[firestar]

I am looking into getting a C&R license. I saw that a lot of full auto guns are listed as C&Rs. Is it legal for a regular guy with a C&R to buy full auto? Don't you still need to buy the stamp or something?

Also, some modern guns were listed as C&Rs (Bren Ten, Colt Woodsman etc.), what with that? I thought only guns that were 50 years old made the list.

[*8*]

yeP, you can buy a C&R NFA gun with your license with the ATF form 4, wait for a few months, once paperwork is completed, you can have the dealer ship the machine gun directly to you.

[Hkmp5sd]

As long as there are no local laws preventing it, as a licensed collector, you can buy C&R machineguns and other C&R NFA listed firearms without having to go through a local Class III dealer. You do the same paperwork (Form 4) and pay the same one-time transfer tax ($200 on machineguns) and then have the gun shipped to your front door.

In some states, C&R machineguns are the only guns they allow for sale to civilians.

The guns that are <50 years old and still on the list are guns that ATF has decided are valuable to collectors and are not likely to be used in crimes. Anyone can submit a model or specific gun to the Director of ATF and have him judge whether or not it's primary value is that of collectibility. If he agrees, it goes on the list and becomes a C&R.

[DadOfThree]

Another question. Do you have to have a C & R license to own a gun listed on the C&R list? I have a 13mm Gyrojet that is on the list but without any ammo, I would have to throw it at someone to hurt them. I just have it for the novelty.

[Hkmp5sd]

DadOfThree,

You can own any gun that a C&R can own. The only thing the license does is allow the collector to buy C&R guns from anyone in any state and have it shipped to his home without having to use a dealer to transfer the gun.

[DadOfThree]

Thanks.

[dave]

Just a quick question. How is one supposed to differ between their "modern" guns and the collectable ones? Does one have to store or record them different?

Thanks

[Hkmp5sd]

All guns over 50 years in age and all guns specifically listed on ATF's C&R List (http://www.atf.treas.gov/firearms/relics/index.htm) are considered C&R guns. If you have a C&R license, you must keep a listing of your "acquisitions and dispositions" aka a bound book for your C&R guns. Everything else is the same as for modern guns.

Basically, for $30/3 years, you can buy C&R guns and have them sent to your house without using a dealer. You also get dealer discounts at many firearm related businesses such as Brownell's. Not a bad deal overall.

[firestar]

This C&R thing like it is worthwhile. I see many guns on the list that are still availiable and inexpensive.

Is it possible to ever sell a gun that you bought using your C&R? You are not stuck with them forever are you?

[Drizzt]

Sell? A gun? Why would I want to do that? If I sell it, how am I supposed to shoot it? :p

[Hkmp5sd]

firestar,

You can sell them the same way you can sell any other firearm you own. There's nothing special about them.

[TexasVet]

Firestar, a lot of the dealers have 2fer thru 5fer specials. A lot of guys buy these, pick out the best to keep and then dispose of the rest. As long as you are selling, trading, etc. to "enhance your collection" (ATF Quote) you are fine.
All they require is that you not try to do "business" on a C&R. For example, taking money from a buddy to get him one of the 2fer's IN ADVANCE might be construed as "doing business", or even a straw purchase. Ordering a 2fer and then offering the lesser gun to him afterward is NOT "doing business".
The rules are actually pretty simple and it is rare for a C&R holder to get in trouble unless they do something REALLY stupid.
I've had mine less than a year now and it has saved me $480 on transfer fees ALONE at $20 a pop. This does not count the 50% savings by buying directly from the wholesalers instead of from a gunshow or shop.

[Beren]

I've requested a C&R application form from the ATF. Seems like it might be a fun thing to do, and if I can get a discount on supplies as well, it sounds like something worth trying out for three years.

What C&R firearms do y'all recommend I look for as "starters?" Are there Makarovs still available as C&R's? What about rifles and shotguns? Old 1911's available cheap?

[firestar]

Thanks for all the help. I'm going to start getting some of the classic guns from WWII but I am waiting to do the C&R thing 1st.

I don't have any legal sized paper so I can't print out the form right now. Does anyone know if the ATF can send you the forms in the mail? If so, can you send the link. I can't find it on their web page.

[TexasVet]

Firestar, go ahead and use 8 1/2 X11. They do not care. Half the guys I know with C&R's used regular paper with no trouble.

[JSR]

Heres some instructions and tips.I hope their good ones as its what I just went by.
Jeff
http://www.cruffler.com/becomingcruffler.html