Looking for a carry gun: PCR, 239, or 83?


January 10, 2003, 03:08 PM
I am doing preliminary research for a carry gun and right now I'd like to get input on the CZ PCR, Sig 239 9mm, and CZ 83 in .380. I know of no place in the Los Angeles or Bay Areas that rent the small CZs, but I've fondled them and they both feel great. I rented the 239 and was less satisfied: the grip felt too small, I wasn't terribly accurate with it, and it jamed a lot (although that was probably because the slide locking lever was broken :mad: ). I own a CZ 75bd and I'm a big fan of the 225 and 226, so I expect all of these guns are great.

On paper they all seem pretty similar, so I was looking for personal experiences. Also, if anybody knows a place near SF or LA where the CZs can be rented, I'd be much obliged.

----------- CZ PCR---Sig 239----CZ 83
Ammo----9mm------ 9mm-------380 ACP
Cap.------10---------8----------- 10
Length-- 7.2 in.-----6.6 in------6.8 in
Height---5.3 in.-----5.1 in------5 in
Width----1.4 in.-----1.2 in------1.4 in
Weight---27.2 oz---25.2 oz---28.8 oz
Barrel----3.9 in.-----3.6 in------3.8 in

Thanks everybody,


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January 10, 2003, 03:36 PM
You left out the best choice - Glock 26! :cool:

BTW, congrats on being able to carry in LA.

January 10, 2003, 04:48 PM
Of your choices there, I would have to say either the SIG 239 or the PCR (or better yet, the new P-01 :cool: ). If you are getting the SIG, you can also look into other calibers like the 40 or 357SIG.

The Glock 26/27/33 is also a fine choice.

January 10, 2003, 04:49 PM
What about this?

Length-- 6.5 in
Height---4.95 in
Width----.90 in
Weight---26 oz
Barrel----4.0 in

What is it you say?

The new
Kahr T9 (http://www.kahr.com/pistols_KT9093novak.html) :D

January 10, 2003, 04:59 PM
Think of the PCR as a more compact. lighter and Discontinued
version of your 75BD.

The CZ83 is not much smaller than the PCR.

You can always buy a SIG or the CZ83(.380 only) but the PCR
is fast becoming a scarce gun.

January 10, 2003, 05:10 PM
PCR. The capacity is actually 13 or 14 rounds plus one in the pipe, with the hicap mags. You can sometimes find them , but they are are around $45 - $50.

January 11, 2003, 01:24 AM
Thanks everybody for the info so far. It's amazing the wealth of knowledge stored in this forum.

Onslaught, that T9 looks very cool: beautiful, almost perfect size, and only 0.9 inches wide :what: , but they aren't for sale in California. :( But it's worth it for Sarah Brady's A-

Of the CZs and 239: how concealable are these guns? Are they suitable for pocket carry? Also, does anybody know where in the Bay area or LA the PCR can be rented?

Thanks again,


EOD Guy in VA
January 11, 2003, 01:46 AM
The P239 is very concealable. Especially in a Blade-Tech UCH.
Believe it or not, it's shorter and thinner than a Beratta 85 .380auto.

January 11, 2003, 07:07 AM
Since you haven't written off .380s, take a look at the Sig P232--far better ergonomics than the P239, and at least for me, more concealable (even pocketable).

January 11, 2003, 07:49 AM
Out of the CZ's its a rough call...I like the PCR alot....:evil:
Like thats a hard one to call..anyway. Ive had 6 CZ Compacts/83's total and can tell you from carrying them the 83 carry's very very well. Its not suitable for a pocket gun...heavy and just a tad large. It is a stellar IWB gun.....
If you want a .380/Mak gun the little 83 is very very hard to beat...find Stephen Camps write up on this gun....
Ive got 3 gun rag comparisons of the little .380's..Sig, Beretta, Walthers, Bersa etc....even one pen'd by a Sig-ophile and the 83 beats it by a little bit in the end....love it....but still gun rags.

The PCR is my main carry...Ive got 2..one custom and one OEM.
Just about perfect...If I could carry Cond 1 or have the option...Id absolutely call it perfect.....15 rnds of 9mm, as accurate as the fullsize 75 and all of the "Tactical" bells and whistles that make it a better carry/defensive style gun...after all it was designed as a full time LE sidearm/backup weapon.

The 239 is a stellar little gun but after getting used to the way the 225-229's feel...I cant get used to the grip....just doesnt feel like a Sig to me. Just too little capacity also...but you can get on in 357 Sig..which counts for bonus points.....:D

Id look seriously at the PCR....as a primary carry gun..its very very hard to beat....Shoot well

January 11, 2003, 11:25 AM
I'm surprised nobody has pointed out yet you're comparing a $500 gun (P239) to a $400 gun (PCR) to a $300 gun (83), and two 9mm to a .380.
If money is no object either of the more expensive are fine choices. If cost is important and going down to a .380 doesn't bother you the CZ83 deserves all the praise it gets here. I have an 83, but I never carry it as my P-11 is smaller, holds more, and is more powerful (and was cheaper yet).


Oh, wait. You're in CA. Can you even get Kel-Tecs there?

January 11, 2003, 01:56 PM
If you're looking at pocket carry, take a look at any Kahrs that are available in your state. If you can't have them, then at least go with the 9mm instead of the 380. I don't feel the CZ83 provides enough in the way of compactness to compensate for the cartridge.

January 11, 2003, 02:12 PM
Sorry to hear you were not happy with the P239. I have 1300 rounds through mine so far without 1 FTF or FTE. I've been VERY happy with mine. If you can I'd suggest trying a P239 with a set of the Hogue grips.

OH if you are considering a 380 there is another option. The Bersa Thunder 380. under $300 and very reliable. But they are only 7+1.

January 11, 2003, 02:57 PM
Thanks for all of the help everybody. I'll try the 239 agian--shooting a broken gun isn't really giving it a fair shake--as well as some Kahrs and CZs, if I can find them. As for the permit, it's probably a good six months off so I've got plenty of time to shop around.

Thanks again everybody,


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