Commie Gun Shopping List


PDA






Aaryq
January 21, 2008, 11:34 PM
Howdy folks.
I'm about half way through my deployment and I'm putting together a list of the guns I'm purchasing when I get back. Now the money I'm putting away for this is covering most of it, and once I get my tax returns and pay off some bills, my total budget will be set in stone. Right now, my budget is at or around $1000. This does not include ammo.

1 WASR-10...very plane Jane (no muzzle brake, bayonet lug, etc)
1 Non-Yugo SKS
1 Yugo SKS
1 91/30 Mosin Nagant
1 M44 Mosin Nagant
1 Makarov (non-double stack preferred, no pref for country of origin)
1 TT-33 Tokarev (no pref for country of origin)

If I have extra $$ laying around, a Saiga in either .410 bore or 20 gauge

My figuring is that my Yugo SKS and WASR 10 will stay with my old man in ND and I can bring the rest back to CA. My other figuring is that I can use the Makarov for my CCW, and the M44 for a fun range head turning project gun (I already have 1, might as well play with the other). I'll pro'lly do non-permanent mods to the Yugo to make it look "Tacticool" as well as using it for deer and the 91/30 for bigger than deer.

What do you think, THR?

If you enjoyed reading about "Commie Gun Shopping List" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!
Anteater1717
January 22, 2008, 01:54 AM
For the Non-Yugo SKS, get a Russian. The have the best fit and finish, plus they are the original SKS's.

chris in va
January 22, 2008, 02:31 AM
Or just skip the SKS idea and get the Saiga.

If you bought all those guns, it would certainly amount to a lot more than $1000.

$400
$300
$200
$100
$100
$300
Tokarev, not sure.

I have a Mosin. Most of the time it just sits in my safe. Not really fun to shoot to be honest.

Out of those listed, I'd get a Saiga x39 and convert it ($400), a Makarov ($300), a Saiga shotgun (~$400) and maybe a Mosin if you just have to get one. I can say that as I've had the others and just wasn't impressed.

blackhawk2000
January 22, 2008, 03:16 AM
You can't legally touch the Yugo SKS. It's a C&R gun, and there isn't enough US parts on the market to bring it up to 922R compliance. Plus your budget is blown big time.

Mojo-jo-jo
January 22, 2008, 04:16 AM
Yep, blown your $1000 budget big time.

You will be able to buy the Mosin Nagant and 2-3 others on your list for $1000.

For $1000, I would buy:
1. WASR-10 ($375)
2. Makarov ($250)
3. Russian SKS ($250)
4. M44 ($100)

Spend the remaining $25 on a box of ammo for any one of the above, or omit the Russian SKS and spend the remaining $275 on some ammo for all of the above.

Edit: Ooh, just noticed you were in CA. Prices will probably be higher than I stated.

vis--vis
January 22, 2008, 04:21 AM
I have a Mosin. Most of the time it just sits in my safe. Not really fun to shoot to be honest.

Really? I got bored with my AR-15 because of my Mosin. Love that gun.

flynlr
January 22, 2008, 04:25 AM
You can't legally touch the Yugo SKS. It's a C&R gun, and there isn't enough US parts on the market to bring it up to 922R compliance. Plus your budget is blown big time.
__________________

huhh? I have a yugo SKS and a C&R why would he not be able to touch it?:confused:

Mojo-jo-jo
January 22, 2008, 04:37 AM
huhh? I have a yugo SKS and a C&R why would he not be able to touch it?

18 U.S.C. 922(r) (http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/uscode18/usc_sec_18_00000922----000-.html#r)

Curio and Relic status weapons must be "in original military configuration (http://www.atf.gov/firearms/curios/sec2.htm)" (scroll down to "Yugoslavian") to retain C&R status. Otherwise, the Yugo SKS would be banned under 18 U.S.C. 922(r). It gets VERY convoluted, but what would make it non-importable falls under 18 U.S.C. 925(d)(3) (http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/uscode18/usc_sec_18_00000925----000-.html#d_3) (any military surplus semi-automatic rifle). What permits it is 18 U.S.C. 925(e)(1) (http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/uscode18/usc_sec_18_00000925----000-.html#e_1), which provides an exception to 18 U.S.C. 925(d)(3) for "rifles and shotguns listed as curios or relics" by the Attorney General. In order to qualify for the exception, it must remain in "original military configuration" as listed in the curio and relic list.

The reason we were able to import the Yugo SKSes without cutting them up and building them from USA made parts (like we have to do with AK's now) was that it is listed on the curio and relic list (http://www.atf.gov/firearms/curios/index.htm) pursuant to 18 U.S.C. 925(e)(1). If it wasn't on the curio and relic list, the Yugo SKSes would have to be de-milled (cut to pieces) before importation, then rebuilt on USA made receivers with USA made barrels and other USA made parts to comply with the list enumerated in 27 C.F.R. 478.39 (http://a257.g.akamaitech.net/7/257/2422/05dec20031700/edocket.access.gpo.gov/cfr_2003/aprqtr/27cfr478.39.htm), just like we have to with AK-47's now. This means that a Yugo SKS would cost $500 (if it was not C&R listed), just like a Yugo AK-47.

Confused yet? Good. That's the way the government likes it.

To put it simply, it's impossible to import most military semi-automatic rifles in anywhere near their original configurations into the United States today, unless the AG has declared it a "curio and relic." It's also nearly impossible to modify away from "original military configuration" a semi-automatic military surplus rifle imported as a "curio and relic" under 18 U.S.C. 925(e)(1) and as determined by the Attorney General, as this would be considered "assembling" a rifle from foreign parts under 18 U.S.C. 922(r). Technically, removing the bayonet from a Yugo SKS is a felony, as this makes it no longer "original military configuration.":eek:

So, you want to put a folding stock on your Yugo SKS??? In order to make it compliant with 18 U.S.C. 925(d)(3), you would have to replace ten of the parts enumerated in 27 C.F.R. 478.39 with USA made parts. The catch? There aren't enough qualifying USA made parts that fit the Yugo SKS. So, you just can't modify the rifle (unless you machine the parts yourself, I guess).

Ready for boiling blood??? The list enumerated in 27 C.F.R. 478.39 is a regulatory restriction, and can be modified by the BATFE at any time, without the approval of congress. A gun-hostile administration (BATFE is a cabinet-level bureaucracy) could add more parts to the list--in effect prohibiting the importation of ANY semi-automatic military surplus firearms, even those built on USA made receivers with mostly USA made parts! This is how barrels were interpreted as a no-no for importation by the BATFE (http://www.floridagunworks.com/ATF_Open_Letter_7_13_05.html) in 2005, and is the reason why we have spanking new USA made barrels with canted sights on Century manufactured AKs.

The C&R status of the Yugo SKS was determined a long, long time ago when it looked like they would never be imported in large numbers. It was one of the last semi-automatic firearms serving in an army in large numbers, and it's unlikely that any of the remaining arms will be added to the list. This is why many say that the Yugo SKS will be the LAST of the original-configuration semi-auto foreign military surplus rifles imported into the USA.

brentn
January 22, 2008, 04:45 AM
I'd probably ditch the yugo all together and grab a chinese and a russian SKS, theres nothing more commie than both those countries combined.

Tokerav is a great commie pistol, and like the AK is still in use today by commie countries. Many different flavours of it too, some are polish, russian, chinese even egyptian ones.

I have a chinese one, they are incredibly simple pistols with fewer parts than the 1911 but they use many of the same features. Very reliable but a real PITA to detail strip, particularily the hammer/sear housing

TheDisturbed1
January 22, 2008, 04:50 AM
C&R weapons must be "in original military configuration" to retain C&R status.

If only they had C&R AK-47's...

230RN
January 22, 2008, 10:43 AM
[THREAD DRIFT]

I have a Mosin. Most of the time it just sits in my safe. Not really fun to shoot to be honest.


I recently fired my "new" Mosin-Nagant 91/30 offhand and even though I consider myself recoil-sensitive, I found the recoil to be less sharp than with a Springfield 03-A3 with 150gr bullets in full-house .30-06 cartridges. But the recoil was sharper than the Garand (in cal .30-06) with 168 gr bullets.

And certainly not unbearable or "ferocious." I would not want to shoot one off the bench all day long, but I'm beginning to wonder if the perception that it kicks too much is because folks nowadays are used to the 7.62 X 39, 7.62 NATO, and 5.56 NATO cartridges in gas-operated firearms.

I may change my mind when I get a Mosin-Nagant M-38 or M-44, which are shorter-barreled and lighter than the loooong-barreled 91/30, but that was my experience with the 91/30 this weekend.

[/THREAD DRIFT]

Sorry, but I had to point that out.

Neo-Luddite
January 22, 2008, 01:19 PM
Hold on just a bit--Technically, removing the bayonet from a Yugo SKS is a felony, as this makes it no longer "original military configuration."

That is NOT exactly so--ATF has ruled in the case of the Yugo that;
1) The Bayo can go, but the mount must stay (considered temporary).
2) The Grenade launcher can go, but the threads must be covered by a soldered on cover (not a flash hider).
3) Optics can be added via a 'temporary' mount dust cover or replacement handguard.
4) spring-return adapted firing pin is OK (Murray type to prevent slam fire)

No (of course) on synthetic stocks, hi-cap mags, non-stock or significantly non-replica parts.


Now that said--the biggest downside to the Yugo is that cheap ones are getting scarce and that they require some specialized parts that are not as easy to get. It really is a bulky SKS, and heavy for what it does--but it was built with pretty good quality and fit for a 150.00 rifle.

Otherwise Mojo-jo-jo, you are spot on AFAIK; it's all at the whim of the BATF and can change anytime.

zoom6zoom
January 22, 2008, 01:35 PM
You need to add a Nagant revolver to your list!

If you enjoyed reading about "Commie Gun Shopping List" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!