Little POed today.


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cpttango30
October 8, 2007, 05:27 PM
Ok about a month ago I contacted a gunsmith who's name i got from two different friends who siad he was top notch. It took a month to get ahold of him (Gun Smith is second job) no biggie. I finely get a hold of him and meet him at his shop with my rifle. To get a scope mounted. I needed a custom rear base made because the rifle is a 1917 Rem Enfield that has been milled on the rear of the reciever. The mounts it had were OLD Leupold Adjusto mounts. They were not tall enough to to accept a moden day 40mm obj. So I get gunsmith #1 to look at it and explaine what I am looking for. Either a new rear base to bring back of scope up (It was shooting 8 to 12" high @100 yds). He says na we will just turn the rear base and it will be ok. So he does this and in the process I did not notice he used blue lock tite on the base because the rear base only had one screw holding it in. I took it home and took it to the range bore sighted it and still 8-12" @100 yds. I can find no other gunsmith withen 1 hour drive. So I take it to big gun bo gunsmith (The last thing I wanted to do) I get told that it will take about 6 to 8 weeks. Oh well ok. It is three weeks later I get a call to come and pick it up. I get there and He puls the gun out of the rack and says here it is. I took one look at my blood begain to boil. From the looks of it they had to beat the rear base that gunsmith #1 glued on with lock tite. In the process the beat the heck out of my reciever I am talking 8 to 10 hammer dings in the reciever that they did not even try to touch. :cuss::fire:

Now this is not a super high dollar rifle but it has a Douglas stainless match grade barrel on a blue printed 1917 action all set in a custom made stock. Then I turn it over and find another ding in the bolt release.

I tell the gunsmith #2 that this is not acceptable and I will not pay for this job unless my rifle comes back to me in just as good or better condition. He then tells me that the gunsmith he sent it out to (Gunsmith #3) is some master smith and machinest that is very very good. I took one look at gunsmith #2 and said From the quality of this job I do not think he is all that good.

I have a bad feeling that gunsmith #3 is going to say it was that way when he got the rifle. But I know for sure that I do not go around beating on my firearms with a hammer.

Why can I not find a gunsmith worth his butt? :banghead:

I am thinking of starting a web site that is a list by state of gunsmiths with an area to rate them on quality and speed of their work. I would pay good money and wait for months to have some one do what I ask them to do the first time.

Sorry had to vent some of that off before i blew up something.

If you live in the Fredericksburg Virginia area and know of a good quality gunsmith please email (mailto: usarmy91tango@msn.com) me and let me know where he is and his name.

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RNB65
October 8, 2007, 05:39 PM
We live in a throw away society and gunsmithing has become a lost art. In fact, good craftsmanship across the board has become either lost or so expensive as to be out of reach for most people. It's not hard to find a bad or mediocre smith, but good ones are few and far between.

If you think good gunsmiths are hard to find, you should try looking for a good shotgun stockfitter.

The Annoyed Man
October 8, 2007, 06:01 PM
I wish I could help you. Locally, I use a guy in Euless, Texas, and he seems to know what he's doing. The downside is that you don't want to try to get a pistol worked on when he's overloaded with shotguns just before bird season opening. Took me 3 weeks to get an ambi safety installed on a 1911. That being said, the guy does outstanding work. He made the trigger on my Remington 700 like buttah.

I've actually thought of gunsmithing school as a start to a second career when I retire.

boatbod
October 8, 2007, 06:44 PM
Blue locktite releases pretty easily, and even if it is somewhat stubborn, you just heat it a little and it'll come undone. No excuse for beating anything like that.

wideym
October 8, 2007, 08:58 PM
A good gunsmith is hard to find nowadays. I have yet to find one under the age of 55. We have two master gunsmiths here in town. One charges high fees for any work and specializes in wildcat calibers. The other charges resonable fees and works mainly with pistols. The only problem with any good smith is they usually have 6 months of work ahead of your gun.

cpttango30
October 8, 2007, 09:12 PM
Gunsmith #1 Is a good smith. From what I have seen. He has made some highly accruate rifles. But if it is not a Remington 700, AR or 1911 He does not really want to mess with it. He is also a Class II manufacture and manufactures Suppressors. Something I would no doubt love to have for the 45 and the 223.

If I were a gunsmith and I had accidently damaged a firearm I am working on I would repair it to better than new with no questions asked. This would have taken just a little bit of time on his end to

Howard Roark
October 8, 2007, 10:06 PM
Did one of those gun plumbers happen to be a "master gunsmith" from Austria that does a lot of shotgun work?

browningguy
October 8, 2007, 10:59 PM
To be honest all the good gunsmiths seem to be backed up 6-12 months. If I find one that says he can work on one of my rifles/pistols right away there is probably a good reason for that.

I do know a good, cheap gunsmith for working guns (no fancy checkering or engraving), and he has built me a couple of rifles. But even though he knows me, if I manage to cut in line it's at least 3-6 months before he can fit me in on a simple job.

XLMiguel
October 8, 2007, 11:07 PM
Try Northern Virginia Gunworks in Woodbridge
703-644 6504
7518 K Fullerton Rd
Spingfield, VA 22153
It's a father/son business, the father was Pistolsmith of the Year in '95. When I lived in Falls Church I had them do work on several of my guns, craftsmanship lives . . .

jerkface11
October 8, 2007, 11:44 PM
I use Bullseye Precision in Forth Smith Arkansas. He's usually pretty backlogged but he does a great job.

wideym
October 9, 2007, 12:11 AM
jerkface11: I know Woody, he did work on my Colt1991, SP101, and others. One of the friendliest smiths I've ever known. He would probably get more work done if I would'nt hangout and talk so much.

tkendrick
October 9, 2007, 01:29 AM
I have had similar problems over the years. The smith I used here for years finally quit the business, so I'm on the look-out for another one.

Having a gun come back from a shop like that is aggravating.

The other problem is having a gunsmith say "You don't want that!", when I'm having a rifle built or some other special project. I built a 280 Rem on an old 1903A3 action once, when I took it in to get barreled, the smith kept trying to get me to do 7 mm STW instead. I finally asked him if he wanted me to take the job somewhere else.

More recently, I was talking with a local gunsmith about having a 17 Enfield set up for 264 WinMag. He proceeded to tell me what a poor choice that was, hard on barrels, etc. I picked the gun up and went out the door before he was through talking, needless to say I won't be going back.

I've delt with some good ones over the years, but a lot of them are like used car salesmen. I think they're more interested in what they want rather than listening to the customer.

cpttango30
October 9, 2007, 07:31 AM
Oh the one that made this rifle into a 308 WAS one hell of a gunsmith. He would listen to you then tell you what he thought about the project, points and tips. He would ask questions to understand why you wanted to make an 03a3 in to a super duper ultra skinny short mag. But if that is what you wanted he would turn out the best looking rifle he could. He is retired now and has Alzheimer's.

XLM thanks for the address and phone I will have to call them the next time.

wheelgunslinger
October 9, 2007, 07:53 AM
This is pretty endemic in any kind of artistic field where quality and honorable dealings go hand in hand.

My tattoo artist has a 6 month wait. My gunsmith has a 1 year wait. My machine shop for hot rod parts is always backlogged. etc.

I've never minded waiting, but always minded lousy work.

jerkface11
October 9, 2007, 08:31 AM
wideym I know it always takes me an hour just to pick up a gun. He MADE a scope mount for my CZ527 and it looks like it should have came on the gun.

Deanimator
October 9, 2007, 08:54 AM
If I were a gunsmith and I had accidently damaged a firearm I am working on I would repair it to better than new with no questions asked. This would have taken just a little bit of time on his end to

You'd hope so, but that's not always how it works out.

Last year I sent a 4" Model 29-2 to S&W to get the forcing cone re-cut and the barrel set back. It had spit from the day I'd bought it used in the '80s. I'd had to sell it to a friend 10 years ago when I was broke, and JUST got it back.

When I got the gun back, S&W had put a couple of deep cuts in the barrel. These weren't scratches in the finish, but actual cuts beneath the surface of the metal.

S&W just returned the gun without a word, pretending that nothing had happened. I called them, demanding to know how the damage had happened and why they hadn't said anything about it. They denied that they'd done it, but it was obvious that they had, backed up by numerous witnesses who'd seen the gun before it was sent to them.

To make a long story short, they said that they had no barrels, and kept insisting upon grinding on the cut barrel as a "fix", which I absolutely refused. I ended up strongarming them into installing a third party barrel that I bought. I had to buy two to get one good one. And since there were NO barrels available in as good a condition as the gun, I STILL ended up having to get the gun refinished, totally destroying its collector value. And I had to threaten to sue them to get them to refinish the gun. It took intervention by the head of their customer service department to get them to do the right thing. I wrote a letter to the president of S&W praising this guy to the heavens, since he was the ONLY one who gave a flying crap about customer service.

No, it's not just some guy working in his garage. It's also people who really ought to know better.

Ed Wagner
October 9, 2007, 09:07 AM
I ran my Gunsmithing shop for almost 20 years as a second business,my policy always if I cause damage to a clients gun, I would repair , replace, or have it done to the clients satifaction at MY expense, No Questions asked, The client had to be satisified with the end result. I closed the shop due to health problems, but ocassionaly I still dabble.

cpttango30
October 9, 2007, 09:51 AM
This seamed like a rather stright forward job to me.
1. Order Leupold gunmaker base
2. machine base to fit rifle and drill matching holes.
3. Blue base
4. Install base and bore sight.
5. Send it back to me and get paid.

I would hate to see this guys work on something more than just a base.

bogie
October 9, 2007, 09:56 AM
1) Ask online to find someone who does that sorta stuff.

2) You can hang out a sign that says "gunsmith" without knowing how to machine the base to get it to fit.

3) When you find someone who _does_ know how to do this sorta thing, he's probably backed up. Do not give him your rifle a month before deer season, and expect it back.

crebralfix
October 9, 2007, 11:56 AM
"Try Northern Virginia Gunworks in Woodbridge
703-644 6504
7518 K Fullerton Rd
Spingfield, VA 22153
It's a father/son business, the father was Pistolsmith of the Year in '95. When I lived in Falls Church I had them do work on several of my guns, craftsmanship lives . . ."

DO NOT USE THESE PEOPLE. THEY RIPPED ME OFF ON A TRIGGER JOB! They were supposedly SIG certified. Then they did the trigger job, my gun failed to fire frequently. I returned it to them, and they returned it to factory spec. They refused to return my money (nearly $200). On top of that, $40 of it was for "cleaning" (internal parts of the slide) and they charged me without authorization.

shotout
October 9, 2007, 02:52 PM
MidwayUSA (midwayusa.com) has a gunsmith locator search on the right side of the main page.

Cannot speak to its accuracy or completeness.

Just tried it out and it did not return my local gunsmith info, and he is the best in the area. But it might work better for you.

cpttango30
October 9, 2007, 05:32 PM
Yah tried the midwayusa thing and it did nothing for me. but turn out the two I have delt with smith #1 glued base to gun Smith #2 beat up gun that smith #1 glued on. So I am out of luck there.

cpttango30
October 9, 2007, 05:42 PM
Yah tried the midwayusa thing and it did nothing for me. but turn out the two I have delt with smith #1 glued base to gun Smith #2 beat up gun that smith #1 glued on. So I am out of luck there.

wideym
October 9, 2007, 11:25 PM
I had sportized a mauser years ago at Ft. Campbell and took it to a local gunsmith to have the reciever drilled and tapped for scope rings. When I got it back it had scope rings attached at no extra cost, so I'm thinking wow this is a great guy giving me a set of scope rings. Later when I decided to change the rings to match the scope there was three holes under one ring and two holes under the other. He used the rings to cover up his mistakes. When I complained he said it didn't affect the accuracy of the gun and would not refund or repair/replace the receiver.

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