I thumbled them with the primer and I did not clean the primer pocket. Thank you for the help. I am less scared something bad could happen.

:) I'm not; but, let's see? You're kind 'a new to this; aren't you! I don't have an AA chart on hand; so I'll take your word that 5.4 grains of AA #2 is the maximum charge. Your scale should be accurate to 1/10th grain of powder. (Most are.) It's not imperative to clean primer pockets on pistol, 'range ammo' after only 4 or 5 reloads.

You say, 'bullets'; but I think you mean cases. Because you admit to mixing different brass cartridge cases that have been shot about 4-5 times, it's difficult to know anything for certain; however, there ain't a lot of difference between 5.0 and 5.4 grains of powder. You're definitely in the range of needing to move up carefully by 1/10th of a grain at a time.

New reloaders always seem to head straight for the top of the chart; (I think it's the flash and the noise!) but if it were my pistol, or my hand, or my face, I'd back that load you're using down by 2/10th's of a grain and see what happens.

Old reloaders (like me) want the pistol to go, 'bang' with minimal muzzle lift and loss of sight picture. Nowadays, it's only my 44 magnum steel target loads that get cranked up to near the top of the chart. ;)

[kestak]

Greetings,

Ghost Walker, yes I am a green horn in reloading. VERY green. I began to reload 2 weeks ago. And yes, it is the cases that are of different brand and the bullets are Zero FMJ 230gr.

However, I asked (and I am still asking) a LOT of questions and I am very careful (I weight all the time the powder) and I check each fired case for pressure signs. I know, it is not perfect, but I really do my best.

The manual for the Accurate #2 230 FMJ says 4.6 to 5.4 (If my memory is exact, I do not have the book in front of me). I began with 4.7 grains because my scale is precise +-.1 grain (1/10th) and I did not want to take the risk to have a load to 4.5 when the book says 4.6. I wanted a load that is of the same power than my self-defense ammo, so if I have to defend myself, it will be at least the same recoil than I shoot.

Frankly, I am quite scared with the reloading stuff (and it is good I guess for my sake) and it takes me 2 hours to reload 100 cartridges on a Dillon 550B.

Thank you

[koja48]

Best to group your cases by brand/lot. Since you didn't clean the pockets, and if you HAVEN"T ever cleaned the pockets, we can rule out "over-zealous" re-forming/cleaning. Periodically, you will encounter batches of brass with looser-than-normal primer pockets. Make sure the primers are appropriately seated (I seat mine to 0.005") and fire away. Then pitch the loose ones in the trash (after squeezing the necks shut so a brass scrounger doesn't attempt to use them.). I would recommend reforming & cleaning the pockets in the future, however . . . better ensures a loud noise when you pull the trigger . . .

[FieroCDSP]

I've had a bit of confusion myself about the primer pockets loosening, but have figured a few things out.

Winchester primer pockets are cruddy after each firing. They are also out of spec (shallow), so a uniformer helps. My experience with 40 cal Win brass is that the head of the case is softer than say..CCI. Once uniformed, they will hold primers tight for a long time. Remingtons seem to loosen first, but I have a batch with 7-8 loads that will hold tight if I give it some extra oomph. I've had nothing but decent experience with the CCI brass. after 8-10 loads, they hold the primers fine and the headstamp is as clear as the day they went through the factory. Not exactly defining points, but you get the picture. Again, this is with 40cal, so your results may vary on the 45. Brass varies in quality and strength sometimes.

Reloading is as much art as science. Every gun is different. Every batch of powder is minutely different. You simply have to find what works for you. We can give advice (stay away from A-Merc) but your experience is what you're going to learn the most from.

[Ghost Walker]

Ghost Walker, yes I am a greenhorn in reloading. VERY green. I began to reload 2 weeks ago. And yes, it is the cases that are of different brand and the bullets are Zero FMJ 230gr.

However, I asked (and I am still asking) a LOT of questions and I am very careful (I weight all the time the powder) and I check each fired case for pressure signs. I know, it is not perfect, but I really do my best ... .

... Frankly, I am quite scared with the reloading stuff (and it is good I guess for my sake) and it takes me 2 hours to reload 100 cartridges on a Dillon 550B.

Thank you


Kestak

:) Reloading is very safe. If I were to give you just one piece of advice it would be to FORM THE RIGHT RELOADING HABITS, NOW! It is your habits that will ultimately keep you safe in the years ahead. I’ve been reloading for more than 35 years; and I’ve never had an overcharge – Not one! I, also, had the large advantage of having an older man spend more than two years teaching me how to do it too; consequently, I was able to miss a lot of what you’re going through now.

Soldier on! Reloading is addictive; the only thing I’ve ever found that comes close to it is computers. I used to think that reloading was a male dominated hobby; and, maybe, it is; but, I’ve met one woman who’s reloading talent and experience humbled me. There have been long period of time in my life when I’ve gone to the range primarily to acquire more brass to reload – Not to shoot! I’ve found reloading to be a perfect way to escape the, ‘cares of the world’.

Different primers have slightly different diameters. I only load CCI primers; but others tell me that Winchester primers tend to be the smallest, and Federal the largest. You don’t need to weigh every powder change. Use a powder measure; test the first half dozen throws, then be sure to keep it more than 1/3 full, and check it once every 25 rounds, or so.

The ideal powder is one that gives you the performance you’re looking for AND almost fills the case – right up to the bottom of the bullet. This means that a fast powder like AA#2 isn’t going to be your best choice for anything except lots and lots of economical range loads. (And, by staying away from fast powders you won’t have to worry about lighter target loads detonating on you when a light charge ignites front-to-back and literally explodes rather than fires.)

Here’s a powder burn rate chart. Find something you like in mid-range.

Powder Burn Rates (http://www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/Lobby/1221/powders.htm)

Anytime you find yourself loading within 5/10th of a grain at the top of the chart, watch out! In a lifetime of reloading I’ve only exceeded the charts with one powder for one particular bullet; AND, I carefully loaded up 1/10th grain at a time until I had the pistol cycling the way I wanted it to without any signs of overpressure.

Usually, I load to control recoil and reduce front sight dwell time. I’ve always felt that if you can't hit it rapidly 3 times in a row, then, whatever you’re shooting is the wrong load. Hence, I tend to stay away from 357 magnum ammunition, and handle 45 acp as easily as 9mm. Personally, I wouldn’t encourage you to load hot to practice; instead, I’d recommend that you load to hit! Knowing how to catch your front sight and control your muscle reflexes in order to pull the muzzle down, quickly, is worth a whole lot more than having a consistent POI.

I often practice with: CCI Blazer, Remington, ‘Green Box’, and Federal, ‘American Eagle’ ammo; but, I carry either Remington, ‘Golden Sabers’ or Speer, ‘Gold Dots’. Knowing how to control the pistol is more important than learning to live with either increased muzzle flash, or heavier recoil. (Both of these perceptions will change, anyway, in a real life gunfight.)

Neither do you need to overly concern yourself with hitting the exact same POI in practice as you would in a gunfight. If you’re typical, in a gunfight, you’ll tend to grab a larger sight picture than you usually do, hold lower than is customary, and look at more of the target when you fire, too.

After 50 years of doing this sort of thing, I’d say it’s much more useful to know your pistol than it is to know your bullet. Look at it this way: Hand someone like Jerry Miculek a different bullet; and, you won’t see any change in how he hits. It is, however, a matter of historical fact that if you hand Jerry a different handgun, then, his scores are going to differ. Like I said: First, get to know your gun; and everything else will follow!

Did you buy the Dillon reloading video that is offered with your press? I watch mine, at least, once a year. It’s a great reminder of how to do things right. Years ago I got to spend a couple of months with two of Dillon’s engineers. I learned a lot from them. One of the most important lessons was that you’re never going to be able to get completely away from a single stage press and an RCBS case prep station.

My own bench is setup with a progressive on the right, and a single stage on the left. The trimmer and case prep station go in the middle, clamped to the edge of the bench with, ‘C’ clamps as I need to use them. A single-throw, Uniflow powder measure with a micrometer adjustment is on a shelf immediately behind the single stage press.

Either use a powder checker die to guard against a bad charge or take a flashlight and rundown your reloading blocks looking for any difference in the height of the charge BEFORE you cap the cases with bullets.

The most dangerous reloading component you’ll use is the primers. They should always be loaded in controlled batches of no more than 100. (I know with a Dillon you can do more; but, it’s always made me nervous because I’ve known any number of reloaders with primer tube holes in their ceilings!) Always, always, always store primers in their original containers; and don’t leave them in the press when you’re not reloading. Finally, never place your face over the top of a primer tube at anytime – Never! I know, at least, one person who saved his face by keeping his habit of not putting his head anywhere near the top of the primer magazine.

If you use primer tubes these precautions are especially valid. If you use a primer magazine (Dillon) they’re, still, very good ideas. Thinking back over the years, it’s always been the progressive presses that have ignited their primers.

Always be careful with everything while you're reloading. Don't allow any distractions in your reloading area. The mistakes I caught myself making always came about at the moment of some sort of distraction. Be especially careful with the primers; and, you’ll be a much safer, happier, reloading press operator.

Lastly, remember what I told you about the importance of developing and maintaining safe reloading habits. NOW, you can thank me! ;)

[kestak]

Greetings,

Thank you very much for the advices. I knew the primers were dangerous, but reading that makes you think again about primers...hehehehe

I do not have a single stage press, but I just realize I used a lot my Dillon 550B in "single stage" meaning checking each stage carefully to understand and control the production. I just cranked it really once for the 45 ACP I just produced.

When I'll be done with the #2, I think I'll switch to Unique (I bought 8 pounds of each along one pound of H110 and Blue Dot for our 357 magnums) because it fills up more the case and it is a little bit slower. It will be a little bit more expansive, but I prefer to mitigate the risk.

Thank you