explosive 357 Magnum Ammo-any info?


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AnchorYanker23
July 31, 2003, 05:17 AM
I have a few old rounds my dad gave me. They have the headstamp " WW super 357 magnum" with a silver colored case and bullet. they have what looks like a primer in the hollowpoint with red paint on the tip. My dad said he bought them twentysomething years ago and the are called "devastators". All I know about devastators is Hinckley used them to shoot Reagan, and they are not made any more. If any one could give me info or a link to info on stuff like, muzzle velocity, how well they worked, how they work, etc, I would appreciate it, I have only a few and don't want to waste them.

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Matt G
July 31, 2003, 11:40 PM
Editor's note: When I first saw this thread, I moved it into a locked forum for a little while to check on ATF's perception of Devastators. These are interesting, but I didn't want YankeeAnchor23 to get in trouble for "Possession Of Destructive Devices" or the like. Havng done some checking, I'm now convinced that all's well. Sorry for the inconvenience.

--MattG

Don Gwinn
July 31, 2003, 11:52 PM
Shame on you. You know how Auntie Ann feels about such things:

Rafter-S
August 1, 2003, 12:07 AM
Years ago I experimented with primers in the cavity of hollowpoints. Even put small charges of Bullseye under the primers. All this was in the attempt to create better expanding bullets. The results were not near as glorious as the concept...or more plainly said, it didn't work worth a flip.

Rafter-S

Edward429451
August 1, 2003, 12:31 AM
Yeah I made some of them with silvertips and Bullseye years ago. Never recovered any so who knows if they worked or not. Small rifle primers IIRC.

TexasVet
August 1, 2003, 01:41 AM
You will note that everyone Hinckley shot with Devastators survived, even the brain shot. NONE of his shots, except one that hit a car door, exploded. They have a huge failure to explode rate, varying widely by barrel length, velocity from the individual firearm and age and storage conditions. Frankly not worth the money they charged back then for them.

jsalcedo
August 1, 2003, 08:10 AM
What did hinkley use?

Some documentary I saw said it was an RG .22 revolver.. but I trust the media very little.

TheeBadOne
August 1, 2003, 08:39 AM
People get mixed up over how devastators were designed. They were designed for use by Air Marshals on airplanes where you didn't want to fire a gun and have it puncture the fuselage, depressurizing the aircraft. They are designed to explode if they hit a solid object, thus not penetrating it. As far I as I know they were only made in .22 LR and didn’t have a very good track record for exploding at all.

mormonsniper
August 1, 2003, 10:42 AM
from many years ago that there was a company (possibly) called Valmet or Valment that make similiar "exploding" ammunition. They used a percussion cap and black powder. Results were not "amazing". Sold in blister packs according to my old brain. Any old guys recollect this company?

Edward429451
August 1, 2003, 11:19 AM
I have a couple devastators in 45 ACP given to me by my dad, kickin around here someplace.
If you've ever ordered from the Delta Force catalog, you get put on the mailing list and each new mailing has a Firequest catalog in it and they're advertising Devastators in lots of calibers in it.

bogie
August 1, 2003, 12:43 PM
Maybe John Ross can kick in here - there have been more than a few attempts to produce "explosive" big game ammo, especially for those artillery pieces that he likes to shoot.

Generally, from what I understand, it doesn't work too well.

HankB
August 1, 2003, 12:59 PM
IIRC there were "Exploders" and "Devastators" - one was rimfire, the other, centerfire. Don't remember which was which.

I once ran into a guy at the range who was making his own. He'd gone the primer/Bullseye route and wasn't satisfied, so he started taking primers apart, scraping out the priming compound, and packing this into the nose of a bullet he'd drilled out for a larger cavity. :uhoh:

He offered me some to try . . . I declined.

Lord Grey Boots
August 1, 2003, 02:27 PM
People get mixed up over how devastators were designed. They were designed for use by Air Marshals on airplanes where you didn't want to fire a gun and have it puncture the fuselage, depressurizing the aircraft. They are designed to explode if they hit a solid object, thus not penetrating it. As far I as I know they were only made in .22 LR and didn’t have a very good track record for exploding at all.

HAHAHAHAHAHA! A hole the side of a plane depressurizing the aircraft. Thats a good one.:rolleyes:

Mike Irwin
August 1, 2003, 03:01 PM
Depressurizing and aircraft is a much different thing, and claim, than one of "explosive depressurization."

Maybe he means the same thing, maybe not.


As for the concept in general, it's old. Very old.

When I was with NRA we had some old rifle rounds loaded around the turn of the last century. They had hollow cavities in the nose of the bullet into which a small quantity of fine black powder was placed, and the hole plugged with a percussion cap.

50 Freak
August 1, 2003, 03:05 PM
I've used a 308 devastor against some phone books, result was impressive, however against soft targets, might as well be shooting fmjs.

Johnny Guest
August 1, 2003, 04:09 PM
What did hinkley use?
Some documentary I saw said it was an RG .22 revolver.. but I trust the media very little.


They occasionally get it right, Jesse - - -

He used a Rohm RG-14 revolver - - - The "Super Dooper Improved" version of the always popular (in the mid-to-late 1960s) RG-10. John H's had a slightly longer barrel, 3 to 3.3 inches??, and chambered .22 LR ctgs, whereas the -10 took only shorts, and perhaps, longs, IIRC.

An irreverent friend of mine got a good condition example of the -14, put it in a cheap plush-lined wood box and had a metal plate engraved,

RG-14
PRESIDENTIAL MODEL
Reagan/Hinckley Commemorative Edition

Sometimes we wondered about my old pal - - - -

Best,
Johnny

jsalcedo
August 1, 2003, 04:55 PM
Reagan/Hinckley Commemorative Edition

That is tacky. I don't think the Frankin mint will pick and run with that one.

tiberius
August 1, 2003, 05:11 PM
Nothing like commemorating the event that launched Sarah Brady on her crusade.:barf:

TheeBadOne
August 1, 2003, 06:04 PM
HAHAHAHAHAHA! A hole the side of a plane depressurizing the aircraft. Thats a good one. :rolleyes:

Lord Grey Boots

If you notice I said that was the stated reason given for the developement/marketing of the devastater. I never said that it was a truth/scientifically proven fact. If it made you feel better about yourself to poke fun at my post at least I accomplished one thing. :cool:

B27
August 1, 2003, 06:11 PM
I have a book at home called Pioneering Handgun Hunting which is about 40 years old.
Reliably expanding handgun ammo was unheard of at that time.
A large section of the book is devoted to producing "explosive" bullets by drilling a cavity in the nose of semi-wadcutter bullets and placing a .22 rimfire blank in the cavity base first so that the rim will be struck by any bone encountered.
This wasn't just an intellectual exercise, the guys who wrote the book did this and hunted with them extensively and show photos of the results.

p35
August 2, 2003, 01:29 AM
I thought the one that hit Brady exploded, which is why it didn't penetrate far enough to be fatal. Most .22 head shots I have seen bounce around inside the skull, making them fatal. I could be wrong- anyone know more?

Hkmp5sd
August 2, 2003, 01:50 AM
"The Lubbock [Texas police] office found that Hinckley had made several other purchases of firearms and ammunition, including a box of explosive bullets sold under the name of Devastator. ATF headquarters received this information at about 6 p.m. and immediately passed it on to the chief of ATF's Firearms Technology Branch, who began a search of his files for information on the bullets. President Reagan was already out of surgery by the time it was known that the bullets Hinckley had used might possibly contain small explosive charges, and the information was never passed on to the medical personnel treating the other three men wounded in the incident. this was an obvious oversight that could have had tragic results, but as it turned out, Hinckley hadn't used the explosive ammunition and there was no danger to the people in the operating rooms."

- For The Record: From Wall Street To Washington by Former Treasury Secretary Donald Regan (1988)

http://home.att.net/~m.standridge/dayshot.htm

Jeff OTMG
August 2, 2003, 05:50 PM
As I remember, HankB is correct. The ammo later became known as Terminator-X and the detonation system was changed. It was made by some guys out of Atlanta, Ga. I met them 6 - 8 years ago and warned them that the name could present a liability problem for them should the ammo ever be used in a shooting, so the name was changed to Eliminator-X. Don't know if they are still around or not.

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