Man survives .223 Hits cell phone


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scrofcheck
January 19, 2008, 05:46 PM
http://www.krem.com/topstories/stories/krem2_011808_hootersshooting.34306e61.html

Just wondering if anyone else is having second thoughts about the .223
This guy was shot by a Police sniper but the bullet hit his cell phone. It damaged his cell phone but the individual was not hurt. Also, police fired 8 or 9 shots but only one hit the individual. I'm thinking maybe I should concentrate on the 7.62 x 51. Your Thoughts ?? Thanks

Well I can't find the article, cause there were so many stories. But one of the papers stated the Officer fired 8 or 9 rounds from 184 yds. One bullet went through the windshield and then hit the cell phone. They also stated they removed a shotgun from the perp.



Three officers approached the truck but Kimsey allegedly pointed a gun at them, Haug said. Two backup officers, at least one of whom was armed with a .223 caliber rifle, had taken position behind them as a precautionary measure.

At some point Kimsey fired a shot at the officers that hit one of the patrol cars, Haug said.

One of the backup officers returned fire from 185 yards away, sending eight shots tearing into the pickup truck, Haug said, adding that the bullet that hit Kimsey smashed through the windshield, hit a truck speaker, then was stopped by the cell phone battery.

After about two minutes and thinking he had been shot in the chest, Kimsey surrendered, Haug said.




http://www.spokesmanreview.com/breaking/story.asp?ID=13228

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benatilstate
January 19, 2008, 05:58 PM
I guess I didnt know anybody used .223 for sniping...I thought it was all .308ish at this point. Guess I was wrong. But honestly I think the .223 is the least of a "sniper"s problems if he can only hit a bad guy with 1/9 of his shots. The .308 will buck the wind better and be more accurate toward the extreme end of shooting ranges.

Don't Tread On Me
January 19, 2008, 06:39 PM
Did the article mention that it was a .223? Doesn't say what the officers were using, only that the perp had a small caliber rifle. We can assume that it was some type of autoloader being it was between 6-9 shots.

Too many police are using standard 55gr FMJ. After going through a vehicle, the bullet was likely slowed down tremendously as well as deformed. Still, you'd think a .223 would have more power than that. Hard to say. Did it hit something very hard and thick inside the door or the body of the vehicle? Not all hits on a vehicle are the same.

It is better to use at a minimum the 62gr NATO round with the mild steel penetrator. 69-75gr ammo is good too.

Chris Rhines
January 19, 2008, 07:01 PM
I'm thinking that maybe a single anecdote, especially one with as little information as that one, means absolutely bupkis.

- Chris

Bartholomew Roberts
January 19, 2008, 07:11 PM
A back-up officer inside the church fired between six and nine shots at Kimsey. One bullet passed through the truck and hit Kimsey's cell phone, which was in his shirt pocket. The bullet did not enter his body.

Did I miss something? I can't find where it says the officer even used a rifle, let alone where it says it was a .223 rifle. The guy who was shot is the one with the "small rifle."

In any case, auto safety glass is very hard on bullets, particularly .223. Check the Terminal Ballistics thread in the Rifle Forum Reading Library thread and you'll see that even 55gr FMJ barely penetrates 3-4" in gel after passing through auto glass. So I can find it believeable that either a handgun or rifle round might be stopped by a cellphone after punching through the laminated glass.

M2 Carbine
January 19, 2008, 07:27 PM
Considering that even out of a 9 inch barrel pistol the 55 grain .223 will fully penetrate 1/4 inch steel plate, a cell phone won't slow it down a bit but there is a lot of stuff in a car that will slow or stop a .223.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v135/Bell406_206B/KT223onsteelfront.jpg

rc109a
January 19, 2008, 07:49 PM
I have not been able to find any mention of 223 in any of the articles that I found. Where did you find this information?

Popov
January 19, 2008, 07:58 PM
adding that the bullet that hit Kimsey smashed through the windshield, hit a truck speaker, then was stopped by the cell phone battery.

So the windshield (thick 'safety' glass) plus truck speaker (I'm going with ricochet) and then the phone? I would suffice to say that the bullet that we're talking about was significantly slowed down and also a ricochet, most likely highly deformed and tumbling. In this instance, I don't doubt that the phone stopped the round at all, and probably without the presence of the phone the man would only have had a non-penetrating wound.

Details, details,

Popov

jakeswensonmt
January 19, 2008, 09:00 PM
I guess I didnt know anybody used .223 for sniping
185 yards is easy for the .223.

dscottw88
January 19, 2008, 09:28 PM
Countless amount of times where the .223 has been dumbed down and made to sound weak. Maybe we should make our troops keep track of every insurgent taken down by our M16s just to prove that all this "5.56 is too weak" stuff is bogus.

W.E.G.
January 19, 2008, 09:34 PM
Its entirely possible that a .223 bullet hit an object on the target, causing the bullet to deflect, and miss the target altogether. Nobody said the bullet hit the phone at a 90-degree angle like that steel plate posted above.

Probably not directly apropos this incident, but I had "personal dealings" with a guy who was shot in the forehead with a 9mm at a distance of about 5 feet. The bullet pierced the skin, and ran under the skin for several inches until the bullet exited the skin on the back side of his head.

Band-Aid front... Band-Aid back... on to the next event. True story.

Bullets do funny things. I'll believe a bullet can do some funny thing - even the most unbelievable-sounding thing - once. We've all seen the video of the .50 caliber bullet coming back from the steel plate and hitting the shooter in the head - who then got up to say nothing more profound than, "Am I bleeding?"

benatilstate
January 19, 2008, 10:12 PM
I guess I didnt know anybody used .223 for sniping

185 yards is easy for the .223.

I know that I am not doubting the accuracy of the .223 round. It is plenty accurate - I was simply stating that I didnt know it was considered a 'sniping' round.

GRB
January 19, 2008, 10:17 PM
All I can say, or need to say, is that the .223 was developed for use as a varmint round, it was never designed as a man stopper. Sure it can take someone down, kill him or her too, but a .308 would be a much better choice.

Eightball
January 19, 2008, 10:25 PM
A better title is "man survives after .223 round goes through windshield and car speaker and comes to rest in his cell phone."

The only problem here is the bullet weight the guy was using, and his inaccuracy with the weapon at hand, not the rifle itself. PLENTY of things would be rendered "less-than-lethal" after that obstacle course.

HorseSoldier
January 20, 2008, 11:32 AM
185 yards is easy for the .223.

Seems like quite a long range shot by the standards of law enforcement engagements, including deliberate sniper shots. The bullet will do the job at those ranges, but that figure makes me question the details in the story.

A better title is "man survives after .223 round goes through windshield and car speaker and comes to rest in his cell phone."

+1. Windshield glass is more than enough to start a 5.56mm round yawing, and a speaker housing would soak up a lot of energy if the bullet was tumbling and struck it broadside or heading that way.

Wes Janson
January 20, 2008, 03:11 PM
This doesn't sound like it was some sort of SWAT sniper shot, but more like someone with a patrol rifle decided to take their chances with a long shot. And while his aim might have been less than stellar, he WAS shooting at a concealed figure from a field position at close to 200 yards, under stress. It worked, and that's the important thing.

RockyMtnTactical
January 20, 2008, 05:43 PM
It depends on the loading as well. It would be interesting to know what load was used in this case. Most .223 rounds perform poorly through windshields.

Matt-J2
January 20, 2008, 05:47 PM
Could be that fellow was related to all those armor plated deer that have been showing up in recent years.:neener:

skinewmexico
January 20, 2008, 11:52 PM
A guy fell off an 11 story building and didn't get hurt the other day, does that mean 11 story buildings are safe to fall off? Shooting thru car windows, or any window, takes some training, and works better with certain ammo.

Matt-J2
January 21, 2008, 12:07 AM
A guy fell off an 11 story building and didn't get hurt the other day, does that mean 11 story buildings are safe to fall off?


Sure! It's just the part where you stop falling that has me concerned. :)

blackhawk2000
January 21, 2008, 12:23 AM
If you heard of a 12 ga slug being deflected off the brim of a baseball hat, would you rethink slugs as a defensive round? Poop happens.

2Ais4U
January 21, 2008, 12:27 AM
.223 is good, but im a big fan of the .308.

627PCFan
January 21, 2008, 10:23 AM
Just tested:

223 55gn NBT Vs. non-function razr @ 10 yards.

Winner- .223

Case dismissed

plexreticle
January 21, 2008, 10:36 AM
He wasn't shot by a police sniper and the truck body stopped the bullet not the cell phone.

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