[juicy]

was wondering if it would be legal for me to buy AP ammo from someone out of state into CA

i looked in the firearms divison and i got this

12323. As used in this chapter, the following definitions shall apply:
(a) "Handgun ammunition" means ammunition principally for use in pistols, revolvers, and other firearms capable of being concealed upon the person, as defined in subdivision (a) of Section 12001, notwithstanding that the ammunition may also be used in some rifles.
(b) "Handgun ammunition designed primarily to penetrate metal or armor" means any ammunition, except a shotgun shell or ammunition primarily designed for use in rifles, that is designed primarily to penetrate a body vest or body shield, and has either of the following characteristics:
(1) Has projectile or projectile core constructed entirely, excluding the presence of traces of other substances, from one or a combination of tungsten alloys, steel, iron, brass, beryllium copper, or depleted uranium, or any equivalent material of similar density or hardness.
(2) Is primarily manufactured or designed, by virtue of its shape, cross-sectional density, or any coating applied thereto, including, but not limited to, ammunition commonly known as "KTW ammunition," to breach or penetrate a body vest or body shield when fired from a pistol, revolver, or other firearm capable of being concealed upon the person.
(c) "Body vest or shield" means any bullet-resistant material intended to provide ballistic and trauma protection for the wearer or holder.
(d) "Rifle" shall have the same meaning as defined in paragraph (20) of subdivision (c) of Section 12020.


reading that i see only handgun ammo

the ammo in question is 30'06 AP ammo which i believe is the only AP ammo that you can still have.

[Art Eatman]

I fergit who chambered a Contender-type critter in .308, but when BATF found out about it, they renamed .308 AP as Evil Pistol Ammo.

Art

[Ian]

.50 BMG AP and API ammo is legal and readily available. So is the .223 semi-AP SS109 stuff. I've also run across AP .303 British on several occasions.

By Federal law, you can buy any AP from non-FFLs. You just can't make it, import it, or buy it from a dealer. I don't know about CA law, though.

[juicy]

alright ;) i guess they just concider by CA law above, that as long as it cannot be chambered in a handgun ytou'll be alright, ive never seen or heard about 30'06 in a hand gun. so im guessing its OK

[CWL]

If it's classified as "AP", it's illegal.

[blue86buick]

ive never seen or heard about 30'06 in a hand gun.
Guess you ain't heard of the 30-06 barrel for the T/C. ;)

[uglygun]

You should see what happens when you get some of those M2 163grn AP pulls and load them into a 300WinMag case for about 400fps more than anything a 30-06Springfield can accomplish.


HUZZAH! penetrators sticking out the back side of a 1 1/4 inch plate!


I knew I should have gotten a 300RUM, then I could have had 3500fps of 163grn M2 goodness instead of the roughly 3200fps of moderate goodness my 300WinMag produced.



This was just one of those scientific "what if" questions I had to get answered, didn't know what a 300WinMag was capable of with those bullets. Now I know and knowing is half the battle.....

Penetrators sticking out after nearly making it through the plate at a distance of around 75yards from muzzle. Plate isn't hardened steel like armor plate but it isn't mild steel either, besides it's 1 1/4 inches :)
http://home.bak.rr.com/varmintcong/APplate/penetrated.jpg


Next up? 150grn AP pulls for 3400fps of steel melting swiss cheese making redneck fun.... I bet that one will make it through but still I catch myself desiring the 300RUM so that I could maybe get 3700fps, can you see a sickness developing here?


There have been other discussions on AP bullets for reloading, gonna stay away from 7.62x51mm/308Winchester for loading the stuff up. Besides, 300WinMag is more fun as velocity is king in this game.

[Preacherman]

Uglygun, what kind of barrel life can you expect with 3,700 fps .30-caliber loads???

:what: :uhoh: :scrutiny:

[Steve Smith]

That reminds me of the steel plates at the Dahlgren Naval Surface Warfare Center in Dahlgren, Va. Projectiles were a little bigger, of course, and so were the holes!

[juicy]

If it's classified as "AP", it's illegal.

no. M2 AP Ammo is specifically exempted :D

http://www.atf.treas.gov/firearms/legal/armor.htm

imma go pick up my span cans now :)

NOTE: THE FOLLOWING CARTRIDGES HAVE BEEN REMOVED FROM THE DEFINITION OF ARMOR PIERCING AMMUNITION:

5.56MM (.223) SS109 and M855 Ammunition, Identified by a green coating on the projectile tip.

U.S. .30-06 M2 AP, Identified by a black coating on the projectile tip.

[KC]

Ammo, stuff that has (for example) a tungsten core, is generally thought to be AP and there for wrong for a commoner to own it. UNLESS you have a box of the CCI (or equivalent) "Grand Slam" hunting bullets.
MilSurp steelcore may not be allowed at the local range, is something that us peons may legally posess, and has an awful lot in common with AP.

OTOH, the local cops may not know AP by visual inspection if they tripped over it. It is against the rules for you to import the stuff into the PRKa, but you can drive over the border and buy it at gunshows. (Be aware that doing so is a violation of blah blah blah, jail time of blah blah, required political correctness lectures...)

It's kinda neat to punch holes in steel plate, but the stuff tends to get expensive real quick. (Not that I would know, mind you.)

For what thats worth.

KC

[juicy]

so i cant but it from someone out of state?

[KC]

Sorry, no. It is illegal for any subject (LEOs are not included) in the PRKa to posess AP ammo in this state in any way, shape, or form.

Interestingly enough, it would seem to be illegal for us, so long as we are still subjects of this regiem, to purchase firearms in other states if we do not follow California laws. Yes Virginia, that means you can go to Idaho (where there would not seem to be necessary to present proof of residency, ony affirm that it is not illegal under federal law for you to purchase/posses) and still be subject to the asinine restrictions. I want to see the look on a gunstore owners face when, after paying in full, you ask him to hold your new toy for a week and a half without a good reason.

KC

[uglygun]

KC, I seem to recall that screen name from some place. You spend much time over on the AR15.com forums lurking, or better yet are you in the Kern County area?

[Steve Smith]

I tried to find some pics of the 8 or 10" thick plates at Dahlgren, but I can;t dig any up. Does anyone have some?

[KC]

-uglygun-

No, I dont spend much time at ar15.com, nevermind lurking the boards there. As far as Kearn county goes, no; I've driven through there a time or three, but never really gotten out of the car and wandered around.
I was part of the 249th DoD clan for a while--if you ever played that game, you might remember me from there. (Mmmm...MG42's, BARs and Greasguns, oh my....)

KC