Gun records to the ATF?


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Mark Tyson
January 10, 2003, 05:40 PM
Is it true that when a gun dealer goes out of business he turns over records of all guns he's ever sold to the ATF?

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Greg L
January 10, 2003, 05:48 PM
Yes, unless he has been in business for over 20 years. After 20 years you can destroy records older than that.

Greg

KarlG
January 11, 2003, 12:30 AM
The best you could ever hope for is to purchase a gun and have the business burn up the next day. I wonder how many gun shop owners go through their files each day to make sure that the records over 20 years and one day get shreaded?

What is the ramification of sale of a business? If a 20 year old gun business sells, does the new owner keep the old records or do they all go to the ATF?

PATH
January 11, 2003, 12:33 AM
Does the ATF keep them past the 20 year date. If they do I guess I'll be buying paperless.

Hkmp5sd
January 11, 2003, 01:35 AM
Does the ATF keep them past the 20 year date.

Of course they do. The only records that ATF is unable to accurately maintain is the NFA registry.

sm
January 11, 2003, 01:49 AM
I forgot about that 20 yr rule. Been dealing with my gunsmith since the 70's. Humm, I need to call him tomorrow about something.;)

4v50 Gary
January 11, 2003, 03:44 PM
The requirement to surrender records at the close of business is very old.

KarlG
January 12, 2003, 05:24 PM
If the business changes owners, does that mean the old owner has to give up all of his old records?

Zander
January 12, 2003, 05:59 PM
If the business changes owners, does that mean the old owner has to give up all of his old records?Yes.

sm
January 12, 2003, 06:30 PM
According to records I only have 2 firearms,myCCW pcs.

Zander
January 12, 2003, 08:47 PM
According to records I only have 2 firearms,myCCW pcs.And if you have a "problem", the "authorities" will certainly assume that those are the only two firearms that you possess. :rolleyes:

rick_reno
January 12, 2003, 09:49 PM
Someone asked "If the business changes owners, does that mean the old owner has to give up all of his old records?"

and I believe an incomplete reply was provided. It's not required that the seller of the business forward the records to the ATF - it's optional.

The following comes from the ATF
http://www.atf.treas.gov/firearms/faq/faq2.htm

If someone is taking over the business, the original licensee will underline the final entry in each bound book, note the date of transfer, and 12 forward all records and forms to the successor (who must apply for and receive his or her own license before lawfully engaging in business) or forward the records and forms to the ATF Out-of-Business Records Center. If the successor licensee receives records and forms from the original licensee, the successor licensee may choose to forward these records and forms to the ATF Out-of-Business Record Center. The successor licensee will begin business with a new set of records reflecting any beginning inventory on hand. [18 U. S. C. 923( g)( 4), 27 CFR 178.127]

Zander
January 18, 2003, 11:03 PM
The following comes from the ATF... Since when does the code prevent the ATF from doing it their way?

The current interpretation in my neck of the woods is this:

If you are an FFL resigning your license, you will forward your 4473s to us. Period...

Not saying that the interpretation is different in other areas, but expressing severe doubt.

Gewehr98
January 19, 2003, 02:36 PM
Or am I missing something?

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