Talk me out of a Sig P232!


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YosemiteSam357
October 29, 2007, 04:04 PM
I love the looks but don't need another gun.

The .380 round is more expensive than 9mm (where I shop), so it wouldn't be for economy. I don't put much stock in the .380 as a defensive round (no flames please; besides, I've got a carry gun in a different caliber). I owned a Mak in .380 so I know what the round feels like. I only want the P232 because it's pretty, and I've wanted one for a number of years.

It's not practical. I've spent too much money on guns this year. Just bought another one last week. But I can't. Stop. Thinking. About. It.

Argh.

Please tell me how horrible they are, and what a disservice I'd be doing to myself by buying one. I know they don't have a slide release. So you slice your finger every time you want to close the slide on an empty gun, right?

-- Sam

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Shipwreck
October 29, 2007, 04:14 PM
DON'T DO IT! NOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Did that work? :D

Go get a Bersa 380 for $200-$220 and save the rest of the cash!

HammerBite
October 29, 2007, 04:26 PM
How many guns do you have? How many can you carry and shoot at the same time? See, you're already screwed. Buy the gun, then you can think about something else.

One of the other things you can think about is getting a P-230 to go with the P-232 so you can while away the hours studying the subtle differences.

Then, of course, you will need a Mauser HSc, which was the source of the styling cues for the SIGs.

Then you'll have three .380 guns which look pretty much alike, so a Browning BDA-380 will be in order to break the monotony, and then . . .

Don't you miss the Mak?

Hokkmike
October 29, 2007, 04:34 PM
Use the money to buy ammo for the guns you have. If you must but the SIG, go ahead and send it to me. That will help stem your materialistic lust! It's OK, I would do it for anybody!

romma
October 29, 2007, 04:42 PM
Can't do it! But I might be able to talk you out of buying a PPK/S from experience!

MK11
October 29, 2007, 04:59 PM
The P230/P232 is the only Sig whose reliability can be questioned. Looks great, shoots great but it's also the only Sig I don't trust.

Marshall
October 29, 2007, 05:04 PM
Buy it. :)

UnTainted
October 29, 2007, 05:18 PM
I too would prefer a 9mm or more for defense,

EXCEPT -

the P232 is one of the most accurate pistols that I own. I love it, and with that accuracy (not just from the sights, but with quick pointability) I know I can achieve the placement neccessary to harness the existing effectiveness of the 380ACP.

If you think you should not get this gun, then you're totally wrong. You SHOULD. ;)

strat81
October 29, 2007, 05:22 PM
The P230/P232 is the only Sig whose reliability can be questioned. Looks great, shoots great but it's also the only Sig I don't trust.
I guess you've never heard of the Sig Mosquito. It's the Cadillac Cimarron of guns.

Rumble
October 29, 2007, 05:38 PM
I can't talk you out of it, but I will happily take it off your hands once you acquire it, so you don't have to be reminded of it ever again. :D


Edit: However, I will say that I have had issues with mine feeding Hydrashoks. Never a problem with FMJ, though.

nwilliams
October 29, 2007, 05:41 PM
Talk me out of a Sig P232!

No, I refuse to do so because I need someone to talk me out of one:p

Actually the only reason I don't have one is because my little Makarov suits me just fine and at a fraction of the cost. Plus I also like having the more powerful 9x18 round from a self defense standpoint.

jlbraun
October 29, 2007, 05:52 PM
P232's are notorious for slide bite, as well as being not all that reliable.

1BLINDREF
October 29, 2007, 05:57 PM
I guess you've never heard of the Sig Mosquito. It's the Cadillac Cimarron of guns.
That's funny - I completely forgot about the Cimarron. I wonder why you see them on the road anymore? :rolleyes:

Oh yeh - just go buy the damn thing, you only live once. I'm sure you work hard for a living and you deserve it. Think of it as an early christmas present to yourself. It'll beat the socks, tie, and underwear that you'll get.
If your gonna buy a .380, it may as well be a Sig.
Post a picture after you get it! :D

tydephan
October 29, 2007, 05:59 PM
You don't need a 232. They are ugly. ;)

http://i84.photobucket.com/albums/k40/tydephan/Sig_232_on_vest_1_640.jpg

http://i84.photobucket.com/albums/k40/tydephan/232CloseUp640.jpg

Marshall
October 29, 2007, 06:12 PM
Probably one of the top 3 best looking guns on the market.

Lonestar49
October 29, 2007, 06:21 PM
Quote: The P230/P232 is the only Sig whose reliability can be questioned. Looks great, shoots great but it's also the only Sig I don't trust.
-------------
...

Especially the P232 SL (stainless steel models).. They "demand" perfection, and are very unforgiving with powder residue build-up, mainly from the "blow-back-action" both, on the feed ramp and the interior walls of one's magazines.

In my experience, one must keep a round count, and when you have 200 rounds, get rdy, if you don't do a complete disassembly, Inspection, cleaning, because for my gun, at around the 230 round mark, I will get 1 jam per mag, and it is always after the 1st, 2nd, or 3rd shot, guaranteed, every magazine and round beyond that.

But, keeping her clean, she goes 100% and I'm glad I own one, but not for on the road, CCW, only around house for yardwork duty or here, at my desk, on top of my PC tower just under my desk..


Ls

YosemiteSam357
October 29, 2007, 06:31 PM
tydephan, I stumbled on that pic over the weekend while I was reading up on these puppies. That's a real nice one. I'm thinking two-tone, but would want dark wood grips, too. I can stain them myself. Hmm....

Sold the Mac in a housecleaning. "Didn't need" .380s then, either. Sold all my .40s then (including a 239, too...) because I "didn't need" them, either. Bought another .40 last week... The Mac was OK, a little rough, but never a hiccup.

If I wanted more power I'd look into a Walther P-5; Same basic shape, but a recoil operated 9mm. But I'm not looking for that power. Indeed, I probably won't carry the P232, it would just be another range gun. And the P232 looks sooo much better, without that ugly bulging trigger guard.

Thanks a lot for the responses.

BTW, speaking of bombs, anyone remember the Cadillac "8-6-4" engine? :D The one with the ECM that would rat you out to the dealer for going over 55mph?

-- Sam

gotarheels03
October 29, 2007, 06:38 PM
why not a P225 instead?

tydephan
October 29, 2007, 06:40 PM
Yosemite,

I can honestly say that out of the guns I've bought online, that 232 was the only one I stalked.

Frandy was the previous owner of that gun and I always marveled at how nice the Nill grips looked on the stainless 232. I had a 230 previously, but in a fit of stupidity traded it.

So when Frandy put that 232 up for sale in the Trading Post, I was all over it.

I'm looking for a blued version in good shape that I can put Nill grips on to complete the set. :D

Lonestar49
October 29, 2007, 06:46 PM
...

Take a warm look at a Springfield EMP 1911 9mm 9+1 SAO vs the P 232's 380 7+1 DA/SA and have the best of both worlds, IMHO.

I did, and have NO regrets, as it is just as small, packs a larger punch, is far more forgiving not having a "blow-back-action" and has gone 550 rounds so far without any hiccups, just 100% and, IMO, is far more accurate at close, or at range, 63ft, and with fast follow-up shots that are accurate and tight.

Here's a pic comparing the 2..


Ls

http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/cc306/Lonestar49/Picture150.jpg

YosemiteSam357
October 29, 2007, 07:45 PM
Guys... What does a 1911 or a P225 have to do with a P232, when I have specifically said it's the styling of the P232 that appeals to me? Neither of those guns have a thing to do with the one I was asking about, mechanically, by caliber, or in the looks dept. I'm really happy you like your guns, but simply throwing out random suggestions was not the goal here. Heck, by that reasoning I might as well check out a Glock, too!

That said, it's likely the (clearly, conspiratorial [that's sarcasm]) price of ammo may do me in where reason does not: My local shop gets not "just a little" more, but 50% more for .380 than 9mm. At $14/50 it's the same price as my .40 S&W practice ammo. A heck of an expensive plinker. When I gave up .380s earlier it was down around $7/box.

-- Sam

Lonestar49
October 29, 2007, 08:15 PM
YS, you asked for pro's and con's.. IF the con's outweighed the pro's in your book after it's all said and done, the options are for you, on the table to use or not..

I'm just telling ya that for "the money" even IF it was just for the range, knowing what I went thru, and have, I would NOT recommend a P 232 380 caliber vs a more powerful, same size, 9mm, especially the 380's dirty blow-back- action..

I offered my opinion based on experience, not lack of cleaning, and just put an option for ya on the table that IMHO, is "better", all the way around.

Simple, take it for whatever it's worth, and best of luck.

And, if you would like to buy one, LNIB, broken in, 1325 rounds, PM me. Can include 3 holsters, 1 leather OWB, 1 ankle, 2 IWB clip ons, 450 rounds of new Winchester ammo, and 40 rounds of Federal Premium Hydra Shok 90gr JHP and one extra mag with belt-on mag holder.


Ls

YosemiteSam357
October 29, 2007, 08:34 PM
Well thanks, but I already have 9mm, .40, .38, .357, .44. .45 (Colt and ACP), .22, .223, .243, .30-30, and 12 gauge if I were looking for alternate calibers. :D

I tried to send you a PM, but was told you either have it disabled or it is not allowed for some reason. Please drop me an email or PM with your email and I'll get back to you. Thanks for the offer!

-- Sam

Lonestar49
October 29, 2007, 08:44 PM
Quote: Please tell me how horrible they are, and what a disservice I'd be doing to myself by buying one. I know they don't have a slide release. So you slice your finger every time you want to close the slide on an empty gun, right?
---------------
...

First, lol, they're not horrible, and NO, you will not, or do not, slice you finger every-time you want to close the slide on an empty gun, you just simply activate the mag thumb release, lower the mag just a tad and pull back the slide and let her go, then use the decocker and you got it.. :) Fast and Easy.

On the PM, just before your hit the "submit button" scroll down until you see the empty box that reads, "send even if person is not on your buddy list" put a check mark in that empty box with a clk of the mouse, and then go back up and hit submit, and I will get your PM.. lol, that took me a few times to figure out..


Ls

Pigspitter
October 29, 2007, 08:46 PM
someone in our paper was selling one nib for $350

YosemiteSam357
October 29, 2007, 09:33 PM
On the PM, just before your hit the "submit button" scroll down until you see the empty box that reads, "send even if person is not on your buddy list" put a check mark in that empty box with a clk of the mouse, and then go back up and hit submit, and I will get your PM.. lol, that took me a few times to figure out..I must have a weird, different interface. All I can do is click on your username, and have the Send PM link; no checkboxes, no scrollbars, no submit button. It goes right to the error page. Is your inbox full? Really, if you can PM or email me I won't abuse the address.

someone in our paper was selling one nib for $350Thanks! I saw a used one on GB or GA for that price, too.

-- Sam

antsi
October 29, 2007, 09:46 PM
I got a 232 SL about 2 months ago and love it.

I agree with some of what has been said and disagree with others:

Stainless: I definitely prefer the stainless - the aluminum frame ones are lighter, but have an unpleasant recoil feel. Stainless ones shoot sweet.

Carry: I usually carry something bigger, but I do have some occasions where the 232 is the right thing to carry. People can put up side-by-side pictures and measurements all they want, but I find the 232 "carries smaller" than it actually is because the shape is conducive to carry. I have carried other guns about the same dimensions that were much more annoying/jutting/gouging to carry. The 232 just melts into you - which is the main reason I bought it.

Reliability: some folks have had reliability problems with various JHPs - and my experience agrees with this. However the gun has been 100% reliable with FMJ. With a marginal caliber, I think it makes more sense to carry FMJ anyhow. I know of other folks who have sent their 232s to SIG for polishing and tweaking and they were reliable after "the treatment." SIG has generally done this work for free. If you are buying just for a range fun gun, this shouldn't be a deal killer either way.

Ammo Cost: It doesn't make sense comparing any autopistol caliber to 9mm. Other than .22 LR, they are all more expensive than 9mm. In local gun stores, the price premium is exaggerated on oddball calibers. If you are willing to buy online in bulk, the difference is much less. Still more expensive than 9mm, but the difference is much less. I got a good deal on some Federal American Eagle .380 at natchezss.com - but there are plenty of other options out there.

Slide Bite: What slide bite? I have not had this problem at all. Hand size/shape may be the difference. I have long fingers but not chunky. If you have big meaty paws maybe this will be an issue for you, but it wasn't for me.

varoadking
October 29, 2007, 09:54 PM
Pretty guns, but not a long term hold. It will either be relegated to the safe or sold. IMHO, of course...but based on personal experience...

YosemiteSam357
October 29, 2007, 11:53 PM
Lonestar49I can't even reply to your PMs. I get the error: "Lonestar49 has chosen not to receive private messages or may not be allowed to receive private messages. Therefore you may not send your message to him/her."

This was my reply to your PM:
I don't know what's going on, but I don't have any option to send to non-buddies. (Nor do I have that option enabled in my profile.) I have an Additional Options box with "Read Request, Save Copy", etc, but no checkbox for buddies. I have added you to my buddy list, but that doesn't fix it. I just logged on using IE and that was no different. I'm hoping this reply goes through. [edit: It didn't]

I'm really just interested in the gun, but would take the ammo and mag, might consider one of the IWB clip ons (leather?), maybe the mag pouch. Let me know what you can do. I'm in western Oregon.Please send me an email if you would like to discuss this further. If you must, go ahead and send the info via PM, because apparently you can send them but not receive them. Thanks!

-- Sam

YosemiteSam357
October 30, 2007, 01:38 AM
It doesn't make sense comparing any autopistol caliber to 9mm. Other than .22 LR, they are all more expensive than 9mm.Good point. Thanks!

However, when including shipping, I haven't found mail order to be that great a deal over what I can buy locally, in most cases. Maybe if I bought 1K+ rounds, but that presents its own problems.

I do reload, but only for .45 Colt, .44 mag, and .243 rifle at this time.

It will either be relegated to the safe or sold.That pretty much sums up my experience with the Mak. The P232 may be pretty enough to offset the other issues (at least for a time).

And if I sell it some day? At least I got to own one for a while.

Maybe. :cool:

-- Sam

YosemiteSam357
October 30, 2007, 02:04 AM
Me again.

Lonestar49, got your PM; Same as before.

-- Sam

10-Ring
October 30, 2007, 02:21 AM
For a 380, it's a bit big & they kinda bite back when you shoot them :rolleyes: If you want a small Sig, look at the P239 SAS :cool:

sojournerhome
October 30, 2007, 02:33 AM
I looked at a 232 the other day. It fit like a glove. But,
I had to put it back. They are pretty though.

YosemiteSam357
October 30, 2007, 01:31 PM
I looked at a 232 the other day. It fit like a glove. But,
I had to put it back. They are pretty though.Care to say why?

-- Sam

usp9
October 30, 2007, 05:25 PM
You'll like the P232. It is a great gun and one every collection should have. Original grips are good, Hogue better yet and Nill makes the gun a work of art. The easiest gun to carry I have...light, slim, compact and holsters are available from many makers.

Corporal K
October 30, 2007, 07:09 PM
If you can afford it, get it. If you can't, then don't.

CleverNickname
October 30, 2007, 07:28 PM
There was a new shooter at my IDPA match yesterday that was shooting a P232. I shot the gun after the match and I wasn't very impressed with it. The thing I hated most was the heel magazine release.

If you want a small carry gun to there's plenty of other, better guns out there.

YosemiteSam357
October 31, 2007, 01:02 PM
FYI (http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=313143), I've decided to take the plunge.

Lonestar49, still haven't heard from you...

-- Sam

Lonestar49
October 31, 2007, 10:00 PM
...

hey Sam, just found your PM, sorry for the short delay, PM on the way..


Ls

brashboy
October 31, 2007, 11:23 PM
Try to shoot one first, a lot of people get slide bite, as noted above.

Lonestar, you take the best pics.

highrider
November 1, 2007, 12:17 AM
The P230/P232 is the only Sig whose reliability can be questioned. Looks great, shoots great but it's also the only Sig I don't trust.

Can't agree. I've had one for about four years and probably around 900 - 1,000 through it without one hiccup. I haven't heard many complaints about reliability. Go for it. It might have a little more kick than you expect from a .380, but is is fun to shoot and surprisingly accurate. Go for it!

YosemiteSam357
November 1, 2007, 12:25 AM
I got to hold one today but not shoot it. I can see how the slide bite could happen, maybe too easily. Strangely, it felt like I could get a better, less-likely-to-bite grip with the stock plastic grips than with the Hogue that was on the SSS model.

Still looking...

-- Sam

grimjaw
November 1, 2007, 12:29 AM
I'm going to be the whipping boy of this thread, but . . .

. . . a Makarov PM is only a set of Novaks away from being a better gun that the SIG 230/232.

Durable, reliable, simple, accurate, less than half the price, equal in caliber (and can be rebarreled to .380), chrome bore.

The only thing I can think of better on the SIG is that it's probably a better pointer, and *maybe* the trigger.

I hope I was convincing enough for you. :p

jm

highrider
November 1, 2007, 12:30 AM
I already have 9mm, .40, .38, .357, .44. .45 (Colt and ACP), .22, .223, .243, .30-30, and 12 gauge

Then you absolutely have to buy a 232! ;)

RevolvingCylinder
November 1, 2007, 12:53 AM
That's funny - I completely forgot about the Cimarron. I wonder why you see them on the road anymore?
I've actually seen a couple on the road lately.

I'd be hard pressed to choose between the Sig 232 and the Walther PPK/s.

Baba Louie
November 1, 2007, 08:51 AM
The 230 and 232 are works of art that go bang. Excellent lines, very attractive. Very. Feels good in the hand with slimmer grips (I find the factory grips feel kind of chunky and thick).

As for shooting them, you know the issues. Accurate, blowback, might bite, pricey to feed.

While they do come from good family lines, they are the attractive "problem child" of the family (in a way). But they do need good homes. ;)

I'd love to find a P-232 in .32acp

YosemiteSam357
November 1, 2007, 01:15 PM
While they do come from good family lines, they are the attractive "problem child" of the family (in a way). But they do need good homes.Ah, the beautiful yet impetuous daughter, perhaps?

Maybe it's time to open Yosemite Sam's Home for Wayward Girls. :)

re: highrider - I forgot .308. :D

-- Sam

Captain Bligh
November 4, 2007, 12:13 AM
I always trash-talk the p232 and would be remiss if I let this post pass without commenting.

They are nice guns...and I don't like them. Nice-looking, reliable, and accurate.

To avoid slide bite, I take an unnaturally low grip that is uncomfortable. I don't like the trigger itself or the DA/SA transition. YMMV

Ohen Cepel
November 4, 2007, 12:17 AM
I have a stainless 230 that I wanted for years. Now, after shooting it I can't wait to get rid of it!

Even though I love the looks of it I can't shoot it without it biting the he!! out of my hand! Love it but won't keep it.

If you have big hands it may also be an issue for you.

Surefire
November 4, 2007, 12:27 AM
Sig P232: IMO a beautiful looking gun in a marginally effective chambering. Only two reasons NOT to buy it:

1. Its a .380

2. If you insist on .380, IMO the Beretta Cheetah is a more reliable option.

Having said this, it IS a fine pistol. If styling is the reason you want the P232, BUY IT!

That is why I bought my Cheetah (for looks), and I don't regret it at all. Its even turned out to be a great shooter (100 percent reliable so far with surprisingly great accuracy).

YosemiteSam357
November 4, 2007, 01:47 PM
Picked mine up yesterday, and ran 50 rounds through it. I love it! I got the blued, alloy-framed model, and have already ordered a set of wood grips for it. It's exceptionally accurate for a gun with such a short sight radius.

My hands are weird - long fingers but a narrow palm. I can see how slide bite could be really bad for some people, but I lucked out. I did get a small bite inserting a mag, but learned quickly to keep my pinkie out of the way.

Thanks to all who responded.

. . . a Makarov PM is only a set of Novaks away from being a better gun that the SIG 230/232.
Actually... No it's not. If you'll read back to the original post you'll see I had one of those. It wasn't a bad gun, but somewhat crude (mine was a Bulgarian), fat, and the method of takedown and reassembly always made me feel like I was going scratch the crap out of the gun, or break something. And the trigger was nothing like the Sig trigger. It was, however, less than 1/2 the cost of the Sig.

The Cheetah was a late entry into the race, and indeed, is a very nice gun. Years ago I decided I liked the way that one fit my hand, and I do like the open slide/92F look. Some day I might look into either one of the .380s (now that I'm stocking that caliber again... :)) or an 87F, which is the .22 version of the same gun. However, the idea of a $500-600 .22 that isn't known to be a tack driver may dissuade me. (I'm not saying the Cheetah isn't accurate, just that if I were going to spend that kind of scratch on another .22 it darn well better be a target-grade gun.)

-- Sam

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