extreeeeme shock bullets


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COHIBA
January 10, 2003, 10:19 AM
i got some of these into the store this week and am going out tomorrow morning to shoot. i am thinking something along the lines of a ham or brisket. any suggestions?
i'll bring the dig cam and post some pics of what the 45 does. do yall think a wrapping in duct tape would help or hinder the test?

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STPRMON1
January 10, 2003, 10:49 AM
I recently requested a CD of their products. It was very short,about a minute and a half, and I was not any more impressed than my RBCD videos. Their videos are a lot longer and are very informative. Extreme Shock did show them shooting a hog with a .380. Let me know hwo your test comes out. Maybe I will switch.

Felonious Monk
January 10, 2003, 10:53 AM
I've been following these for nearly a year now.
Contacted the co. several times, never got anything besides return emails full of propaganda. No way to get the ammo.

Maybe they've started shipping FINALLY.

For testing, I'd use an old pair of blue jeans. Stuff a milk jug full of water with the brisket duct taped to it inside the jeans, and bang away.

Looking forward to seeing the pics of however you do it!

If these are effective, I guess I'd just go with whichever is cheapest: RBCD or XS.

Dad-Gummit
January 10, 2003, 10:53 AM
When I do any ammo testing , I always include a test with denim draped over the median. It is amazing what denim can do to the expansion of bullets. OBTW Cohiba-whats for dinner afterwards?

My "tactical" test median is a box full of playdough-great stuff.

Double Naught Spy
January 10, 2003, 11:01 AM
Are you really thinking that some new fangled high dollar bullets are going to be better than what is already available given the unimpressive power of handguns?

When these first came out, their web site had no information at all, but they had one heck of a full page ad in several gun rags. My initial reaction was that it was all hype and no substance. Maybe your tests will show substance gaining ground on hype.

It is great to know somebody is testing this stuff, but even if the tests turn out well, it would be very prudent to have a solid history behind them before deciding to actually use these rounds for defensive purposes. For example, in .45 acp, Ranger and Hydrashok 230 gr. ammo both have a fairly long history of real world performance that can be shown to coincide with tests. The new EFMJ rounds look really good in tests, but have no real world history of performance, at least not as recently as about a month ago and even if there have been some shootings with them, there still aren't very many.

cordex
January 10, 2003, 11:06 AM
:scrutiny:
$40 for 20 rounds of a common, mid-sized centerfire handgun cartridge?
No thanks - can't afford that ... but I'm glad you're willing to do some quick tests for us!

COHIBA
January 10, 2003, 01:07 PM
we'll i shoot a 45 so as far as that goes i'd carry hardball w/ no loss of confidence. i'v shot the original 230 gr black talon DP against corbon 230's in phone books and gotten thru 3.5 books w/ the corbon (which completly fraged after the 3rd book) and 1.5 books w/ the BT which failed to even expand.
i'll use a couple of old cammies and the milk jug w/ the shank or ham. as far as the history goes w/ extremeshock do a search of mullins ammunition. that is who they are/were before the hype ads began and the words anti-terrorism were so common.

Andrew Wyatt
January 10, 2003, 02:23 PM
Mullins. Wasn't he the main character in the Soldier of Fortune game?


If he's making ammo, it must be good stuff! I'll have to run out and buy some right now! If i use that and hit a man in the pinky with my .380, he'll turn inside out! :rolleyes:

COHIBA
January 10, 2003, 03:45 PM
the pinky?
heck most me will go down from the wake of the 32acp.
seriously though, if we didnt embrace new things we all still be toteing around a pocketfull of rocks. i can hear some traditionalist saying "gunpowder? nah give me a good solid arrow"

ball3006
January 10, 2003, 04:34 PM
You all got more money than I do. That's eat'in meat....chris3

Don Gwinn
January 10, 2003, 07:18 PM
i can hear some traditionalist saying "gunpowder? nah give me a good solid arrow"

Sorry, I'll try to keep it down back here. :D

Chris, he didn't say he wasn't gonna eat it. Just said he was gonna shoot it first, like. . . .

George Hill
January 10, 2003, 10:33 PM
Mullins used to be a line of ammo made from powdered tungsten compressed into a bullet.
Designed to turn the bullet (now, let me see if I remember it right) into a "Rotational cone of metalic particulants when it strikes a density mass."
The Mullins ammo company would send you a video if you requested it... a brief 3 or 4 minute affair that showed a really creepy looking knife holding badguy in one frame and the Mullins ammo in the other... giving you the emotional response that you wanted to shoot that badguy with these bullets. They also showed a guy popping of a pig with a 9MM glock and a hunting rifle shot on a deer some hundred yards aways.

I couldn't tell you if the ammo was good or not.
But my personal opinion is that it is just a gimmick and you can not replace a well aimed shot with a bullet that has good penetration.

Navy joe
January 11, 2003, 12:58 AM
Went and found an ad. Whadda you know, the bullets are advertised by my favorite band of merry hucksters Pyramont. :rolleyes:

"Over ten years in the making, the new ExtremeShock tactical ( :fire: ) defense rounds represent the ultimate refinement in lethal bullet technology. The advanced Nytrilium (unobtanium) composite fragments upon impact leaving a wound channel of catastrophic proportions. The expansive fragmentation characteristics of the Extreme Shock round transfer the bullets energy in a far faster time span than conventional hollowpoints. The corresponding stopping power is utterly devastating. ExtremeShock rounds are engineered to expend maximum energy into soft targets, turning the density mass into an expanding rotational cone of Nytrilium matrix particles, causing neurological collapse to the central nervous system."

Ah yeah.

Further down, we see: "Its capability for inside-the-aircraft antiterrorism operations is legendary within the special operations community"

Ah yes, the "our product is used and endorsed by the super high speed, low drag; black bag, super-secret squirrel counter terrorism operators" product tie-in endorsement.

I could go to their website www.extremeshockusa.com but, I'm not prepared for the extreme shock of puking until my intestines are hanging out of my mouth while simultaneously trying to laugh. Enter at your own risk.

COHIBA
January 11, 2003, 03:56 AM
why is the assumption automatic that if you shoot well under stress that the use of a gimic bullet will cause you to now be unable to make those well places shots?
i keep hearing " nothing beats placement" thats 100% right. why do i all the sudden become incapable of keeping group or making solid hits if i choose to use magsafe, powerball, expanding round nose or extreme shock?
JHP used to be considered a gimic, too. lets not toss the baby w/ the bath. they may have a hypersensitive fearbase ad campaign but does that make their claims all the sudden impossible?
whatabout surefires " armed felon not included adds? does that make them less of a flashlight. Crimson trace ads are the same way. lets see how they preform then critique the rd.

i amnot now or have i ever been an employee of ES or mullins ammo, nor do i have financial stock or interest in the same (well exept for a $70 box of ammo)

4thHorseman
January 11, 2003, 04:20 AM
COHIBA, I'd be interested in how you test comes out. Please let us know. What are you going to compare it to?
I do think though if you want twice the stopping power, just double tap!:D Alot cheaper.

COHIBA
January 11, 2003, 04:24 AM
myself, being a father of 4 year old twin girls am much more concerned w/ overpenetration than under. my nightstand gun is an HK usp compact 45 acp. my current rd is the hornady 200 gr JHP. if the test go well the first 3 rd. may become ES.

4thHorseman
January 11, 2003, 04:50 AM
COHIBA, when are you going to do this test?

COHIBA
January 11, 2003, 08:40 AM
this morning. i am headed out right now.

Yohan
January 11, 2003, 11:17 AM
http://www.slowwave.com/art/waiting.gif
"I'm waiting!":evil:

Felonious Monk
January 11, 2003, 11:54 AM
Gunpowder? feh.
Give me a good straight arrow. Oh, and a wooden shield. :rolleyes:

COHIBA-- I for one am willing to believe that graphite shaft golf clubs, magnesium/titanium liquid core-headed drivers costing hundreds of dollars CAN improve my game, but it's not magic. It's due to modern advances in physics, chemistry, aerodynamics.

Similarly, I believe there CAN be improvements beyond the traditional JHP round which will result in more effective threat neutralization.

The Extreme Shlock marketing copy IS a little "over the top", but that doesn't negate the possibility that it might...actually...perform.

Let us know!!!
Thanks for testing 'em!

Regards,
FM

waterdog
January 11, 2003, 12:13 PM
Some people got to have the latest and greatest.

I will never use any type of frangible round in any of my weapons.

Murphys Law dictates them coming apart in the chamber, in the barrel, or immediately after leaving the barrel. NO THANKS!.

There are some pretty good rounds out there already. And it is possible to get real close with reloads to practice with, and simulate the factory round.

And the most important part, is shot placement.

But most here already know this.

waterdog

COHIBA
January 11, 2003, 03:23 PM
sorry guys mt wife ran off w/ the digital camera this morning. i'll do the test tomorrow AM. hait to keep you on pins and needles but i couldnt fathom shooting $2 bullets and not documenting it.

Navy joe
January 11, 2003, 07:14 PM
If you have the bullets would you try a couple penetrating more than denim, say like several sheets of thick cardboard or something to simulate heavier cloth or something? Another concern, what happens if you hit someone on a zipper or heavy button, will it break up the round? Ribs are another thought, bet they don't like bone. I just can't warm up to something with a lot of penetration pitfalls. Big hole in, much bigger hole out, good as it gets. Consider your backstop/angle of shot everytime you pull the trigger.

Felonious Monk
January 15, 2003, 12:51 PM
COHIBA--

Any update on this? Sure am interested.

Thanks,
FM

roscoe
January 15, 2003, 01:02 PM
That is one annoying web site.

G-Raptor
January 15, 2003, 09:51 PM
I'm always leary of exotic, expensive solutions to simple problems. However, the results of the test could be interesting.

Sven
January 15, 2003, 10:12 PM
THE WORLDS MOST ADVANCED AMMUNITION

At least they are modest.

also nothing like yoking post-9/11 fears with the - patriotic, nou doubt - AIR FREEDOM ROUND

AIR FREEDOM ROUND

This remarkable round is the terrorists worst nightmare. Under most circumstances, the AFR (Air Freedom Round) will not penetrate the skin of conventional aircraft, causing a decompression. It is also designed to not penetrate the aluminum backs of most airline seats, reducing potential collateral damage in the event of a shootout at 30,000 feet. Unlike rounds made of polymers that can generate lethal ricochet, the Extreme Shock AFR round will turn to harmless powder if it misses its intended target and hits a hard surface. It is the only round in the world with this level of performance and safety. This is also possibly the world's safest home defense round, as in most circumstances, it will fragment in standard 1 half-inch sheet rock wallboard. This bullet runs at plus-P type pressures, and should be used only in firearms of good construction and good working order.

9MM-85FAFR

9MM 85gr AIR FREEDOM ROUND TUNGSTEN-Nytrilium

Fragmentable Jacketed OpenTip
--1620 fps

-20 Round box
$42.99


For those of you packin' on those long flights where you need that extra peace of mind.

SkaerE
February 16, 2003, 01:26 PM
did he ever do the tests?

im interested.

Double Naught Spy
February 16, 2003, 02:56 PM
As with so many overly hyped rounds, I see we are left hanging again with a bunch of hype and claims of how good the company is and no data.

Let's see, on the 10th of Jan, Cohiba was going out 'tomorrow.' Tomorrow came and he was going out 'today.' Later that day, he hadn't done the tests because he wife took off with the digital camera. Of course, for those two days we kept hearing how good the company was from Cohiba who noted his only interests were his $70 investment in the box of ammo. Being as this is now February 16, I am guessing that he wife just didn't leave with the camera, but went on an extended vacation with it...although I am not sure why he could not have done some tests, shooting a few rounds, and just giving a verbal description of the results.

4thHorseman
February 16, 2003, 10:32 PM
Major bummer.

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