.223 and H335


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maspears
January 7, 2008, 06:10 PM
Hi,

I am just getting started with reloading, and have a simple question. I have a set of Lee dies that came with the powder dipper, 1.6CC size. For H335, the Lee website has this as being equivalent to 24.8 gr. Is this too much for a starting load? The powder will be under 55 gr. Sierra bullets. Thanks for any help.

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spencerhut
January 7, 2008, 06:28 PM
Short answer, it will be okay. Mr. Lee swears by those little dippers and he's forgotten more about reloading than most of us will ever know.

You aren't likely to blow yourself up with ~25g charge of H335 in a .223 pushing a 55g FMJ.

You really need to invest in some books and a scale.

Galil5.56
January 7, 2008, 06:33 PM
If that is what the dipper will actually drop, then it is a bit more than what a starting load should be. Do you have a scale? Dipping accurately takes practice, and a scale is needed to see what you drop, and will show you how well your consistency is doing. H335 is a good one to dip, as its physical makeup is condusive to accurate, repeatable drop weights. To me, dippers were for nothing more than to speed up the process, not used to discern powder weight dispensed.

Sorry to sound negative, but IMO a scale is the first thing to buy before anything else, anything.

mallc
January 7, 2008, 07:07 PM
IMHO - The dipper will get you started. I still use the dipper in my Lee Loader for the 30-30s I hunt with.

Load the power into a small plastic tub. Take a single scoop through the power and scrape the excess off with a paper or business card. Do not shake or pack the powder into the dipper.

On the way home from the range, buy a scale.

Scott

627PCFan
January 7, 2008, 07:52 PM
You named exactly the combo I shoot. My best groups are with the base load of H335. Just test and see-

John4me05
January 7, 2008, 07:54 PM
Here you go for future referrence incase you dont have a manual
http://data.hodgdon.com/main_menu.asp

YodaVader
January 7, 2008, 08:05 PM
I have some older .223 AR-15 Sierra data which lists H335 with their 55 grain bullets at 22.9 - 25.9 grains. The load range may be different in their newer manual. Like the others mentioned a scale would be on my "to buy" list. No sense in "guessing" on your powder charges. Even if you choose to use the dipper the scale will allow you to verify the charge weight.

Coltdriver
January 7, 2008, 09:32 PM
My Lymans 48th shows a max charge of 27 grains of 335 under a 55 grain bullet.

Those dippers work just fine as long as you don't try to work your way up to a max charge using them. Stay conservative like you are and you will be fine.

You will also discover that max charges are rarely the most accurate.

John4me05
January 7, 2008, 09:39 PM
You will also discover that max charges are rarely the most accurate
This is something that most none of my friends who only load at my house with me never tend to believe.. They thing that reloading with the same weight powder everytime will produce 1 hole groups no matter the charge weight and that the fastest velocity listed for the top charge will be the holy grail of their guns

JonB
January 8, 2008, 11:06 AM
I use 24 gr of H335 with 55gr FMJ.

Lee manual shows 23-25.3gr of H335 when used with 55gr bullets. Lyman 48th shows 24.3-27 gr for a 55gr JSP bullet.

So you are good with the 24.8gr.

I, too, have the Lee die set with the dipper (10mm, 9mm, and .223) and would still suggest a digital scale. I found that I could get real close to what I wanted after dipping and weighing several 'scoops' of powder. But I also found that there is still variability in the dipping method - sometimes not enough, sometimes too much. Might not matter in .223, but when reloading pistol rounds where the range is 4.0 to 4.4 gr, there's not much wiggle room before you are over the max.

John4me05
January 8, 2008, 11:28 AM
If you use a dipper it is a very good scenario for using a powder trickler.... 1 dip and trickle up to your weight...

frankd4
January 8, 2008, 04:32 PM
24gr of H335 with a 55gr FMJ bulett chronos at about 2800fps.
24gr of WCC844 with a 55gr FMJ chronos at about 3040fps acording
to test I did last week, Wcc844 is just like H335 but about 10% hotter.
These test were on my chrono your results may verry, remember reloaded 223
does not have the crimped primers if you load too hot you can risk blowing out primers.

Lennyjoe
January 9, 2008, 07:53 PM
I use 24 gr of H335 with 55gr FMJ.
Me too. But I drop mine out of a Lee Autodisc set up on my progressive press. Plenty accurate for range loads.

TheLaxPlayer
January 10, 2008, 12:18 AM
What primers are you guys using with H335 for .223 rounds? My Speer manual says to use magnum primers, but I haven't heard anybody mention such a thing on here. Is it really necessary?

rundm
January 10, 2008, 07:07 AM
I use either rem 6 1/2 or 7 1/2 and fed 205 either match or regular. really no diff in the two fed primers except for a little better quality control from start to finish for the fed.

04JRB
January 10, 2008, 09:33 AM
I worked up from 22gr H335 on 55gr hornady v-max and ended up with a accurate load of 25 gr H335 with a 55gr v-max. I use CCI 400 primers and winchester cases. I use the 1.6cc dipper and it gets it very very close and trickle to 25 gr. ended up with 1/2-3/4 groups at 100 yds in a savage 12fv bull barrel 1:9 twist.

This has worked well from me. Im also new to this so I may get corrected on my thoughts. Im still weighing out every charge on my 5-0-5 scale till Im more comfortable with the powder dispenser.

jhansman
January 10, 2008, 11:10 PM
FWIW, I use the Lee dipper, but only to feed my scale. I have landed on a great load for my Savage 12 of 23.5gr of H335 under a 60gr. Sierra Varminter, and the 1.3cc dipper gets me close. Wish I could use it without the scale, but....

Great powder, BTW. Work with 'til you get your groups.

Clark
January 11, 2008, 12:34 PM
similar thread on THR about H335, .223, and 55 gr bullets (http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=303359&highlight=H335)

Lennyjoe
January 12, 2008, 12:05 AM
I use CCI Small Rifle magnum primers with H-335.

Clark
January 30, 2008, 08:49 PM
I am finding that the CCI450 magnum small rifle primer will go an extra grain of powder before piercing in a 6mmBR rifle with a large firing pin, that should really be a small firing pin.

I need to bush the firing pin hole and buy more CCI 450 primers.

Dave R
January 31, 2008, 08:22 PM
I use CCI Small Rifle magnum primers with H-335.I have used both those and Winchester WSR primers, with almost equal results. If anything, the Wins may be a bit more accurate.

frankd4
February 1, 2008, 02:40 PM
I use Wolf Primers 5000 for 89.00 from wideners, WCC844 from Pat's reloading
and 55gr hornady fmjbt from Midway. I have reloaded over eight thousand rounds with out a single bad one yet, and I do not crimp.

Walkalong
February 1, 2008, 02:45 PM
You cannot reload, long term, safely, without a scale. Get one. You'll be glad you did. :)

280shooter
February 4, 2008, 10:53 PM
I have used the Lee dipper years ago,God that was life ago,I had only one rifle,it was a 444 mar.and the only way i had to reload was to use the lee load all.well money was hard to come by way back then,and i enjoy shooting,so that 444 was my shoot everything,ground hogs to deer, with my 265 gr.it sure blew alot of stuff up, so any how,I did buy a real press and scale,my scale then and now is the 5-0-5,Now i have scale problems,when i zero it,and put a charge on the pan.i have a hard time figureing out if im over or under,it sure doesnt work like i did .I used to put a charge in the pan.and the nedle would ride nice and slow either right to 0 or close, now i have touch the beem to get this to move close to where i need it to be, i dont know if the magnet has effected the beam dampner,has anyone have ths problem,should I take the beam off the scale whle not being used

kelbro
February 4, 2008, 11:00 PM
Mycarz28, have you cleaned out the grooves that the 'knives' of the balance beam rides in?

Send it back to RCBS and they will repair it at no charge. No kidding!

theCZ
February 4, 2008, 11:10 PM
The good news is that you have three components that make getting accurate reloads easy; H335, A gun in 223 Rem, and a good weight bullet. All that's missing is that scale! Last year I had a very interesting experience with max loads and H335. A few years ago I bought a heavy barrel 223 that shot incredible groups with charges more on the min than max side. Last year I picked up a light 223 CZ rifle for a coyote and walking varmiter rifle. 1.5" 5 shot groups with everything but a close to max load (27.0g H335, depends on what manual you look into regarding max). That hot load gives me group sizes from .27" to .75" for 5 shot groups. I don't understand it, but I'm glad I kept testing!

Dave R
February 4, 2008, 11:59 PM
That hot load gives me group sizes from .27" to .75" for 5 shot groups.I love it when velocity and accuracy coincide.

280shooter
February 5, 2008, 12:49 AM
Yes i cleaned it up,i checked if the knife edge is rough.its still sharp,when i would put a charge in the pan,if i was a tad under i use my dribler,that would come up nice to 0,now if i put the pan on it,and if it bounces up,it stays up above the 0..so if i play with the beam some,it comes back down, so now i scratch my head,,wondring, how far am i off,,is that realy 21 grs,, so yes i guess i will sendit back,i dont like how its workng,I still have the box it came in. i keep all that stuff,

Mike 56
February 5, 2008, 01:47 PM
I like using dippers but Lees dipper charges for the most part are on the light side well below starting loads. So if you are going to use dippers you need a scale. Midway has a little electronic scale on sale for 30.00. My dipper technique is to rather than scoping the power i pour the power into the dipper then strike level. I get accurate charges using this method.

Mike

gunvices
February 5, 2008, 02:28 PM
The proper method for using the Lee Dippers isn't to scoop it through the powder but to push it straight down into the powder then turn it to fill completely.Then you pull it out and level off the scoop. This prevents compacting the charge as you would, to some degree, if you simply scoop through the powder. That's according to Lee's directions. Just thought you might want to know. I haven't used them but I did read that. Might prevent overcharge or inconsistent charges.

Galil5.56
February 5, 2008, 02:36 PM
I like to plunge the bottom of the dipper into a cup of powder, let powder fall in till well filled, then strike. This way there is no compaction if actually "scooped", and charge weights stay very uniform and consistent.

Of course this is my prefered method, and other ways can be consistent too. Some folks have a heavy hand, while others a light touch and as long as it's consistent for the weight you need, all is good.

If you enjoyed reading about ".223 and H335" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!