Smart Antis who aren't Politicians.


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CZ 42
January 24, 2008, 09:58 PM
My English teacher told the whole class today that there needs to be more gun control. Not the two-hands kind though, the British kind. He said, "Look at London. There isn't any crime there." I cried out, "Are you freaking kidding me?" And he said no, as a matter of fact I'm not, and look at Michael Moores' Movie if you don't believe me. I told him I saw it several times and it was mostly bull. Besides that, it was actually a pro-gun movie disguised as anti. He says the media is to blame, but maintains that all gun owners are nuts who keep their guns irresponsibly loaded and are actually mostly blind peope who just spray'n'pray :banghead:. This didn't stop my teacher, who has two little girls that he should be ready to protect, not to immerse them in ignorant denial, he kept on. He interrupts me to say "Well Joe, you're a gun nut and we know what you're gonna say. Nevermind. Hahahahah..." and just laughs me off. Now I'm pissed because I'm sure my classmates think he's an intelligent guy, and he probably made up their minds for them on guns. Why do people think these things? I used to like my English teacher. Why do smart people go for this? It's exasperating. I mean, this dude's got KIDS! He reads Douglas Adams!

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cornman
January 24, 2008, 10:04 PM
Nothing wrong with his opinion. Personally I would rather live in a world without guns, but that is not going to happen until the world changes in a big way.

Blackbeard
January 24, 2008, 10:07 PM
Why do smart people go for this?

Probably because they're not really that smart. They were told something by someone they thought was smart, and if they repeat it, that makes them smart.

look at Michael Moores' Movie if you don't believe me

I'm amused that a teacher would cite a movie as proof of his assertions. That's like saying that whites are superior, and if you don't believe me watch Birth of a Nation. Utterly ridiculous.

CrawdaddyJim
January 24, 2008, 10:09 PM
Some Other Time

JWarren
January 24, 2008, 10:12 PM
Personally I would rather live in a world without guns, but that is not going to happen until the world changes in a big way.

And I pray I never see that day.


Thank God our Founding Fathers had the wisdom to codify what they understand as our rights.



By the way, don't let this turn you against teachers. I know LOTS of teachers who are VERY pro-RKBA. My wife, my father, and my sister (And she is a COLLEGE PROFESSOR) are three. I can think of a few dozen more as well.


Another By the Way.... the thread title is misleading. Educated does not necessarily mean "Smart." I know a lot of very educated people who couldn't find their butts even if they had a big ole "Butt Map." I know many people who never when to college who exude true wisdom from experience.

-- John

TCB in TN
January 24, 2008, 10:13 PM
After completing his class I would mention to the Admin that an English teacher should be spending MORE time teaching English rather than focusing on politics.

OAKVILLE SHOOTER
January 24, 2008, 10:14 PM
Quote:
Nothing wrong with his opinion. Personally I would rather live in a world without guns, but that is not going to happen until the world changes in a big way.

WOW
And you are hanging out on a 2A website for what reason?


I was wondering the same thing.

I would like to live in a world where we don't need guns for protection. A world where no shots were fired in anger. But definitely NOT in a world without guns. I like hunting and target shooting too much. Nothing like the smell of burnt gun powder.

geekWithA.45
January 24, 2008, 10:22 PM
So, class, what have we learned?


* That intelligent people can cling to and assert unintelligent ideas in the face of incontrovertible evidence. (It happens all the time. Physicians assert that men have more ribs than women because of Genesis, mathematicians deny evolution, Americans assert socialiam, the list goes on)

* That some people will abuse their positions of authority to spread their ideology.

Crunker1337
January 24, 2008, 10:23 PM
Speak to the teacher privately. Politely state that you feel personally insulted that he totally brushed off your opinion classifying you into a group that you didn't necessarily want to be. Point out that even if you are a "gun nut" (which is a derogatory term that belittles all weapons enthusiasts) your argument is still valid, and for him/her to brush it off like that is the fallacy of argumentum ad hominem--a term I just learned in English, haha.
Don't even discuss the issue, just point out that you feel insulted and belittled, and no teacher has a right to make a student feel that way just for having a different political opinion.

JWarren
January 24, 2008, 10:24 PM
After completing his class I would mention to the Admin that an English teacher should be spending MORE time teaching English rather than focusing on politics.


FAR too many English teachers seem to want to use the classroom as a stage for their political views. I say this as a person who has a English Literature Bachelors. It doesn't get any better on the college level.

On a positive note, I am retiring from investments soon and....gasp!... about to be taking a position as an English Teacher. Gee.... where should I begin the indoctrination? (kidding! -- but at least I will know of ONE classroom where agendas will not be shoved down kids' throats.-- Shakespeare will do fine.)


-- John

The Unknown User
January 24, 2008, 10:25 PM
It sounds to me like that teacher's supervisor needs a good talking to.

Zoogster
January 24, 2008, 10:31 PM
The "smart" antis who are not politicians are usualy the ones you don't know about or hear from. They work tirelessly personaly funding, setting up charities and doing other things to fund thier cause.

If you trace the source of funds for many anti gun entities they usualy go back to a couple sources. Those sources also often pay for many things that on the surface appear unrelated to gun control, but actively support it as well, sometimes while doing other services.

The entities you usualy hear from and are in the press are often the foot soldiers of the operation.
A couple very powerful individuals fund numerous "independent" entities, and multiple organizations. It gives the appearances there is actualy more of them than there really is, while at the same time allowing some to be extreme and work directly for the cause, and others to be moderate and be more subtle while leading "recruits" in that direction slowly.

mustanger98
January 24, 2008, 10:34 PM
Not English class, but when I was in college Poli-sci and Public Speaking, my professors didn't try to indoctrinate their students.

Poli-sci, the professor said "I have very strong opinions, but in context of this class, you will never know what they are."

My Public Speaking professor didn't try to ram Conservative down their throats either.

Dr. Peter Venkman
January 24, 2008, 10:36 PM
Nothing wrong with his opinion. Personally I would rather live in a world without guns, but that is not going to happen until the world changes in a big way.

Yeah, because when the strong were able to wield the swords better than the weaker ones the world was much better. :rolleyes:

Jim K
January 24, 2008, 10:45 PM
Teachers get, and promote, some funny ideas. I was once told by a woman teacher in an art class that, while "Da Vinci" means "from Vinci", it was just a name as there was no such place as Vinci.

I asked if that affected my travel alarm clock. She inquired, in her usual snobbish way, just what my clock had to do with Leonardo. I said that I had bought it in the little electric shop down the street from the church in Vinci and if there was no such place, did my clock still work?

You should have seen her trying to wiggle out of that one.

Jim

Cmdr. Gravez0r
January 24, 2008, 10:53 PM
He reads Douglas Adams!


That's your first problem right there. Anyone who reads and thinks they understand the Hitchiker's Guide (don't even start with me on the movie) which is actually a very philosophical work, certifiably has no life. I read it through, decided I was done being a geek, and went and bought a gun. Well, that's the short version. If the man reads and appreciated Adams then his head is statistically in the clouds on a few things.

CZ 42
January 24, 2008, 11:13 PM
Actually he just read the first. I told him to read the rest just recently. I think it's the best series of any kind, ever. If you knock it like that, you must not've understood it :neener:. It's my Bible. You look at everything differently after you read them all a couple times. And yes, the movie sucked... But it was Hollywoodized, they used some bits as comic relief and the original names. I agree, it is a very philosophical work. I certainly think it's better to adhere to a system of 'parables' like the Guide than to rely on stuff like the bible that was written for power and control. The Guide was written because he was drunk in Austria and thought it'd be nice to have a guide to the Galaxy.

Number 6
January 24, 2008, 11:39 PM
Academics have specialties like anyone else. I am sure your English professor is very good at writing and other aspects of the written word that are pertinent to his discipline, but that does not translate into being informed about gun control. I am sure if you stuck me in a molecular biology classroom the professor would think that I was an idiot. Being smart does not mean you are right, and a good academic would admit that they are uniformed about a particular issue.

Poli-sci, the professor said "I have very strong opinions, but in context of this class, you will never know what they are."

That is the approach I take.

jakemccoy
January 25, 2008, 12:24 AM
Wow, your English teacher is out of control. Is he a bit older and just doesn't hold anything back anymore? From what you told me, he doesn't strike me as someone I would call intelligent.

Kim
January 25, 2008, 12:36 AM
I think I would tell him I am paying him to teach me English not Constitutional Law or his opinions on gun control. When did professors become Gods and not just paid teachers who is working for those who pay them.

doc2rn
January 25, 2008, 12:41 AM
If it bothers you that much take it to the Dean of Student Services. We are to refrain from talking about such things for fear of provoking another VT, remember.
For the prof print off a list of violent crimes by year for England. No guns allowed didn't keep rapist at bay, it spurred them on. I bet personal crimes over there quadrupled since the ban.

RyanM
January 25, 2008, 12:57 AM
Being competent in your field of employment is not to be confused with intelligence. This is a mistake the "sheeple" make all the time, and why stuff like anti-gun articles in the New England Journal of Medicine sway their opinions.

Shadow1198
January 25, 2008, 01:03 AM
Find some relevant and substantiated facts, bring them to class, and prove him wrong. FBI crime records are a start http://www.fbi.gov/research.htm There are plenty of examples of areas with gun bans or heavy gun restriction having significantly higher crime and violent crime rates than many areas with a larger percentage of citizen gun ownership. Hell, Washington D.C., the capitol of our nation has one of the most ridiculous crime rates ever for a city it's size, yet for the past ~30yrs they've had some of the toughest gun control policies and outright bans on handguns. And that's the capitol of THE FREE WORLD for God's sake! By all logic it should be the safest place in the world. As of this exact point in time in regards to crime in the UK, I'm not entirely sure however I was under the impression since guns have almost entirely been banned in the UK (there are some exceptions from what I understand), crime has sky rocketed. Some people are entirely too stupid or too corrupt to concede their own errors or misconceptions to the facts and the truth, and it is usually pretty apparent when confronting them with the truth.

Vermont
January 25, 2008, 08:36 AM
That's ridiculous (on the teacher's part). The fact that your teacher holds those views is one thing. You can still respect him despite that, but the fact that he would laugh off your views on the subject is completely inappropriate.

You said you liked the guy, so he must have some redeeming qualities. Perhaps one of those qualities is an ability to apologize. I would go talk to him and tell him that it upset you that he would treat your opinions with such disdain. Don't force him to apologize, but give him the opportunity to realize his mistake.

If you were respectful throughout the whole debate, and I'm sure you were, you two should be able to work it out. You might not turn him into a gun lover, but he might be able to earn back some of that respect he lost when he laughed at you. The first step is to repair the relationship. It will make the rest of the school year easier. Then perhaps you can have the same debate in class again and the teacher will let you have your say.

I have found that some of the best relationships I have had with teachers or coaches come after one of us has the need to apologize to the other.

Best of luck,
Hector

Neo-Luddite
January 25, 2008, 09:17 AM
FAR too many English teachers seem to want to use the classroom as a stage for their political views.

Yes JWarren; that's one of the best perks the job has! The Social Studies teachers are pretty good at that, too. One of my students accussed me of me a frustarted talk show host.

CZ42: talk to your teacher in private. Most people who like Douglas Adams can be reached on some level.

Robert Hairless
January 25, 2008, 01:55 PM
Don't be rash. You might be on to a good thing.

Because your English teacher thinks that movies reflect the reality of life, you might want to tell him that you just heard about the 1956 move Tea and Sympathy. In it the wife of a headmaster in an English school introduces a shy 17-year-old to sex. In the 1958 movie Teacher's Pet a female journalism teacher has a romance with a male student.

Ask your English teacher for the signup sheet in your school.

Ask him also how he got to know so much about guns although he has no experience with them. If he got all his knowledge from watching movies and reading what other people said about them, suggest that he give you an "A" in the course because you saw a lot of films based on literature and can read the Cliff's Notes and Wikipedia summaries of everything in his course over the weekend.

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