Newbie reloading question (about neck size)


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akolleth
November 17, 2007, 10:53 PM
This may seem like a newbie question, hopefully its something simple I am overlooking--

First some background--

Okay, tried my hand for the first time tonight at reloading :):) for my 1/12 twist AR-15. I had some once fired LC 223 brass, my father in laws Lyman single stage press, a brand new set of Lee RGB dies, lube, primers, 45 grain JHP bullets, load data for them, and all the goodies I thought I would need

I ran 13 cases through the full length sizer/de-primer, then checked for case length since I don't have a trimmer yet (all passed fine)

When I went to seat the bullets is where I ran into a problem. The 224 bullets would not seat at all into the case neck. Not even one smidge into the neck. The first one I attempted to press in anyways, and it greatly deformed the neck area as the bullet was not pressed in at all. My father in law had a small piece of steel that was tapered that we very lightly tapped in into the neck and open it up just that tiniest bit so the bullet could be seated with the press. All 12 seated fine after that. OAL length was just fine on all.

Now, on to my question
Why was the neck not sized right so that the .224 bullet would seat properly? I thought when I used the full length sizer it also ensures the neck cavity is the proper size as well? Is it just something I am doing wrong? Do I need to use a neck sizing die, will that ensure the neck cavity size?

BTW here is an after shot of the first load--

http://home.earthlink.net/~akolleth/reloaded.jpg

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Ol` Joe
November 17, 2007, 11:02 PM
The expander ball on the depriming stem should have opened the neck back up enough to allow the bullet to enter. The bullet won`t easily push in but setting it straight on the case mouth and slowly raising the ram should seat it with out harming the case. Measure the expander (with a caliper) on your deprimer stem and see what it runs. It should be about 0.003" undr bullet diameter. or ~0.220"-.221".

fmnnc
November 17, 2007, 11:07 PM
What bullets are you using?

akolleth
November 18, 2007, 01:08 AM
Remington 45 grain JHP

Chawbaccer
November 18, 2007, 08:39 AM
As mentioned, check the size of the expander button.
Make sure the seater is set up correct, hard to imagine but I suppose it is possible to crimp before seating.
Even with used military brass, I always chamfer before the first re-load.

Ol` Joe
November 18, 2007, 11:11 AM
As mentioned, check the size of the expander button.
Make sure the seater is set up correct, hard to imagine but I suppose it is possible to crimp before seating.
Even with used military brass, I always chamfer before the first re-load.

I think we might have hit on the problem, he is crimping while trying to seat the bullet.
Is your seating die screwed in too far? The die crimps the mouth as well as seats the bullet. You should set it with a empty case in the shellholder, ram at the top of its travel, and screw the die body in until you feel it hit the case mouth. Back the die out 1/2 turn and lock the ring. Then with the seating STEM turned out place a bullet in the case mouth raise the ram to its top and screw in the stem until contact is made. Lower the ram and screw in the stem a turn or two, seat a bullet and measure the COL. It likely will need to be deeper. Adjust the seating stem down a little at a time until the bullet is seated to the COL you want, then lock it in place.
The 223 needs no crimp but if you desire one, nows the time to set it. Back the seater out a turn and loosen the die body lock ring. set the die body the 1/2 turn deeper you removed when setting up to seat the bullet. run a loaded rd in the die and screw the seater down until contact is made with the bullet. Check the crimp and cartridge OAL. If needed turn the die 1/8 turn deeper to add more crimp and re-adjust the seater to compensate.

Let us know what you find when you get this figured out..

Poper
November 19, 2007, 03:39 PM
I always chamfer before the first re-load.


Akolleth:
Your OP did not mention chamfering the necks of the cases, though you did mention using a
a small piece of steel that was tapered that we very lightly tapped in into the neck and open it up just that tiniest bit
which is essentially the same process except a chamfer tool will remove a small amount od material. If you are not crimping your case after seating the bullet, the flared case mouth you describe could cause feeding or chambering issues.

As always, proper die adjustment is essential.

I hope this is helpful.

Poper

RustyFN
November 19, 2007, 07:59 PM
If you are seating and crimping in the same die that can cause a lot of problems if it's not set right. I also use boat tail bullets because the flat base bullets are hard to start and I haven't noticed any difference in performance. I like to use the Lee factory crimp die and crimp seperate. I use a very light crimp just to eliminate any possible feed issues.
Rusty

akolleth
November 20, 2007, 12:30 AM
Thanks for all your help, I am certain I did not have the die set properly, so I am hoping that was the main issue.

As far as I know the die set I have (Lee RGB dies) does not crimp the neck, its just a cheap 2 die set (One die is de-priming/full length resizing, last one is bullet seater)

Will also check on the expander ball inside the de-priming die.

Chawbaccer
November 22, 2007, 08:45 PM
I am sure it does have a crimper, back the stem out and you can feel for it with a paper clip, follow Joe's instructions above for setting it.

akolleth
November 23, 2007, 11:00 AM
Okay I finally got this figured out, at least I think. Spent some more time loading up some brass. Last run went very smoothly after some tinkering with the dies height. What I figured out I was doing wrong-

1-- Both dies were not set up properly :o

2-- The expander ball is working just fine (now that I adjusted the height of the die properly)

3-- There is indeed a crimp, which I also had to adjust the height of, and it works just fine too-

Thank you all again for your help--

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