M44 Serial Numbers.....


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scdigger
February 7, 2008, 02:43 PM
Will the serial numbers on an M44 be stamped, engraved or both? I just picked up a pristine M44 with matching serials, but it's engraved on the bolt and butt plate, maybe on the bottom, stamped on the barrell, didn't check the other spot. Just curious...it's a 1944 M44. Thanks. Love the gun! Looks completely unused!

Greg

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Slater
February 7, 2008, 02:48 PM
I've seen all stamped, all engraved (except for the receiver), and combinations of each. Collectors seem to like the all stamped variations the most.

scdigger
February 7, 2008, 02:51 PM
This is my VERY FIRST vintage weapon and I wanted to check...gotta' a lot to learn!

Greg

White Horseradish
February 7, 2008, 02:54 PM
The "engraved" numbers are electropenciled. This was done during arsenal refurb wen parts with the original stamped numbers were replaced for reasons of speed and economy.

Hoppy590
February 7, 2008, 02:56 PM
engraved like with an electric pen?

its force match after rearsenal. this is when the guns are taken from the field, checked, fixed, cleaned and reassymbled. some times a part like magazine is broken, so they throw one on from another gun that might be broken elsewhere

some times the parts are just tossed in big bins and what ever bolt they grab, goes with what ever reciever they have. etc

Slater
February 7, 2008, 02:57 PM
Most M44's (with the possible exception of many postwar 1946,1947, and 1948 Russian examples) have gone through a factory refurbishment process. A lot of them look almost new. Look for the refurb marks on the stock and receiver, which should be a square with a slash mark through it.

scdigger
February 7, 2008, 03:02 PM
I'll look for the marks...it's a beautiful, old gun...it's already addicting...what can I look for next...hmmmmmmmm. I'll post some pictures.

Greg

Arkie
February 7, 2008, 03:10 PM
Here is a lot of good info on the Mosin Nagant's.

http://www.7.62x54r.net

Slater
February 7, 2008, 05:02 PM
Mosin-Nagants cann be addictive. Some are great shooters while others aren't. But remember, if you aim, pull the trigger and it goes "bang", it just did pretty much all that was ever asked of a Mosin-Nagant. :D

White Horseradish
February 7, 2008, 05:16 PM
if you aim, pull the trigger and it goes "bang", it just did pretty much all that was ever asked of a Mosin-Nagant.

Not quite. It was also asked to stab and crush. But you would need a bag of straw or access to a meat locker to practice those. :neener:

Chipperman
February 7, 2008, 06:40 PM
it's a 1944 M44

Nice! Hard to find early ones. Mine is 1947 vintage.

Franco2shoot
February 8, 2008, 10:30 AM
Perhaps you have seen this in another post, but I just found the answer to a question I have asked over and over.. namely how come the matching numbers seem to be good on barrel, bolt, and receiver, but the butt plate is usually where the mismatch occurs.

It was the process or re-arsenal, the first big bin was where the butt plates were tossed while the rest of the rifle was inspected. If the other parts were OK, the tech would reach in the barrel pull out a butt plate and send her down the line.

I knew it wasn't that the buttplate made for good fishing lures...

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=71616&d=1201038669

You'll love shooting it, and after the 44 you will be looking for a 91/30 just for the shooting experience, not necessarily collector side, which is the way I went.

KKKKFL

glimmerman
February 8, 2008, 11:27 AM
The electropencil numbers were NOT!! done by the arsenal rebuild. They were done by the importer (ie. the monkeys at century arms) to make them look like a matching number gun. The arsenals would have used and did use an over stamp or line out the non matching number and restamp the matching number on the part.

jj1987
February 18, 2008, 05:35 PM
I just had baught a 1945 M44 about a weak ago and I'm trying to figure out what the MP stands for at the begining of the serial number. I've found all the other marking meanings but not this. Is this mean any significants. The rifle has all matching numbers.


Any suggestions on a nice scope for this rifle.

Franco2shoot
February 19, 2008, 09:45 AM
MP is the two character cyrillic indicators... depending on the arsenal, (one started a year after the other) they started numbering with letter, letter, then 4 digits. Nobody seems to know if the letters went in order ie, AA, AB, AC etc. but they seem to run numerically from 0001-9999 and then the next letter set so MO would have come before your MP and when they got to MP 9999 it would have rolled to MC 0001 (their C is our S FWIW)... hope this helps. What is unknown is whether they actually moved through the cyrillic alphabet in order or for that matter, did the M44's and 91/30's use the same block of numbers. Think of it this way... You have an M44 with MP xxxx, now is there a 91/30 from the same arsenal with the same alpha/number and same year? How about same alpha/number but different year. I would guess the answer to be "No" but I don't know for sure.
KKKKFL

Ash
February 19, 2008, 10:05 AM
No, the electropencil was indeed done at the arsenal and not by Century or other importers. For one reason, the electropencil is the same from one importer to another, which would be very strange for RGuns, Interordance, Tennessee Guns, Century, and Aztec to be all doing the same thing in the same way. The exporter is not doing this because when they did want to fake numbers, as in the fake snipers shipped over, they stamped the numbers, not electro-pencil. And, these were sold so cheap that it would not be worth the time nor effort to electro-pencil them to make them match. What's more, these rifles are still covered in cosmoline.

This same marking is evident on SVT-40's imported 10 years ago in a completely unrelated shipment. They were refurbed at the same time as the Mosins, though (and the K98k's that are also electro-penciled).

Now, there are several importers currently using a dot-matrix impact style marking scheme for adding new serial numbers as mandated by the ATF on the receiver as well as the importer name. But this is very clearly done by machine whereas the original electro-pencil is done by hand. These two methods are completely different.

Ash

Matt-J2
February 19, 2008, 01:22 PM
Now, there are several importers currently using a dot-matrix impact style marking scheme for adding new serial numbers as mandated by the ATF on the receiver as well as the importer name. But this is very clearly done by machine whereas the original electro-pencil is done by hand. These two methods are completely different.

Ash


Yeah. I hate that. Hate it, hate it, hate it. Passed on several otherwise great guns because of it.

jj1987
February 19, 2008, 05:05 PM
OH okay!
On mine the serial number is MP535
Thanks

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