Tokarev: The Mosin of Pistols?


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Shrinkmd
November 26, 2007, 11:21 PM
I've been thinking about getting one of those Romanian TT-33's from AIM. Anyone have any experience with this batch of pistols? Are they safe to shoot? I've been reading various things about the CZ52s with firing pin problems, roller blocks breaking, etc, and it seems that the Tokarev is the way to go. Assuming you get one in excellent condition, how many rounds do people figure these pistols are good for?

Is it difficult cleaning up after using surplus ammo? I have no problems using it in a Mosin, so I suppose that a full strip and douse everything with Mpro7 would do the trick, right?

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Onmilo
November 27, 2007, 09:10 AM
I have one I bought from SOG.
The pistol is suprisingly accurate and reliable but I had to replace the magazines that came with it, they were used up junk.
Get some Polish magazines if you can find them.

I shoot mostly Romanian surplus, corrosive. Some Chinese surplus, some Bulgarian and some commercial stuff, all has performed well.
I hose the barrel down with Windex with ammonia first and then clean as regular with M-Pro 7 cleaner.

Tokarevs are super simple to diassemble:
Remove magazine, clear chamber and leave hammer cocked.
Pull back the retainer clip on right side of frame, I use a small plastic hammer to tap it loose but you could use a cartridge case rim to pull it back too.
Push pull the slide lock away from the left side of gun, you may have to fiddle with the slide a little bit before it comes free.
Push slide assembly to front and off frame keeping your hand under slide to control spring assembly.
When slide is off the recoil spring will come free and you can then remove the barrel bushing like a 1911, rotate 180 degress and pull free, barrel can then be removed by sliding to front of slide.
You can pull trigger group up and out of frame but it really isn't necessary unless something is broke.

Everything goes back together the same way, just remember to keep control of the recoil spring assembly until everything is back on the frame.

grimjaw
November 27, 2007, 01:00 PM
Anyone have any experience with this batch of pistols? Are they safe to shoot?

I don't have personal experience with the Romanian version, but I do have a Polish TT-33. I've read reports on the TT-33 being able to group 2"-2.5" at 25 yards from a bench, but I haven't seen it yet.

Assuming you get one in excellent condition, how many rounds do people figure these pistols are good for?

Assuming you maintain it properly and don't push it with hot loads, wild guess is 10K rounds? No idea honestly, but I'm sure I'll get sick of shooting it before I wear it out.

Is it difficult cleaning up after using surplus ammo?

It hasn't been for me. I get a large plastic bucket and put that in the sink. I boil a large pot of water an pour that over the disassembled pistol, then scrub out the barrel and other parts I can reach. I let the parts soak in that water for a little bit and then flush them with more boiling water again before I do a regular cleaning. Doesn't take that much longer.

It doesn't take long to field strip the pistol or reassemble it, but it's still more complicated to detail strip it than a Makarov, which I would more readily call the Mosin Nagant of pistols.

jm

Shrinkmd
November 27, 2007, 08:58 PM
Sounds like fun. I figure we need to take advantage of those surplus spam cans while they are still around, so why not plink away for less, eh?

Looks like I'll give AIM a call and report back.

I know somewhere else someone said that they estimated only 5k rounds through one of these, since they were meant to be officer pistols and not exactly workhorses, but aren't they all-steel? It is a hot round coming out, but you would think that they would have a long service life. Doesn't your average 1911 last for 50k or more? Of course that is a much lower pressure cartridge.

Any TT-33 torture tests?

Acheron
November 27, 2007, 09:34 PM
I have one and it has given me no problems so far.

I've been shooting Romanian surplus which has performed well enough. I've noticed that the pistol is definitely more accurate than me, albeit not by much.

Get one-it's a fun little pistol that is sure to get attention at the range!

Onmilo
November 27, 2007, 11:22 PM
Well. my Romanian Tokarev was made in 1954.
Woh knows how many rounds were fired before I got the gun and I have put another 1000 rounds or so through it.
I doesn't show any trace of falling apart anytime soon.

The Russians still dig these things up from battlefields, clean them up and sell them on the black market.

I would venture a guess that the Russians designated a 5 thousand round service life during combat operations.
Peacetime service life would be much higher.

brentn
November 28, 2007, 02:51 AM
I've had a norinco one for almost a year and still have not fired it :(

Soybomb
November 28, 2007, 03:15 AM
If they were the mosin of pistols they'd be a little cheaper and I'd be able to find as many c&r eligible ones as I wanted :D

Onmilo
November 28, 2007, 11:13 AM
Oh the Importers are milking the surplus firearms hard here in the good old USA.
I was buying brand new Norinco Tokarevs from the wholesalers for $95.00 wholesale in bulk lots and selling them for $130.00 retail in 1991-92 when they were flowing in like water.

On the world Black markets and in the arms bazarres Tokarev pistols rarely sell for more than $100.00 US

There is a more than plain rumor that oogles and oogles of Hi-Powers have been bought up and are awaiting inspection and approval.
The Importers paid less than $200.00 each and are selling them for double to triple profit margins.
I have already seen some of these.

iamkris
November 30, 2007, 09:23 AM
I just ordered one from AIM...I got an email from them yesterday that they are now C&R. That's good enough for me!

MCgunner
November 30, 2007, 09:28 AM
I had a couple of 9mm Toks back when they were 100 bucks in the early 90s. Mediocre accuracy and the paper that came with 'em says "life expectancy 2500 rounds". I got rid of 'em well before 2500 rounds. LOL Neither one would shoot better'n 4" groups at 25 yards, bad enough that plinking wasn't fun. One of 'em had a very stiff trigger, the other wasn't too bad. None of the parts from one was even close to fitting the other, either. It's almost as if each one was hand carved by political prisoners. And, the steel seemed soft enough to have been carved with a Buck 110. I saw some peening on slide parts after only a few hundred rounds.

YMMV and these were Chinese production.

Keeterbird
December 1, 2007, 05:05 AM
I just purchased a Romanian one from Century. Took it out and shot 160 rounds. No problem at all. Was pretty accurate at 25 yards, 31 in the center x on a standard police target. Only four were outside of the 8. For me that is legendary.
Took it home and the #%@% pin to that SUPERDUPER safety fell out. I'm still searching and if I do find it, I don't know how to stake it.

I was pleased until that pin came out.

White Horseradish
December 1, 2007, 06:23 AM
Took it home and the #%@% pin to that SUPERDUPER safety fell out. I'm still searching and if I do find it, I don't know how to stake it.The safety is a government-imposed afterthought. The original safety is the half-cock.

Onmilo
December 1, 2007, 11:35 AM
Years ago I removed the safety on a Chinese Type 54 import pistol and used a piece of 3/32" 4140 plate and nickle steel weld rod to close up the hole in the frame.
Polished it up, had the frame reblued.
Cost the guy almost as much as the price of the pistol, $125.00.

I saw the same gun at a gun show being advertised as an "Original" Type 54 Tokarev and wearing a $450.00 price tag.

I recognized the serial number and the fact nobody bothered to remove the import marks.
Dealer put it under the table after I 'enlightened' him.

My point is, If you don't want to restake that goofy safety back onto the frame, there are other ways of 'fixing' it if you have a handy gunsmith nearby.

ScottS
December 3, 2007, 11:16 AM
Took it home and the #%@% pin to that SUPERDUPER safety fell out. I'm still searching and if I do find it, I don't know how to stake it.

I was pleased until that pin came out.

Been there, FREAKIN' done that. Maybe you can benefit from my experience.

http://webpages.charter.net/ronjon/Tokarev%20-%20Romanian%201953%205.JPG

I borrowed this pic from an 'Net acquaintance and also new Romy Tok owner. (Thanks, Ron.) Notice how the clip which holds in the slide stop is also used to hold the safety in. You can see where the lower left corner of the clip fits into a notch in the right side of the shaft at about the 12:00-2:00 position. If you remove this clip during a field strip, it takes almost no pressure to pop the safety out to the left. When that happened to me, something (!) popped out of the safety and I heard it hitting the floor, but I didn't know what it was, or what I was looking for! There is a very small spring-loaded detent pin that sits in a hole in the safety and engages two rather roughly machined "notches" in the frame as the safety moves from "On" to "Off." This supplies the locking force that holds the safety in the selected position. I was down on my hands and knees in front of the bench, not knowing what or how many things I was looking for. Luckily, I keep a pretty clean floor, and found the detent pin immediately. Also luckily, the spring tends to stay in the safety and not shoot out as well. (I come to this conclusion based on a sample size of two!:mad:) A simple matter to put the detent pin back in place and replace the safety. If I had lost the pin, once I knew what I had, my plan was to replace it with a small cut-off from a drill bit. If you look at the shank of the safety, you can see the hole (and most probably the spring in there), and use that to size the drill bit required. The pin is flat on the bottom and rounded off at the top where it engages the "detents" in the frame, in order to "smoothly (?)" move from one position to the other. You could probably smooth the top with sandpaper, and end up with a better feel than the "original," and yes, I know it's not really "original" to the gun. Hope this helps.

tinygnat219
December 3, 2007, 01:16 PM
BTW, these are now C&R pistols per an E-mail I got earlier from AIM Surplus.

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