[45R]

Is shooting commercial 180gr ammo bad for a M1A?

[Pilgrim]

The standard NATO load is built around a 147-148 grain bullet I believe.

Pilgrim

[hps1]

I would be a little leary of using factory 180 grain loads in an M1A. Not that the 180 grain bullet would hurt the rifle, but you do not know what powder is being used.

In an M1A (or Garand), it is not so much the heavy bullet, but the slow burning powder normally used in conjunction with the heavy bullets that is apt to do harm to your gas system. The Garand and M1A is designed to be used with a powder with a burn rate in the vecinity of 4895 in order to produce the desired port pressure . It is not the breech pressure that does the damage, but a high gas port pressure.

USGI M118 Match ammo for the M14 used a 173 grain bullet @ 2550 fps muzzle velocity. I'm sure that 7 grains more bullet weight would not hurt anything if proper powder is used. Pilgrim is correct that the standard ball ammo uses 147 gr. FMJ bullet.

You can, of course, close the gas valve and isolate the gas cylinder completely making your rifle a straight pull bolt action.....not sure how much force will be required to open the bolt since you don't have much of a "bolt" handle on the M1A.

Regards,
hps

[Cosmoline]

Mine (which I stupidly sold) loved 200 grain bullets. I think that's pretty rare in a battle rifle. Most are geared toward smaller ball ammo.

[ACP]

from a link on battlerifles.com:

"Use of bullets over 180 grains are not recommended as this can lead to bending of the operating rod or cracking of the receiver."

I believe GI spec. amo is 146-150 grs.; 168 grs. for match ammo (I am not including tracer or AP rounds weight).

I would say if you want to shoot 180 grs. stick to a bolt gun with hunting ammo. Otherwise 168-gr. match should do you just fine in an M1A or M14 type.

[Sven]

45R (why do I always want to call you Nelly?),

Lets learn reloading together. We'll need to to save cash for homes in the Bay Area, so that we can enjoy our 10-round mags and muzzle brakes.

[4v50 Gary]

What hps1 and ACP says. The M-14 was designed around a certain cartridge. Mess with the bullet and you may shorten the firearm. Keep it within mil-spec.

BTW Sven, was reading in a newspaper that a lot of agents are leaving the FBI. Can't afford to survive in the SF Bay Area on their Federal salary of $50-60k. $300k buys a small 2 br that is one hour commute from SF. Met one cute St. Dept. agent and she was telling me that SF is one of the least desirable work sites (b/c of housing costs).

[Nightcrawler]

I've heard this is a problem with the op-rod rifles, that they can't take anything more powerful than standard ball ammunition without risking damage to the weapon.

So the M1A can't handle bullet weights of more than 168 grains? I've heard the Garand can't do the 220 grain bullets, but I assumed that the 180 grainers would be fine. Seems a shame; half the advantage of a .30-06 rifle over a .308 one is the wider range of bullet weights and ammo types. Standard .30-06 ball doesn't perform any better than .308 ball.

I've been told (and someone posted a link to) a gas nut or something like that for the M1 Garand rifle that would allow it to fire the hot loads, including 220 grain bullets. Seems that someone would make a similar device for the M1A, but I don't know if anyone has.

At least it's not a problem with the FAL. I asked over at the FAL files; no one there reported any problems with commercial ammunition in any weight, though using the heavier bullets (with their reduced muzzle velocity) will change your point of impact.

[Art Eatman]

The key in all this is the pressure at the gas port. As long as the design pressure is not exceeded, it doesn't matter at all what weight of bullet is used.

If you stay with 4895, and don't load beyond the usual maximum chamber pressure, all should be well. You won't get the same velocity as you would with a slower-burning powder, but you won't hurt the op-rod.

For hunting, the few rounds shot with commercial ammo probably won't hurt anything. What, a few rounds to check point of impact, and then one or three shots on Bambis?

For hunting, I'd stay with 150-grain bullets, anyway. I've killed a bunch of deer with them. The biggest dressed out at 150 pounds. I got one-shot kills at 350 and 450 yards.

Art

[hps1]

The vented gas plug for Garand is at the following link. I just discovered that they also have a plug for the M1A:


http://www.adcofirearms.com/gasnuts.cfm

Regards,
hps

[uglymofo]

Derrick Martin over at Accuracy Speaks (http://www.accuracyspeaks.com/index.html) makes a variable vented gas plug for the M1A. He doesn't have a link for that specific item, but you can call and order it. I ran $25 or $30 as I recall. There's no 'hit or miss' (no pun intended) figuring out if your gas plug is suited for your load; you can experiment 'til you find the exact bleed-off vent to fit your (different) loads.

It's a gas plug that has been drilled and threaded; Allen set screws with different diameter holes can be exchanged to vary the amount of gas bled off. I've used 178's and driven them at 2650fps without any problems whatsoever, and that's a pretty stiff load. I'm on 1800 rounds now using this recipe.