Mail Call and Conquest this evening...


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Mike Irwin
July 21, 2003, 01:48 AM
Two good shows.

Mail Call had R. Lee talking about the Garand and the MP-44.

I was a little dismayed to see that he was handling a loaded MP-44 with his finger through the trigger guard as he was walking up to the firing line, though.

Conquest had a team messing with matchlocks and flintlock muskets and rifles. Also very interesting.

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OEF_VET
July 21, 2003, 02:11 AM
Yeah, seeing Gunny Ermey shoot that MP-44 made me jealous. I want one! I too noticed his faux paux of putting his finger in the trigger guard while handling it. You'd think someone with his experience would keep his digits where they're supposed to be out of instinct. Oh well, goes to show you that nobody's perfect.

Frank

Sactown
July 21, 2003, 02:18 AM
Ermey was probably so excited to shoot the MP44 he was ready to shoot before he got to the firing line. Good episodes. Caught them both. I'm surprised the guys on Conquest weren't wearing glasses. I've never shot black powder or muzzle loaders, but having that flash pan thingy a coupla inches from my eyes would want me to put on some safety glasses, especially after that one guys flintlock disintegrated and nearly blinded the guy next to him.

Justin
July 21, 2003, 02:31 AM
It's my understanding that the military doesn't teach 'finger off the trigger' as one of the safety rules, so there's a distinct likelyhood that R. Lee has never been told that particular rule, or that even if he has, it simply isn't an ingrained habit.

Ian
July 21, 2003, 02:36 AM
I saw an episode of Mail Call where he shot a ballistic vest a couple times with an AK, and he had his finger erroneously on the trigger in that show as well.

Mike Irwin
July 21, 2003, 03:50 AM
I've shot an MP-44.

Trust me, it's as fun as it looks!

As for the episode of Conquest, I meant to mention about the glasses.

Hell, if you watched it through the Brown Bess section there was one shooter who had his flint shatter when he attempted his first shot, and it flew and not only cut the next guys hand, but also had a bit get into his eye!

I noticed that Ermy also wasn't wearing eye protection.

How about hearing protection. Anyone notice?

seeker_two
July 21, 2003, 06:53 AM
Both were great shows last night (esp. w/ the Kentucky Rifle)...:D

But I think Ermey & Woodward could benefit from a little training in "range safety"....

And in the final competition on Conquest--when the three men were running to their shooting lines while one stayed back to start shooting--was a SERIOUS breach of safety...:what:

Triad
July 21, 2003, 07:13 AM
Ermey doesn't usually wear hearing protection from what I've seen and I don't think he was wearing any for last nights show. The only time I'm certain he wore hearing protection was when he shot the .50 on the AA mount.

That MP44 looked like it was very controllable on FA.

I want a tape of the guy that didn't hold the rifle correctly and almost had it knock his head off when he fired it.

Really disappointed they didn't show how to make black powder on Conquest.

DWS1117
July 21, 2003, 08:33 AM
Both good shows last night. I especially liked seeing R. Lee giddy as a school girl in anticipation of shooting those weapons.

Our normal thursday night range sessions have some how evolved into full auto night. Last week one guy brought an MP-44, MP-40, and M3 greasegun, and an HKMP5SD.

El Tejon
July 21, 2003, 10:19 AM
Arrrgh! I can't believe I forgot to TiVo "Conquest"!!!

I love that guy. Too right.

ReadyontheRight
July 21, 2003, 10:56 AM
Any idea if either of these episodes repeat this week?

Oracle
July 21, 2003, 10:58 AM
I watched both last night, and really liked Conquest. I think that they would have showed how to make black powder if they had enough time, but, they were almost cutting things short with the time slot the way it was. I noticed the "not wearing safety glasses" thing too, but I think that was done to enhance authenticity. Not that I think that authenticity should be pursued when compromising safety, but that may be why it was done. Regardless, I enjoyed both shows. R. Lee looked like he was having a blast shooting that MP-44.

OEF_VET
July 21, 2003, 11:06 AM
ReadyontheRight,

Mail Call will be on again tonight. I'm not sure about Conquest though.

Frank

Mauserlady
July 21, 2003, 11:15 AM
Any idea if either of these episodes repeat this week?

Tonights episode is different than last nights
8:00 PM Channel 40 HIST Monday, 21
Mail Call
30 min.
Viewer questions regarding the Armed Forces are answered by military experts. (VCR Plus+ 97889)

Mail Call (these are the next airings of last nights episode)
Additional Airings
Date Time Channel VCR Plus+
Saturday, 2 7:30 PM 40 HIST 23376
Sunday, 3 11:00 AM 40 HIST 28999

greyhound
July 21, 2003, 04:44 PM
WHO'S GOT THE BEST SHOW ON T.V.?
THE MAN IN THE HAT R. LEE ERMY!

I swear if heard that promo once more I was gonna shoot the T.V. They were running the blasted thing every five minutes!

That said, mail call is a great show.:)

mtnbkr
July 21, 2003, 05:08 PM
Those shows are about the only reason I wish I had cable


Chris

Kenneth Lew
July 21, 2003, 05:27 PM
Ermey doesn't usually wear hearing protection from what I've seen and I don't think he was wearing any for last nights show. The only time I'm certain he wore hearing protection was when he shot the .50 on the AA mount.

During his time period when he was at his prime, people were considered to be sissies if they could not handle the sound. BTW, being in some firefights in Vietnam did not help either.

Kenneth Lew

Ala Dan
July 21, 2003, 05:41 PM
I can't wait for the episode whereas Gunny is suppose
to jump with the Golden Knight's. That ought be something
to see!:D :uhoh: :)

Best Wishes,
Ala Dan, N.R.A. Life Member

Destructo6
July 21, 2003, 06:28 PM
Half or more of the fun of watching Mail Call is seeing Gunny's raw enthusiasm. It's hard not to smile when he blasts a water melon with a Lewis gun, then grins his head off.

Sadly, I missed Mail Call last night, but did catch Conquest (good episode).

BowStreetRunner
July 21, 2003, 08:20 PM
drat i missed them!
i was watching equilibrium though, so it worked out ok i guess
BSR

Stickjockey
July 21, 2003, 10:43 PM
There's a guy on another board I frequent that works on the Mail Call set. Yous guys want I shopuld politely ask him to see about Gunny's gunhandling habits?

Mike Irwin
July 21, 2003, 11:00 PM
Stick,

Sure, why not?

Actually, I'd be much more interested in hearing what sort of preparations they take on the set for the handling of live firearms with all the crew that has to be about for a show like this to function.

I've never seen the Gunny do anything unsafe, but it would be interesting to know a bit more about where they're shooting and how they secure it. There doesn't seem to be any kind of impact berm, and when he fired that .50 BMG it was in a skyward trajectory. Those bullets had to come down somewhere.

buttrap
July 22, 2003, 06:05 AM
Both where good shows but on the finger thing I think that once upon a time they expected folks to have better skills with a weapon in the long run than worry about that new finger in the trigger guard issue. When moving up range to what ever is going to be engaged the finger is in the guard and on the front of the guard on the edge of the trigger. Its only the new corp that is hey diddle keep the finger off the trigger....

Feanaro
July 22, 2003, 06:21 AM
The finger thing might be a side-effect of 'Nam. I've seen one or two veterans catch themselves with fingers in the trigger, saying they had always kept it there for speed. Or maybe not.

I really loved the StG.44 though and Gunny is always enthusiastic. I thought it was kinda silly that the ammunition was just called .30 though. It wouldn't have killed them to say "30-06, thirty caliber bullet" or "8mm Kurz, a short thirty caliber round."

digex
July 22, 2003, 10:05 AM
I only caught the last part of Mail Call, but got to see the whole episode of Conquest. I was a bit dissapointed about the black powder making part since he said they were going to have to make their own then they didn't. I felt bad for the guy who didn't have his musket shouldered properly and almost dinged his noggin, but I think he learned a valuable lesson. It looked like those things kick like a mule! I was also curious about the safety glasses issue. Seems that making and explosion in a pan in front of your face could possibly create a risky situation, as far as eye-bulbs go. Anyway, great episode!

seeker_two
July 22, 2003, 10:06 AM
It wouldn't have killed them to say "30-06, thirty caliber bullet" or "8mm Kurz, a short thirty caliber round."

THAT was the other thing that bugged me about Mail Call that night. Gunny said that the StG-44 used a "short, .30 caliber round"...

.30 caliber is 7.62mm (.308--or .311 if you're a Brit or Ruskie...:D )
8mm is .338 caliber, IIRC.

Guess Gunny missed the last episode of "Guns & Ammo TV" where they addressed shooting the RIGHT ammunition in the RIGHT firearm...:scrutiny:

Boats
July 22, 2003, 11:01 AM
Woodward is one of the few remaining Englishmen who "gets" it about the honorable history weapons have played and who doesn't believe it has been one unending tale of misery and evil like most of his fellow sheeple do.

And he digs demolition derbies. He's really a closeted American. Welcome aboard Peter!

No4Mk1
July 22, 2003, 11:13 AM
I was a little dismayed to see that he was handling a loaded MP-44 with his finger through the trigger guard as he was walking up to the firing line, though.

I watched it last night specifically watching for this and missed it. I did, however, notice that when he was holding the MP-44 at port-arms and talking to the camera, he very clearly had his index finger fully extended and out of the trigger guard, and kept the weapon pointed in a safe direction.

Y'all quit giving the Gunny such a hard time! ;)

DJJ
July 22, 2003, 02:32 PM
If anyone recalls (or cares :uhoh: ), Peter Woodard played Cornwallis' right-hand-man in "The Patriot" and is the son of "Equalizer" Edward Woodward.

Alan Smithiee
July 22, 2003, 05:26 PM
think about the effect of Woodward showing everyone and there brother how to make black powder.. can we say "lawsuit"?

and can you imagine the reaction from HomeLand Security

"there showing people how to make bombs on Television!"

I know who would be getting a visit from the alphabet soup brigade..

I suspect Woodword would be on the next flight out of the country in cuffs.

Correia
July 22, 2003, 05:48 PM
Highly doubt it N.B. since anybody who with a High School chemistry book can do the same thing. It isn't exactly complicated, nor is it a big secret.

I love Conguest and Mail Call. Some of the only good stuff on TV.

MessedUpMike
July 22, 2003, 09:18 PM
I figured that they left out showing how to make gun powder for liablity reasons. I was bothered by the lack of eye protection on the shooters however. Woodward at least had the good sense to close his eyes before he fired. The only time I fired a black powder rifle it was akin to running a cut off saw with an abrasive black through concrete. Except dirtier, and more fun.
The USMC most certainly taught finger off the trigger in the Gunny's time. They taught it to my Dad who's fanatical about it, and he's got (conservatively) 10 years on the Sarge. Probably a "bad" habit left over from being shot out for real. My favorite part is the sheer honest Emery that sneaks out in every show (did you see him cuss at the civil war cannons). And of course who can hate a water melon killer?

danelizer
July 22, 2003, 09:41 PM
Range safety rules as of 02/2001

1. Treat every weapon as it was loaded.

2. NEVER point your weapon at anything you don't intend to destroy!

3. Keep finger off the trigger until up and ready to fire.

4. Keep weapon on safe until ready to fire.

usmcmonty
July 22, 2003, 09:45 PM
WOAH!!! I posted the above!!

How in the world did some other guys name come up?

I don't even know this guy!

I apologise to the real danelizer!

danelizer
July 22, 2003, 10:30 PM
What the Hey!! I'm the real Danelizer. What happened here?
No sweat USMCMONTY! Computers. Go figure!

Alan Smithiee
July 24, 2003, 03:27 PM
something wierd is happening with names

and Correia, my statment has nothing to do with reality. yes any high school student who can read can make black poweder. Jules Verne described how to make black powder from scratch in Mysterious Island. but we're talking about TV here. and Homeland Security (what colour is it today?). and Sheeple. and bliss ninnies. and lawyers. show the great "unwashed masses" how to make black powder and it will roll downhill from a great hight because the govt doesn't think people should know about it. and imagine what would have happened if one of those bozo's who try to recreat the stunts they see on TV made some and blew a hand off? who do you think would be laying out megabucks to fight the case in court?, not to mention the possiblility of loosing the suit.


and if Woodward isin't a citizen, then his position is even more precarious.

Andrew Wyatt
July 24, 2003, 04:02 PM
And in the final competition on Conquest--when the three men were running to their shooting lines while one stayed back to start shooting--was a SERIOUS breach of safety...


WHo says? I do fire and maneuver drills all the time where i end up down range a bit. it's only a breach of safety protocol if you violate the five rules.

seeker_two
July 24, 2003, 06:22 PM
Andrew wyatt: It's a serious breach of safety when one guy is on the firing line & the other three start running FORWARD on the line... :what:

My wife thought I was having a seizure when I saw that...

freedomlover
July 25, 2003, 12:28 AM
I've observed the Gunny's trigger finger resting on the trigger as well, and wondered about it. Is this the result of Ermey's military training circa 1960's? My dad says they never taught him the "finger off the trigger rule" in the Army back in 1965...

Gunner45
July 25, 2003, 12:25 PM
I noticed that Ermy also wasn't wearing ear protection.

I noticed in one episode that the Gunny had spent cartridges stuck in ears as hearing protection.

Gunner45

Sleeping Dog
July 25, 2003, 01:19 PM
No "Finger on the trigger guard" stuff in Army training in 1966. No eye or ear protection either. Yes, those M14's are loud.

Why do you think sergeants yell so loud? They're half deaf from gunfire.

Regards.

freedomlover
July 27, 2003, 12:29 PM
Sleeping Dog, you've explained why my dad has been half deaf for the last 38 years or so...he tells me they thought earplugs were for sissies when he was in the Army!

I dont' think it would take very much range time with an M14 sans hearing protection before significant hearing damage would occur...

MikeK
July 28, 2003, 08:29 PM
Both shows are listed in the schedule again tonight starting at 8:00 PM Eastern time.

RM
July 29, 2003, 12:06 AM
I watched Conquest and liked it. But I was surpised that no one was wearing eye protection- especially with those kind of long guns.

Mike Irwin
July 29, 2003, 02:06 AM
Watched it again and the Gunny's finger was definitely on the trigger of the MP-44 just after he picked it up off of the Jeep.

Andrew Wyatt
July 29, 2003, 02:13 AM
Andrew wyatt: It's a serious breach of safety when one guy is on the firing line & the other three start running FORWARD on the line...


were guns getting pointed at people? no? then what's the problem?

Alan Smithiee
July 29, 2003, 12:35 PM
Andrew. general rules of safety. we don't ignore the rules this time just because we know there is no one down range, we do the rules every time. how many people have been shot because "there were no bullets in the gun".

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