Savage 11/111 or Mossberg 100 ATR


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GRB
November 6, 2007, 02:50 PM
I have been hemming and hawing about buying a new gun for several months now, and as usual I am the great procrastinator; and besides that I have not had the cash. I still do not have the cash, but we paid off our credit card bills in full last month, so maybe she who must be adored will let me put a rifle on plastic. Dick's Sporting goods has a sale on Savage 11/111 rifle combos, the rifle with a scope for about $320; and Walmart has a sale on Mossberg 100 ATRs with a scope for about $315. I am thinking of really trying to get one of these before the end of the week. I have heard good and bad about both, mostly good about both. What I am asking is if you would vote on the poll on my blog at: http://ballseyesboomers.blogspot.com/, it is located at the top of the right sidebar of my blog. Of course if you want leave your reasoning for your choice, please do that here in this thread. I am interested in hearing from as many people as possible on this over the next few days.

By the way, I am kind of leaning toward the Savage in 30/06 right now.

All the best.
Glenn B

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Savage3006
November 6, 2007, 02:53 PM
I have the Savage 111 in 30-06. The rifle shoots well. I bought the package but replaced the scope with a Nikon.

skinewmexico
November 6, 2007, 03:25 PM
I'd get the Savage, just because I could always replace the barrel if I wanted in 15 minutes.

Savage3006
November 6, 2007, 03:30 PM
Can you really replace the barrel that easily. I have been told by a gunsmith that you have to return it to the manufacturer. When it is time to replace the barrel, you might as well replace the whole thing.

One thing I would like to do is to remove the barrel just to clean the chamber. It is really a pain to do.

Detritus
November 6, 2007, 03:57 PM
Can you really replace the barrel that easily. I have been told by a gunsmith that you have to return it to the manufacturer. When it is time to replace the barrel, you might as well replace the whole thing.

One thing I would like to do is to remove the barrel just to clean the chamber. It is really a pain to do.

first off Yes, with a barrel nut wrench (from SharpShooter Supply (http://www.sharpshootersupply.com/) under accessories), and the proper head space guage, and practice, you can swap barrels on a savage in under 20 mins.

this is b/c unlike pretty much all other major makes, headspace on a savage is set by screwing the barrel in and tightening the nut (i won't go into the details, but it's fairly simple). Instead of the traditional way (which your gunsmith was thinking of talkng about) of screwing a Short-chambered barrel into the action then using a finishing reamer to headspace it.

now that said you should NOT remove the barrel from the action just to clean the barrel!! :eek: that opens you up to an untold amount of possible "oops" mistakes. it's a bolt action take the bolt out and clean from the breach.

foghornl
November 6, 2007, 04:25 PM
I have the Mossberg ATR-100 in .30-06 Holds under 2"@100yds with most inexpensive commercial SP 'hunting ammo' (Rem Core-Lokt & PMP Pro-Amm)

Shooting Budd that is much better than me got a smidge under 0.7"@100Yds with Fed Gold MEdal Match, 5 shots.

Nothign wrong with the Savage/Stevens lines; I just got the Mossy at a better deal. Mossy also has some 'combos' with the scope pre-installed, but I don't know what brand/model of scope.

Ash
November 6, 2007, 04:44 PM
You can replace the Mossberg barrel in the same way as the Savage, except you have to use a friction wrench to remove the smooth nut...

That said, I would probably get the Savage (as big a Mossberg fan as I am). You can't go wrong with the ATR, though.

Ash

ReadyontheRight
November 6, 2007, 04:48 PM
I saw that deal at Dick's Sporting Goods too. Does the Savage 111 have the Accutrigger?

Either way, I'd lean toward the Savage. Besides the ability to change the barrel, there are many more aftermarket parts out there for Savages.

.45Guy
November 6, 2007, 05:17 PM
I was just at Dunhams looking at "Vintage Rifles." After glancing at the beat to hell "unissued" Michell's Mausers M48's, I noticed the 111 combos are on sale for $389.

Smitty in CT
November 6, 2007, 05:25 PM
I have a 100ATR in .270, using 130gr Federal Nosler Ballistic tips I can get consistant sub-1" groups @ 100yards...

There's nothing wrong with the Savage either though, basically, these are very similar rifles, see if you can shoulder them both and see which comes up to your eye better...

Detritus
November 6, 2007, 05:43 PM
Does the Savage 111 have the Accutrigger

at this point all of the Savage rifles have the accu-trigger, while the lower priced "Stevens" marked guns (the ones with gray stocks) have the old style trigger.

skinewmexico
November 6, 2007, 05:49 PM
I have been told by a gunsmith that you have to return it to the manufacturer.

I'd find another gunsmith.

GRB
November 6, 2007, 06:00 PM
How are the triggers between the Mossberg and the savage brands. Is the Accu-trigger all that much better because it is adjustable?

Ash
November 6, 2007, 09:17 PM
Well, the Mossberg trigger is largely the Howa 1500/Weatherby Vanguard trigger.

Ash

jpwilly
November 6, 2007, 09:29 PM
My Mossberg ATR 30-06 is MOA with the first box of ammo I tried Federal Power Shok 150gr SP! Here's a link to my range report (http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=298935&highlight=mossberg+atr)

http://i124.photobucket.com/albums/p38/jpwilly/Picture005-1.jpg

MAKster
November 7, 2007, 03:21 PM
The Savage combo deal at Dicks for $320 is not an accu-trigger. It also comes with a detachable magazine.

Detritus
November 7, 2007, 04:59 PM
The Savage combo deal at Dicks for $320 is not an accu-trigger. It also comes with a detachable magazine.

then I'd be asking how much they'd take off of it since it is obviously NOT a savage made in the past 3 or so years...:evil:

DBM + pre-Accutrigger = lower the price jack

ok let's "do the algebra" so to speak.

Savage DBMs until the latest interation (the new centerfeed DBM brought out last year on some models) were frankly crap, IIRC they had a tendency to get loose in the magwell over time/use, this would cause them to not feed correctly, and in some cases the mag would drop out.

the only savage product still using the older trigger design is the Stevens 200 series, they don't HAVE a DBM. nor do they currently come as a package gun

therefore any package gun with the old trigger and a DBM is going to have the OLD DBM, which is a heartburn inducer. not only that, but it is also at least 2-3 years old.

GRB
November 7, 2007, 07:04 PM
The Savage rifles at Dick's at this time in my area are Sabage 11/11 series rifles. They all have the Accu-Trigger as far as I am aware; but if I decide on one of them, I will check to make sure.

All the best,
GB

GRB
November 7, 2007, 07:07 PM
Thanks for the range report on the Mossberg. You guys are maijng this a hard decision, but ultimately it depends on funds which I am hoping I can squeeze out of my checking account.

Ash
November 7, 2007, 08:28 PM
I have to disagree about the detachable magazine on Savages. I had a 111 with a detachable magazine, quite a nice rifle (back when the 111 was the deluxe model). The mag release was a button on the side. I cannot see how they would work loose, but mine was always tight and was quite old. It never fed badly. I sold it because it was surplus to my other rifles, all Mossberg 800's and 810's. It was the mag design used for 40 years.

Now, I cannot comment on more recent incarnations of that design, only mine.

Ash

Ringer
November 7, 2007, 09:25 PM
I thought about one of these but I don't like the synthetic stock. Just to clarify on the AccuTrigger (from the Savage website): "Package Series
Model 111FCXP3 (AccuTrigger not available on this model)".

The one in the Dunhams Add (http://savagearms.com/111fcxp3.htm), Dicks doesn't specify model but probably the same. Also the Dunhams add lists the original price as $535 but the MSRP on the Savage website is $499 :scrutiny: ?

GRB
November 8, 2007, 11:01 AM
Yes I am hoping it is the Model 11FXP3 or 11FXP3 which are both also package models and come with the AccuTriger. I am going to try to stop by the store tomorrow to check it out. If it does not have the Accutrigger, I am more partial to the Mossberg. That C in the model designation you gave to me must mean cheap, since they leave out the accutriger on that model.

Thanks.

All the best,
GB

Detritus
November 8, 2007, 04:06 PM
That C in the model designation you gave to me must mean cheap, since they leave out the accutriger on that model.


close, means "Clip" as in Detatchable magazine.

goalie
November 8, 2007, 08:25 PM
I would consider what you are going to use the rifle for. For a purely hunting rifle, the Mossberg ATR100 comes with a nice, crisp trigger and has a blind magazine that is foolproof in the field.

I have one in .270 that shoots Fusion 130 grain ammo into 1.5" groups at 100 yards, and handloads into .75-1.25" 5-shot groups at 100 yards, depending on load and bullet weight.

My Mossy cost me 244 bucks, and it includes bases pre-installed. It has killed three deer with three shots over the last few seasons, including a 5x4 buck that weighed more than me this year. The best part is that I am not fretting over the finish when I drag it up behind me into my tree stand like I would a "pretty" rifle.

That said, I LOVE my Savage .308. It has a great trigger for target work, and is capable of shooting 1" groups off the bench all day with most ammo.

So, in the end, if it's gonna be a tool for hunting, I would go with the Mossberg. The safety is positive, quiet, and well-positioned for hunting. The blind magazine is foolproof. It is more than accurate enough for large-game at 300 yards and in, and the trigger, while not as nice as the accutrigger, is more hunter-friendly when wearing gloves (my opinion). You can also spend the money you saved on buying a base on a better set of rings or a better scope.

If it's a bench queen, go with the Savage. The accutrigger shines at target work, and it is likely going to be a little more accurate from the stuff I've seen and heard.

Either way, you won't go wrong.

GRB
November 9, 2007, 11:22 AM
Well I worked late last night and did not get a chance to go to Dick's. That will have to be tonight.

One good thing, I did find the cash hand, well almost all of it anyhow. I had a stash of $300, $150 of that which I had forgotten about, what a nice surprise.

Tonight or tomorow I'll probably be picking up one of these. Thanks for all the advice, and I'll keep you all posted about it.

All the best,
Glenn B

GRB
November 11, 2007, 04:40 PM
Well, no rifle bought this weekend. I did go to Dick's and to Sports Authority but struck out at each. Walmart was not worth going to after speaking to them on the phone, they did not have what I wanted. I would have had to have driven over 40 miles, passing 7 closer Walmarts, in order to get to the closest one on Long Island where I live in order to get to one that sold guns!. More on this at: A Firearms Shopping Odyssey (http://ballseyesboomers.blogspot.com/2007/11/firearms-shopping-odyssey.html)

Hopefully a local gun shop will have what I want at a decent price, or when I go hunting I can take a side trip to Cabelas in PA. Since I have it, I hope the cash does not burn a hole in my pocket before then.


All the best,
Glenn B

skinewmexico
November 11, 2007, 05:29 PM
budsgunshop.com

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