[Tom Krein]

I am building my first lever gun Scout style rifle. It probably would not fit Jeff Coopers idea of a Scout Rifle, but I think it is going to be perfect for me.

I wanted a short handy rifle for hunting deer and especially hogs in brush country. 100 yards will be a VERY LONG shot! The Scout concept seemed like the way to go!

This is the gun I choose to build it on... LINK (http://www.marlinfirearms.com/firearms/xlr/1895XLR.aspx) Its is the stainless XLR Marlin 1895 in 45-70.

I am going to have the barrel cut to 16.5" (the Guide Guns are 18.5" but are back bored for porting and only have 16.5") and recrowned. I have ordered XS sights and a scout scope base.

I currently have a Burris Scout scope and am thinking about getting one of the new Aimpoint T1's for it. They are supposed to be killer in this role.

What else do I need to do to this one?? What have you or would you do if it was yours...??

Lets see some pictures of your Lever guns set up as Scout guns...

Thanks for the input!!

Tom

[TexasRifleman]

This is the Leupold scout scope on an XS rail.

I am very happy with it. Took a nice little deer in November with this.

http://homepage.mac.com/jayc67/marlin.jpg

[Tom Krein]

That is a great looking set up!

What weight bullet did you use??

I am thinking about a 350 grain hollow point for deer and a 400-450 grain lead bullet for hogs...

Tom

[Gator]

I have a Guide Gun with the XS mount with an Aimpoint 5000 sight. It also has XO sights. I've been very happy with it, but the Guide Gun is also available with an unported barrel, and if I were to do it over again thats the one I'd go with.

P.S. I just checked Marlin's site and they don't even show the ported GGs, do they still make them?

P.P.S. I like the .45-70 so much I had an old 336 cut down to 16 1/4" for the same treatment. :)

[TexasRifleman]

P.S. I just checked Marlin's site and they don't even show the ported GGs, do they still make them?

Not that I am aware of, and from what I read of them you don't want one anyway. I have no personal experience but I have not read favorably of the porting.

If you really do want it, Wild West Guns will do whatever you want.

What weight bullet did you use??

For the moment I am just shooting Hornady LeverRevolution 325gr because I don't have dies for .45-70 yet. After I make some empty brass with the Hornady I'll probably use a heavier bullet.

[George Hill]

If you read Cooper's Scout Rifle description, you will note that the scope is optional. A Scout Rifle doesn't have to have a scope.
A .30-30 lever gun - as is - is a Scout Rifle. A .308 Marlin Express is an even better Scout option. I like the shorter blued one myself.

[Fred Fuller]

I never could understand the necessity for forward-mounting a 'scope on a side-eject Marlin. A good low power fixed or variable scope with eye relief properly set to the shooter is just as fast IMHO. I have had a couple of pseuo-scout bolt guns (including one built on a Steyr Mauser action), and my favorite southern woods gun is an old Marlin 336 with a Weaver V1.5-4.5. The Marlin is just as fast as any of the pseudoscouts ever were.

I can see the advantages of forward mounted 1X optics like red dots, I have them on several carbines. The both-eyes-open approach works really well with them. With an optic of any magnification to speak of, it's difficult for me not to close the other eye in aiming. YMMV there, I'm old and my eyes have always been pretty bad.

lpl/nc

[TexasRifleman]

I never could understand the necessity for forward-mounting a 'scope on a side-eject Marlin.

The argument, though I am not sure I buy it 100% is that you don't have to give up any peripheral vision when you mount it that far forward.

You can still see all around you when using a forward mounted scope with both eyes open.

In the case of dangerous game or in territory with dangerous predators the idea is that you might see the movement of something that wants to eat you in time to shoot it.

With a receiver mounted scope you have it so close it blocks some of your view.

Makes sense on some level but I'm not sure how important it is.

It also allows for you to mount some kind of Ghost Ring sights and have a quick release on the glass optic, again in case you are in some dangerous area where you might want to yank the glass off and go to irons if things went south.

[rcmodel]

1894P 44 Mag Guide-Gun Scout.

It has a Leupold M-8 2x pistol scope in an XS mount.
I picked up the M-8 scope for 50 bucks on eBay.

Backup Williams receiver sight is sighted in and can be left in place with the scope mounted forward.

The goofy Marlin Wide-Scan hood trashed and replaced with a round hood & small gold-bead front.

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j219/rcmodel/KTOG/ScoutScope.jpg


Receiver Safety locked off with a small rubber O-Ring.

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j219/rcmodel/O-ring2.jpg

It is extremely fast and works well with both eyes open.
Probably as fast as a red-dot, but the 2x scope makes longer range accuracy possible.

I like it very much.

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j219/rcmodel/KTOG/1224.gif
rcmodel

[Colt46]

They should have a lineup of their 1892 Puma's with the scout configuration you are looking for.

[rcmodel]

1892 Puma's are not made in 45-70.
I think that is what he was trying for.

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j219/rcmodel/KTOG/1224.gif
rcmodel

[ArmedBear]

The argument, though I am not sure I buy it 100% is that you don't have to give up any peripheral vision when you mount it that far forward.


It's true. A properly-fitted rifle with a forward-mounted scope is more like a shotgun in that you can keep both eyes open, focus on the target and bring the gun up to shoot. You don't lose peripheral vision.

Gun fit and shooting technique makes for speed, not red dot scopes. When was the last time you saw someone shoot clays with a red dot? Some rifle shooters don't have good gun handling skills, and some rifles (e.g. the M4) don't lend themselves to pointing with the upper body, so a red dot has a place. But if I thought I needed a red dot to snap shoot a lever gun, I'd sell the rifle. What would be the point of having it if it wasn't effective for its intended use?

That doesn't mean there aren't downsides to forward mounted scopes, like seeing a smaller image in the scope. However, they offer better long range shooting and more accurate small target acquisition than iron sights, without sacrificing some of the positive qualities of irons.

Neat setup, rcmodel.

[ArmedBear]

1892 Puma's are not made in 45-70.

True, though a .454 Casull is worth a look.

[waterhouse]

I'll try and get pictures up, but the camera is not in my possession now. I've got a couple 336s, one with the Leupold scout scope and another with a 1.5x pistol scope (I've actually got a 3rd en route, but I think it will be a present for a nephew.). I'm somewhat thinking about doing it to my 45-70 only because I have a spare mount and scope laying around, but I like shooting it with irons a lot. We'll see.

I like the setup and I've tried guns side by side with forward mounted scopes and regular receiver mounted scopes. I'm much faster with the forward mounted scout type setups.

Receiver Safety locked off with a small rubber O-Ring.

Interesting, thanks for posting that.

[ArmedBear]

Yeah, thanks for the O-ring picture.

Definitely a "why didn't I think of that" moment.:)

I actually like having the safety, functionally, for loading and unloading, dropping the hammer, range use when passing the gun around, etc.

But I'd like the safety to "go away" in the field.

[Colt46]

Why the hell does he need a large action like a .45-70?
.44 Mag, .357 Mag or even .45 Colt will work just fine for his needs and be a hell of a lot handier and lighter to boot.

[TexasRifleman]

Why the hell does he need a large action like a .45-70?

Hog hunting in thick brush is prime real estate for the .45-70. The versatility of this round on the reloading bench is amazing.

[Titus]

I like the scout mount on a Marlin with a red dot. One thing you might consider is the Wild West Trigger Happy Kit. The first Marlin I set up had a trigger that reminded me of something I read on one of the forums about "you could learn to shoot well with it, but it will probably take longer". My latest is good enough that I haven't felt the urge to get one for it, but they go in easy enough and make for a nice trigger.

[jmr40]

The correct way to fire any firearm is with both eyes open. It does not matter if you are using iron sights or a scope. With practice it is easy and quick. Moving the scope foreward would offer a better field of view, but not that much more than a low powered scope mounted conventionally. The main advantage that I see is ease of carrying and easier reloading of a bolt action.

[ArmedBear]

Moving the scope foreward would offer a better field of view, but not that much more than a low powered scope mounted conventionally.

I agree with you in general, but this statement is not true in my experience. The forward-mounted scope blocks far less of the off eye's FOV and renders the sighting eye's peripheral vision far more useful than a conventional scope of any power.

[Ratshooter]

Gator i talked to Marlin a couple of months ago and the lady said the ported guns were only made one year and are no longer available. Which is good, i don't like them either. Thomas.

[PC40]

I wanted to upload an image of my rifle but it's not working, will try again later...

[Tom Krein]

Why the hell does he need a large action like a .45-70?
.44 Mag, .357 Mag or even .45 Colt will work just fine for his needs and be a hell of a lot handier and lighter to boot.

The 45-70 offers plenty of power for shots from any angle on a hog.

While I could get the work done with carbines chambered in any of the above calibers I like the extra power and bullet weight of the 45-70.

I actually have a Winchester Trapper in .44 mag and it is a GREAT little gun!! When I get my Marlin built in 45-70 it won't be much bigger or heavier though!!

Tom

[bullockcm]

I have a Marlin 1894 with a XS scout mount that I had a red dot on and just switched to a Burris 2x7 handgun scope. I ended up having to use an extended ring on the front to get the eye relief correct. I think I am going to like it a lot!

[esheato]

Something like this? (http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=289524)

Ed

http://i195.photobucket.com/albums/z275/howeric/Marlin1895GS003.jpg

http://i195.photobucket.com/albums/z275/howeric/Marlin1895GS001.jpg

[Il Duca]

Why the hell does he need a large action like a .45-70?

Well, a 2-400 pound hog close to me in thick brush is enough of a reason for me. A Bear would also be plenty reason. And you never know when Skookum will show his ugly mug. Wherever there is thick brush there is usually something mean or pissy that lives in or around it.

[Stinger]

I have never seen such blasphemy in all of my life.

Scopes on leverguns...what will they think of next? Before too long, someone is going to pimp out a .45 Colt with night sites and a laser.

[Cocked & Locked]

Off Topic, but I just don't like the looks of the XS mounts...way too many "teeth" sticking up. So, I just went with the standard affair on my .45-70 Guide Gun. Warne bases and quick release Warne mounts.

Yep, my gun is the ported model and I like it that way. :neener:


pretty wood...both sides :)

http://pic14.picturetrail.com/VOL523/3082611/17383006/292936835.jpg

http://pic14.picturetrail.com/VOL523/3082611/17383006/292936831.jpg

[Avenger29]

I have never seen such blasphemy in all of my life.

Scopes on leverguns...what will they think of next? Before too long, someone is going to pimp out a .45 Colt with night sites and a laser.

It's about to get worse. XS is coming out with a tri-rail to replace the forend of a levergun.

Can't wait:neener:

Nice rifle, esheato. What is the finish, and is that synthetic furniture or wood?

[esheato]

I wish I could claim the idea for that rifle, but I can't....I bought it from a guy on here all dressed up.

Specs are as follows...

- Marlin 1895GS base gun

- MPI fiberglass stock [comes with Pachmayr Decelerator recoil pad]

- Gunmetal Gray CeraKote from Fit 4 Duty on all parts, with Micro-Slick on bolt

- DRC Custom Big Loop lever, stainless

- DRC Custom magazine follower, stainless [replaces the stock plastic follower]

- WWG "Bear Proof" ejector, stainless

- WWG trigger kit, stainless

- XS Ghost Ring sights

- XS Lever Rail, short

- Leupold FX-II 2.5x28 IER scope, matte, duplex

- Warne Maxima quick-release steel rings, low, matte

Ed

[Tom Krein]

Some GREAT looking rifles! Keep them coming...

Esheato, what a BEAUTY! That is what I want to end up with!! Thanks for sharing!!

Tom

[usmcgrunt]

Now I see this Tom Krein character poisoning the minds over here as well! Well Tom and I have been going down this road for a while, good to see you here too Tom! Im about to get me a Marlin 1895G as well but was looking for some info and pics! You guys are doing an Awesome job posting! I was planning on getting the blued version and then maybe having it hard chromed but Id like to hear from Esheato as to what kinda finish that 1895 has on it! Thanks again guys for posting!

Grunt Out!

[FLtoAK05]

WWG Co-Pilot.....the scope is forward because it is a take down, just one more reason.

http://i104.photobucket.com/albums/m200/bgiddens/DSC00009.jpg

http://i104.photobucket.com/albums/m200/bgiddens/DSC00008.jpg

[JFrame]

FLtoAK05,

Aaargh -- I think that Co-Pilot is my I-must-have-it du jour!

That is one slick-looking piece... Techie and retro all in one. It would make a beautiful Big Brother to my Winny Trapper .357.

Tax dollars, here I come! ;)

-- JFrame

[Harve Curry]

Hey Tom,
Here's my guide gun:
http://i177.photobucket.com/albums/w202/NewMexicoOutfitter/BillWeddlemuledeer1881Marlin12Nov07.jpg
a 1881 Marlin 45-70 , double set triggers for fine work, with Smith Ent. full buckhorn and ladder sight, with sight ups posted to 300 yards. Uses a Lyman/Gould 330gr lead bullet @ 1500 fps MV.

Back to your 16 1/2" carbine. What powder & charges are you going to use?
I would think with the strong action you could use powders like IMR 4227, 2400, get excellent acurracy, and minimal muzzle flash. I would keep a rear ghost ring sight for backup, low profile kind that slopes up , not like a pedastal that can get bent or broke off.