An About Face After Being Saved by a Gun Owner


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Mainsail
January 25, 2008, 06:03 PM
Don't see this posted anywhere (http://www.keepandbeararms.com/newsarchives/XcNewsPlus.asp?cmd=view&articleid=680):

Forgive me, for I have sinned.

An About Face After Being Saved by a Gun Owner

Sent in by Brian Clifford, from his Dear Friend

I am one of those people who you loathe. One of those invisible people who come into your living room without asking your permission. One of those people who follow you while you shop, and make it harder for you to make legal purchases. One of those people who try and tell you how to raise your children, as if you don't know how. One of those who gives ratings to stations that promote our demise as a free nation. I am your enemy. Or at least I was.

I followed it all, all of the propaganda, all of the hoopla. Believed it too. Believed that leaving my house was more dangerous than being in a war. At any given moment one of you evil gun owners would open fire on me. I saw the NRA stickers, the Gun owners of America stickers on the cars that passed, and I thought you were all fools. I did everything in my power financially to try and help more laws pass that would prevent you from owning guns. I wholeheartedly believed that only the Police, and Military should have guns. Every time I heard of a gang shooting, or other criminal act committed with a gun, I honestly believed that if we could curtail the legal sale of guns, we could make a difference.

Boy was I wrong.

I have children, three actually, and to me the only thing more important than raising them properly, was seeing that they aren't hurt in anyway. I wanted to ban guns, save my children, save all children. No child should have to be part of any kind of death, especially the kind that involves being shot. I gave money to all of the anti gun organizations I could think of, went to the "Million" Mom March, even looked at Rosie when she spoke, and actually admire her. Brought the kids as well, and even yelled some not so nice things to those other marchers. I'm sure some of you know who I refer to.

I was on my way back from the march, on my way back to Connecticut, when I stopped off of the highway at a rest stop by one of those McDonalds they have off I-95. By this time I had dropped off two of my kids with their father, and only had my little one with me. I went into the restroom with her, and on my way out noticed two men hanging out by my car. There were only two other cars in the lot at the time that were anywhere near my vehicle. I immediately felt threatened by their demeanor, but continued on to my car. The smaller of the two approached me with a knife as I was about to open the door to put my child in her car seat. He yelled at me to get in the back of the car, they were taking me for a little ride. I obviously told them to just take my keys, they could have the car, but they insisted I get in the back. I then heard a man yelling something I don't quite recall, and saw him running towards me with a gun in his hand. The two men vanished into their car, and sped away. I stood there frozen in time, and by the time the gentleman with the gun got to me I just broke down and cried.

To make a long story short, you were all right, and I'm sorry. This man with a gun saved me, and I just keep thinking if I had gotten my wish and guns were banned, there is no telling where I'd be, and what would've happened to my daughter. The only regret I have is not getting the man's phone number who saved my life. I thanked him over and over again, and told him that he saved me, but he calmly said to me something I'd never forget. He said "That's what people like me are here for Ms., and I'm happy to have been able to help."

"That's what people like me are here for," those words keep on running through my head everyday. Maybe this gentleman by some chance is part of your group, and will read my message. If he does I would just like to say something to him, and to everyone else reading this note.

Thank you for saving my life, and to the rest of you thank you for fighting for this man's right to protect me and my child. Tell him for me that I will no longer be part of the group who invades his home, and tries to tell him how to store his guns. Tell him I will never be part of any group who tries to make it impossible for him to buy his tool he used to save me. And tell him I will never again tell him how to raise his children properly, because obviously I was oblivious to the fact that responsible people such as him know how to raise their children better than I do. I did rectify that situation the other day; I bought a shotgun for home protection, and am in the process of getting my concealed permit. Next time I will be ready to defend myself, or others for that matter. Some of my friends think I'm crazy, but they try their best to understand. I just tell them that as soon as their child's life is put in jeopardy by some criminal with a weapon that they will understand, but until then don't tell me how to live my life. I've lost some friends, but surprisingly most of them understand. If not for this man I could very easily have been killed or raped, and my child could've been taken from me, so once more I need to say thanks for saving me, and with all sincerity to the rest of you, forgive me, for I have sinned.

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biscuitninja
January 25, 2008, 06:09 PM
Since its unconfirmed, its difficult to say. But I know something similar has happened. They don't want to admit, but quietly they have been looking at protecing themselves.

good luck
-bix

MarshallDodge
January 25, 2008, 06:54 PM
I like the story but I am having a hard time believing it as well.

Otahyoni
January 25, 2008, 07:18 PM
I got the same story from the USCCA mailing my dad got.

average_shooter
January 25, 2008, 07:27 PM
Post #20 in this thread: http://thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=334123

I don't know if that counts as a duplicate or not... Mods?

Good story, though.

Cougfan2
January 25, 2008, 09:07 PM
Although I like the story, I'm having a hard time believing it without some kind of confirmation. Sad, but true! :(

JKimball
January 25, 2008, 09:33 PM
Kind of had me rolling my eyes too. Great story if it's true. It is even great if it isn't true, as it is certainly describes a plausible scenario, but we're setting ourselves up if we try to pass it off as true without any documentation.

Larry Ashcraft
January 25, 2008, 09:42 PM
Mods?
Technically its not a duplicate, so I'll let it run.

Good story, but I too would like some documentation.

Bruce333
January 25, 2008, 09:46 PM
Here's the original (from Oct 2000):

http://www.keepandbeararms.com/information/XcIBViewItem.asp?ID=1451

Still doesn't mean the incident actually happened exactly the way described, but someone did write the story and keep and bear arms posted it.

Lots of other good stories on their site:

http://www.keepandbeararms.com/information/XcInfoBase.asp?CatID=88

granuale
January 25, 2008, 10:04 PM
the Gun owners of America stickers

hmmmm. I'm calling B.S. on this one. I'm an avid gun guy and I've never even seen a GOA sticker on a car - this anti-gunner did?

Bruce333
January 25, 2008, 10:11 PM
They do have bumper stickers and license plate frames. I've never seen any of these on a car either.

http://www.gunowners.org/merchandise.htm

http://www.gunowners.org/bump03.gif

kansas45
January 25, 2008, 10:20 PM
BS or not, it's how we should present ourselves to the gun-fearing sheeples. Gentlemen. Knight's in Shining Armor. Just anoher guy or gal defending the safety of those not able to defend themselves. All in a day's work, mam.

Aguila Blanca
January 25, 2008, 11:24 PM
hmmmm. I'm calling B.S. on this one. I'm an avid gun guy and I've never even seen a GOA sticker on a car - this anti-gunner did?
I saw one just last week.

If it wasn't the first one I've ever seen, it was the second. They aren't as prevalent as NRA stickers, but they do exist.

RiflemanTripleEight
January 25, 2008, 11:31 PM
It's a true story.

carnaby
January 26, 2008, 01:58 AM
Rifleman, how do you know? I'd like to believe it, but the story teller sounds too much like one of us, given the use of jargon and so forth. It could be true, but I'm going to treat that one with scrutiny until I see some sort of verification. If it's not true, and we pass it off as true, that would be damaging.

Cannonball888
January 26, 2008, 02:28 AM
It's bogus. Carnaby is right. Sounds like a long-time RKBAer wrote it.

chris in va
January 26, 2008, 03:02 AM
Also posted on TFL.

Hey, if it's true...great. If not, just preaching to the choir.

Guntalk
January 26, 2008, 10:54 AM
Whether it's true or not, you can expect to see it posted here and on other gun boards, and to show up in your email, for the next 10 years.

It does sound a bit orchestrated. Doesn't mean it's not true, but . . .

JerryM
January 26, 2008, 11:02 AM
I think it is too "Pat." If it is true I would like to see something more official than a post on a gun forum. I would think that the NRA would pick up on this and run with it if it were true.

Regards,
Jerry

Owens
January 26, 2008, 11:44 AM
Bogus.....maybe.
Truth......maybe.

However, it is a decent read and MAY come in handy to give to someone who is an anti that has a flash of open mind.

I know of a couple of folks that may benefit from this.

Grizzly Adams
January 26, 2008, 12:41 PM
Would like to believe it's true, but like most of the rest, I need proof!

Liberty4Ever
January 26, 2008, 12:46 PM
I just received this in an email from a friend, another gun owner. I came here to see if it was true or not. Here's the email response I had already composed to send to my friend.


The premise is sound, but this looks like a hoax... fiction written to influence opinion. Until I have some documentation to support any of the vague statements, I will continue to assume that it's a hoax. I'm a skeptic, but it seems too convenient that there were no names and date given that would allow any fact checking. There is no police report or any other paper trail. The location is vague, at some rest stop on I-95 on the way back to Connecticut. True stories usually have some verifiable facts.

As a work of fiction, it is useful to present a hypothetical case for gun ownership, but if it's fiction, it should be presented as fiction. I'm mad that our government lies to us to justify actions that are contrary to the good of U.S. citizens. I'm mad that the anti-gun lobby lies to sway public opinion, again, in a direction that is contrary to the common good. I can't condone fighting lies with lies. I think there are still enough people who can distinguish lies from truth, that the best strategy is to fight lies with truth.

Pax Jordana
January 26, 2008, 12:59 PM
He said "That's what people like me are here for Ms., and I'm happy to have been able to help."

I stood, dumbfounded. "You mean, you were going to stick that awful thing in that poor disadvantaged youth's face and blow his brains out?"

"It's a right, ma'am. Not a privilege. Besides," he said, casting an uneasy glance at the clouds moving past the almost-full moon, "I'm a sheepdog."

Who was I, a woman, to argue with Man Logic? I had reached into my car to grab my cell phone - I was going to put a stop payment on that check to the brady campaign - and when I turned around, he was gone. Nought remained but few drops of sweat that smelled suspiciously of whiskey. Far away on a hillside, I saw a small dark silhouette, and heard its lonesome cry. The sheepdog. The warrior. Protector of the innocent.

I vowed that night never to sleep with my spineless, hillary loving husband again.



See, with a little revision that could've been an A+ paper.



We all agree that violent incidents can be traumatic, but one incident might not be enough to do it. I think that very very few people come from the other side without help - a confrontation might do a lot to plant the seed, but what does one do when one perceives "so many" of one thing, and only one exception? Facts notwithstanding, maybe she just got lucky and guns really aren't a good idea for anyone else. Thus, my vote goes for fiction.

Evil Monkey
January 26, 2008, 01:02 PM
I'd say the story is a hoax due to the fact that it is common knowledge that anti's have no logic and cannot rationalize.

The reality is that even if such an event was to take place, the anti-gun lady would have called the police on the guy with the CCW. She would explain in an unintelligible and unreasonable manner how the guy with the gun was more dangerous to her than the knife wielding perpetrator who was ready to take her for a ride.

:D

Sharps-shooter
January 26, 2008, 01:08 PM
I can tell from the way this person talks that they are making stuff up. Not to say this story didn't happen, it probably did happen, it's probably happened many times in fact; just not to the person who wrote this bit. It reads a bit like a Chick tract, doesn't it (aside from being about guns and not christianity)? I wouldn't be surprised to find this in comic-book form left in the waiting room or somewhere like that.

I liked pax jordana's revision better.

MIL-DOT
January 26, 2008, 01:21 PM
(quote) "I liked pax jordana's revision better."

Yeah, me too !! Had me laughing out loud !!!

Colt
January 26, 2008, 01:33 PM
Good story, but I have to toss the BS flag for 2 reasons:

- GOA stickers. Never seen one.
- The writer purchased a shotgun for home defense, and is now looking into getting her carry permit? Newbies usually purchase a handgun first. Later they learn that a shotgun might be a better choice for the home. A shotgun first and handgun next is the "right" order, but newbies don't usually know or follow it.

One last point - no police involvement? No police report? A long-time, vicious anti is going to call the cops when this happens. They aren't going to have an epiphany right on the spot and just walk away. And even if she didn't, the guy who pulled his gun should have, and she would have been included in the report.

Big Boomer
January 26, 2008, 01:46 PM
Although I would like it to be true, I'm calling BS, mainly in reference to the gun as a "tool" for use. Only a big RKBA advocate uses this argument. The terms are off and too specific.

Also for a defensive gun her first purchase was a shotgun??? Given the circumstance it would have most likely been a handgun of some sort, and possibly reference to at least pepper spray at first. For a first timer I find it really hard to believe that a shotgun was the first purchase. My wife HATES my shotguns, they are too loud, kick too hard, and are big and heavy. She is still relatively "new" to shooting (4 years).

If only converts were that easy. The other thing is logically she most likely would not have put 2 and 2 together and thought the man with the gun was part of the gang and was going to shoot her, she had a kid with her as well, while as a robbery is a possibility, an abduction with a child is unlikely as for one, they are loud, 2 unless they are pedophiles (highly unlikely with 2) they wanted her, women with children tend to fight more.

An open McDonald's parking lot, although a possibility, would have much more likely occurred in a much less populated place. They also usually take place where surveillance cameras are not in use, McDonald's has them all over the building, including inside.

Another point is if this was "off the interstate" most likely they got there by some means other than walking, so where is the car? Far more likely they would do an abduction in their own vehicle, and as it seems planned a vehicle other than something that would make it difficult to sexually assault someone in a cramped car.

As stated before, while possible, highly unlikely.

Travis McGee
January 26, 2008, 01:50 PM
It might be fiction, but it's "true" now and forever, because it's on the internet.

Like the bogus writings attributed to George Carlin, it will never die.

(At least when I write fiction, I don't hide the fact that I made it up.)

http://matthewbracken.web.aplus.net/bookcover.jpg

JKimball
January 26, 2008, 02:48 PM
The email address they provide for Brian Clifford is not an active account. "Mailbox not found" If this is from 2000, that is pretty understandable, but still it only casts more doubt on the story.

I'm thinking best case scenario, this is fiction based on a true story. That or the letter writer got a lot of help composing the letter from an RKBA activist.

Sage of Seattle
January 26, 2008, 03:03 PM
I searched on Snopes for it, didn't find anything one way or the other. I submitted it to them so perhaps they can do some more digging around. They have several hundred gun related stories they've checked out, so hopefully they'll take this one.

Anyone else know of some fact checker websites to verify with? I'm with most here in that it sounds too pat to be fully honest.

Tinman357
January 26, 2008, 09:27 PM
Never mind.....

Sage of Seattle
January 26, 2008, 09:43 PM
Yes, I called the police.

Ah. And how did you then respond when they started asking questions and start collecting some... oh, I dunno... proof and stuff that a crime did indeed take place?

But, for the nay-sayers and "I need proof" nazi's, That's the same as calling someone who posts here a liar.

Really? So what happens then if it's proven to be a false story? Or wait, I guess we'd never know, seeing as how we all should take these stories at face value.

Sure, take it and everything else you see on the idiot-net with a grain of salt. I do.

Ah. So I shouldn't ask for some verification about a story I'm interested in and would frankly like to believe, but instead I'll just toss it, along with every other opinion on the 'net, in the trash as none of it really has any value, until, somehow, magically, some proof appears one way or the other?

If you "need proof" of my incident...... Bite me.

Why take it so personally?

JerryM
January 26, 2008, 09:58 PM
Although I do not wish to offend anyone here, I do need more proof than a post from someone second hand.
So if one is offended because I don't believe it then so be it.

Personally, I doubt that such an incident ever happened anywhere to anyone. I think it might take a gullible person to accept it at face value. I accept that some CHL might have saved someone from rape or serious harm, but even then I don't take such posts at face value. It is too easy to make exorbitant claims on the internet.

I once read a post on one of the forums posted by a guy (The Poster himself) who thwarted some gang members. Later they attacked him at home in his yard, and the tale of how he fell and rolled and shot them up would rival any dime novel. It was just a flat out lie.

I will continue to believe that if this tale were true the NRA, GOA, and other such organizations would pick it up, and spread it to everyone who would read or listen.

Regards,
Jerry

hksw
January 26, 2008, 10:35 PM
hmmmm. I'm calling B.S. on this one. I'm an avid gun guy and I've never even seen a GOA sticker on a car - this anti-gunner did?

- GOA stickers. Never seen one.

For the folks who have never seen a GOA sticker, here is what the window decal lloks like (on my main gun tool box, also have one on my .22 gun tool box):

http://i76.photobucket.com/albums/j26/villan535/GOA01.jpg

Erebus
January 27, 2008, 06:57 AM
Well as far as the GOA stickers, if she frequented anti-gun rallies and had "even yelled some not so nice things to those other marchers" that means Pro-2A activists were around and she might have seen the stickers on cars parked nearby those rallies.

Also those rest stops have more than just McDonalds there. She doesn't say she stopped to go to McDonalds.

Although I gotta admit is sounds a little too perfect. If it's true then I think she got some help writing it. But I am not ready to start sending it to people claiming it's true.

garymc
January 27, 2008, 07:46 AM
Well, the part that's suspicious to me is where she is in or just exiting an apparently safe building and sees two no-accounts hanging around her car - and then she just takes her child right to them. Maybe that's part of the anti gun mentality. On the other hand, for those who say it seems like it was written by a rkba person, isn't that what she says she has become? I've talked to anti gun people who have never heard of GOA, whereas they all know of the NRA. But that doesn't mean a contributor, marcher type wouldn't know about gun groups we don't even know about. I don't think there's any way to know if it's true or not. I suspect it probably has happened, more or less, maybe several times, so what's the difference?

30 cal slob
January 27, 2008, 10:01 AM
1. this story is close to home. why didn't i hear about it?

2. i wouldn't be surprised if it didn't make the news (assuming it did happen). the New England press doesn't LIKE to report about lawful CCW interventions.

3. confirmation sure would be nice.

230RN
January 27, 2008, 10:10 AM
I think it smacks of BS. I would never cite or promulgate something like that when there are plenty of true, verifiable, documented cases where "the mere presence of a firearm, without a shot necessarily being fired" saved the day, which appear in the American Rifleman every month.

Five or six of them. Documented. Verifiable. Every month.

The "conversion" factor is appealing in this story, but, as I used to sigline: "It will take either a good mugging or a good tyranny to change some folks' minds."

Caipirinha
January 27, 2008, 11:46 AM
That definitely pegs the BS meter. It's laughably bad.

willbrink
January 27, 2008, 01:01 PM
An interesting article, but I am always saddened that a person canít conceive of why guns in the hands of the law abiding may be a good idea until it has personal relevance to them.

Itís also a shame this person remained anonymous, had a friend submit it, and submit it to a pro gun groups page. Had she written it in her own name and submitted it to her local paper or something, it would carry some real weight. As it, it preaches to the believers and is open to attack from lack of credibility.

jlbraun
January 27, 2008, 01:53 PM
Well, the Gender Analyzer (http://bookblog.net/gender/genie.php) says it was written by a woman, so that's one data point.

enfield
January 27, 2008, 04:30 PM
Call me a cynic, but I don't believe a word of it.

Snowdiver
January 27, 2008, 10:01 PM
I want it to be true. I want to use it and forward it. I want proof.

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