Wheeling PD go with Beretta PX4


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Newton
November 18, 2007, 01:43 PM
I saw that headline in one of the gun rags yesterday. Apparently after extensive testing the Wheeling (WV) police department has selected the .40 caliber Beretta PX4 as their new duty weapon citing the replaceable backstraps as one of the key factors.

With all the other weapons out there, it just struck me as a strange choice.

I wonder how many other PDs will be adopting the PX4, my guess would be not many.

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safetyjoe
November 18, 2007, 03:37 PM
They probably got them at a good price. Seriously though, my oldest son got one (traded my G27 for it) and it is a real nice pistol.

Pops 1
November 18, 2007, 06:19 PM
The Jefferson Parish Shef.dept was gone to the PX4, also the Canadian Border Patrol. I bought one a couple of weeks ago and it is a soft shooter. Pops

siglite
November 18, 2007, 06:41 PM
I find that surprising. Seems to me like most WV LE depts are big on Sig and Smith, and to a lesser degree Glock. Going to the PX4 is jumping WAY out of the WV mold :)

Autolycus
November 18, 2007, 06:44 PM
I have heard a lot of good things about these guns.

Landric
November 18, 2007, 09:25 PM
Dare County, NC Sheriff's Office issues the PX4 in .40 also, it replaced the Beretta 96.

2ndamd
November 19, 2007, 12:05 AM
I think some LE agencies were waiting for the testing results. The PX4 did very well in a 15,000 round test.

Newton
November 24, 2007, 12:53 AM
I haven't shot one myself, but Berettas usually have long heavy DA triggers.

Just seems like a retrograde step with all the more advanced trigger options out there, that first shot is the most important after all.

Lonestar49
November 24, 2007, 01:01 AM
Quote: haven't shot one myself, but Berettas usually have long heavy DA triggers.
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...

Oh no, not the Px4, as mine felt like, when brand new, DA 9.5lbs and SA 4.5lbs out of the box. And it was smooth, and has gotten really nice after 5450 rounds without any failures, just 100%, and feels more like DA 9lbs, SA 3.5lbs crisp, clean, break now.

They also have, which is not spelled out in the manuals, but they have a semi-short DA mode, that one can put the gun into, making for an even shorter DA pull, or making for a much easier manual thumb-cocking into SA mode.

Excellent, proven, weapon IMHO


Ls

ccmdfd
November 24, 2007, 11:49 AM
They also have, which is not spelled out in the manuals, but they have a semi-short DA mode, that one can put the gun into, making for an even shorter DA pull, or making for a much easier manual thumb-cocking into SA mode.



I haven't heard of that. Do you have any further info on where I can read about that?

Thanks

Oh, and I agree with some of the other posters. Out of the box, the PX-4's DA trigger is one of the smoothest and nicest DA pulls on any DA/SA I've tried. I'd say the SA is average, but the DA really shines.

cc

Lonestar49
November 24, 2007, 02:01 PM
...

Sorry, no.. as I said, this feature is not stated by Beretta, yet, anyone that owns a Px4, can use it, and many that CCW, carry it in the semi-DA mode for both benefits mentioned.

It is simply activated by a slight pull or the trigger, or a light thumb-cocking of the hammer, either way, until one hears, and feels, the first "click".. and the gun is set.

If you can find one at a gun store, test it out, but what it's really for is, in the event, if one were to go for a full thumb-cocking of the hammer from full DA mode into SA mode, and lost it, *it's a safety feature that catches the hammer before hitting the firing pin.. and will do the same if set in the semi-DA mode, if one were to lose it going for SA mode.

*is mentioned in manuals.

Also, try putting a small dab of Tetra white gun grease on the end of a toothpick and put some down on, and in between, the sears, as this will help in both, pull smoothness and the SA break.. Repeat as needed.

Are you, by chance experiencing, a wee bit of trigger-creep in your SA pull?


Ls

Newton
December 9, 2007, 02:47 AM
Are we suggesting that elevating the hammer to the half cock notch is an acceptable carry mode to provide a short first round DA trigger pull.

I'm asking because I went ahead and purchased a PX4 and would like to know the answer to this. The manual gives no such indication.

nwilliams
December 9, 2007, 04:42 AM
I absolutely love my Px4 9mm its one of the most accurate guns I own and have ever owned, and I've owned a whole bunch. I love the trigger, the sights and the feel of the gun in general and it makes a great ccw.

It actually surprises me that more LE agencies haven't jumped on the Px4, I've probably put about 2K rounds through mine and its gone bang every time.

Are we suggesting that elevating the hammer to the half cock notch is an acceptable carry mode to provide a short first round DA trigger pull.


Yes, that is how I carry mine. I load the gun then use the decocker and then pull the hammer back to the first click. You can also do it by prepping the trigger slightly but I prefer to do it with my thumb unless I'm on the range.
http://i211.photobucket.com/albums/bb264/nwilliams27/PX4-4.jpg

DHart
December 9, 2007, 06:38 AM
I had a PX4 in 9mm a while back... very soft shooting, stone reliable, nice single action trigger. But what I didn't like is the DA for the first shot, then SA thereafter. So ultimately, I traded the gun for an M&P 40 Compact.

I'm one of those that just wants the same trigger pull all the time. Perhaps that's my 1911 heritage showing, but I really dislike having two totally different trigger pulls. One of the reasons why I like the HK USP is the capability of carrying it cocked & locked (like a 1911) and having a nice SA pull every time. I wish the PX4 had that capability. I like the trigger on my M&P, but have had a lot of mag drop problems with that gun and it's on detention at present.

Mr.Revolverguy
December 9, 2007, 09:14 AM
A large family owned shop near me has been in business since 1950. I asked to look at the PX4 they had and he said you do not want that thing and I asked why. He said well look at it they are all plastic. The guide rails are plastic, the slide catch is plastic, every piece in this gun is plastic etc etc. In his words they will not last long or be reliable. It was a total downer. Because I dislike glocks I made a comment so I guess you want me to buy a glock then. Simply because he was wearing a glock tshirt. He then proceeded to take down a glock 22 and the px4. I said wait there are metal inserts here in the rails just like the glock he said no that it was just hard plastic, I got frustrated and said ok I see your point and left. I am glad he is willing to talk straight on a product but he had 5 of them in the counter you think he would want to sell them. I know for a fact his mom would have had a fit to hear him speak that way about beretta I have been customers of theirs for years and I know she loves them. It was the first time I had made up my mind what I wanted and let someone talk me out of it.

So is there any good longevity studies on the PX4 I thought I had really done my research this guy really made me change my mind or have second thoughts.

SouthpawShootr
December 9, 2007, 10:52 AM
Believe almost nothing you hear in a gunshop. Read up on www.berettaforum.net and see if anybody has high round counts. I'm sure there are a few. I would expect durability to be at least in line with other plastic pistols.

gudel
December 9, 2007, 11:29 AM
I have the PX4 40. This thing is very reliable!!!

Newton
December 9, 2007, 12:42 PM
Any more thoughts on the half cocked issue for carry?

Also, as for round count some of the members on Berretaforum are well into the 6 or 7 thousand round range without any signs of wear on their PX4s, let alone failures. With many thousands now in police holsters, any signs of premature wear will soon come to light.

Gun store owners are rarely knowledgable about their products.

Abner
December 9, 2007, 04:36 PM
Is the half-cock that you are talking about on the PX4 the same thing as it is on the 92F? If it is, I believe that the half-cock notch does NOT engage the hammer block safety if I remember the manual. Unless the act of decocking it with the decocker engages the hammer block and it stays engaged as you thumb the hammer into the half cock notch.

With today's litigious society with respect to firearms I would think that Beretta would list the half cock notch as a safe way to carry the pistol if they felt that way but who knows.

Lonestar49
December 9, 2007, 05:11 PM
...

First, the frame is polymer plastic, mixed compounds that make it stronger than just "plastic"..

Second, the frame mounted guide rails are steel, embedded in the polymer.

Third, if one's gun shop didn't like the gun because it was "plastic", then they most likely are from the old school, all metal guns. Some people like and embrace the lighter, more CCW weight-wise, polymer/metal guns.

Fourth, my Px4 40cal has gone 5500 perfect rounds with mostly FMJ 180gr, and around 100 rounds of 180gr JHP, with no failures, just 100%.

And finally, the "half cock" is not a correct term, as it does not go half-way.
It is a "semi-cock" setting that shortens the DA pull by about 20% but, it does make the DA pull shorter,faster, smoother, and easier, along with, it makes thumb-cocking the hammer into SA mode very easy and fast, as opposed to the Hammer fully down in full DA mode.

The real purpose of this semi-cock position is not (found, nor suggested) in the owners manual but, it is referred to as a safety feature, in that, if semi-cocked, or in FULL DA mode, once one begins the DA pull, one will hear a click shortly after the pull starts, as this is to prevent an accidental loss of trigger pull, or thumb-cocking, of the hammer and its sudden drop, hard, back down, but it will stop "at the semi-cocked position", preventing the hammer from striking the firing pin..

Otherwise, a well thought out safety feature that an individual can utilize to decrease a full DA pull or thumb-cock the hammer, much faster and easier, into SA mode, without worry of a human mistake that lets the hammer drop anytime prior to full SA mode click/lock of the hammer.

And I do carry my Px4 in the semi-cocked mode, always.

Ls

Pops 1
December 9, 2007, 06:49 PM
The more I shoot my PX4 40 the more I love it. Thinking about getting the 9mm to keep it company. Pops

The Lone Haranguer
December 9, 2007, 07:21 PM
No doubt they are a fine handgun (never tried one) and a professional police department. However, this does not make either the "be-all-and-end-all."

I wonder if they tried the M&P. It has interchangeable backstraps (a good move if you are going to equip a police department, whose members come in a variety of sizes) and the same light trigger pull on every shot. :)

Mr.Revolverguy
December 9, 2007, 07:27 PM
I thought I read that the version shipped to departments have changeable back straps also for the px4.

torrejon224
December 9, 2007, 07:49 PM
I'm sorry but the last person I would ever ask for advice on what pistol to buy would be a gun shop employee. They push certain brands for a reason and you can be sure it's an economic one. I'm not saying that all shop employees are bad but personally I haven't found many tha don't try to push you towards a certain brand usually Glock which is why my mind is made up prior to entering the place. I buy all new guns at a pawn shop that charges a 5% markup, a lot less than you would pay at a store dedicated to guns!

Lonestar49
December 9, 2007, 08:36 PM
Quote: I thought I read that the version shipped to departments have changeable back straps also for the px4.
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...

All Px4's come with 3 backstraps, all interchangeable..

Small/straight-back (smallest form of grip size)

Medium/slightly curved-back (middle, with palm curve, grip size)

Large/straight-back (largest form of grip size)

Also, IIRC, most LEO depts are going with either the G-model, decocker-only DA/SA or, the D-model, double action only.

I'm sure some LEO depts require a safety-decocker (in-one) which would be the F-model, DA/SA.


Ls

Lonestar49
December 9, 2007, 08:59 PM
...

What caliber did you get your Px4 in, 9mm or 40cal ?

Also, for any questions or hints about your Beretta, I would suggest joining the Beretta Forum here:

http://www.berettaforum.net/vb/index.php


My best,


Ls

RustyShackelford
December 10, 2007, 05:04 AM
I agree with you that it's strange how BerettaUSA is able to sell these duty pistols to so many US police agencies. I could see the M-9a1 models or maybe the Cougars but the Storm model line is not that impressive to me, :rolleyes:. Beretta must have some sharp cookies in the military/LE sales office.
If I were a sworn LEO. I would choose the HK P-2000 or newer P-30 line or maybe the SIGarms DAK series P-229. The S&W model Military and Police duty pistols look good but I'm not crazy about S&W auto pistols.
Rusty S

SouthpawShootr
December 10, 2007, 07:35 PM
I agree with you that it's strange how BerettaUSA is able to sell these duty pistols to so many US police agencies.

Hardly strange. They're practically giving them away. Same marketing strategy Glock has successfully used. Sell the dept the new guns for $350-400 each, then give them $200 credit for each of their current service weapons regardless of condition. Scap or part out the guns that are in poor condition and sell the rest to distributors for the used market. They'll get at least $200 per gun. So, they cover costs and maybe make a little profit on the side. But the dept is now on the hook for replacement parts, mags, night sights, etc. Also training for departmental armorers. That's a little more lucrative.

deercop
December 10, 2007, 11:03 PM
My department bought and issued several for T&E. I think a big factor was we've had Beretta 96 pistols for 15 years, also we're becoming more "politically correct" with our hiring, so the interchangeable backstrap was appealing. Lots of firearms instructors were adamently opposed to the Storms, for one reason or another.

Then one of our high-level admin types went to FBI firearm instructor school. At present we're supposedly going to Glock 35 pistols.

Geronimo45
December 10, 2007, 11:10 PM
as I said, this feature is not stated by Beretta, yet, anyone that owns a Px4, can use it, and many that CCW, carry it in the semi-DA mode for both benefits mentioned.

It is simply activated by a slight pull or the trigger, or a light thumb-cocking of the hammer, either way, until one hears, and feels, the first "click".. and the gun is set.
Same way on the Beretta 21A - same semi-cocked state. Seems to reduce trigger pull around 3 or 4 pounds.
Have dropped it on hard floor. Four feet or so off the ground, fully loaded. Didn't fire. And if the PX4's got the marvelous grip angle/shape/whatever of the 21A, I think it's a teriffic choice.

Newton
December 15, 2007, 12:36 PM
What caliber did you get your Px4 in, 9mm or 40cal ?

Went with the 9mm, I did wonder about the .40S&W, but I'm now convinced I made the right choice.

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