Revisiting Wolf primers


PDA






DaveInFloweryBranchGA
February 11, 2008, 02:39 AM
If you've bought Wolf Primers:

1. What size and type did you buy?

2. What has been your experience with the ones you've bought?

3. What application are you using them for?

Thanks,

Dave

If you enjoyed reading about "Revisiting Wolf primers" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!
donttellthewife
February 11, 2008, 02:58 AM
I bought 5000 Large pistol and 5000 Small pistol from Powder valley to fill out a 50,000 primer order. I haven't used them yet for their intended purpose, 9mm and 45acp, but all the responces I got before ordering were positve.
Sorry not much help so far. Do you seat primers on your press ( single or progressive ) or seperate from the press. It would be easy enough for me to give a report in a day or two as to how well they work in the dillon 650.

Ron

Roccobro
February 11, 2008, 03:31 AM
Ron- Was there a price break at 50k or was it just a personal goal of some sort??? :D

Justin

putteral
February 11, 2008, 12:47 PM
I use wolf small and large pistol primers all the time. No problems
and they are $90 per 5000 at Powder Valley.

zxcvbob
February 11, 2008, 01:19 PM
I bought 1000 SP's, 1000 LP's, and 1000 something else a couple of months ago -- SR's, I think. I've used the small pistol primers so far and they work great. I wish I had bought 5000. I haven't tried the large pistol primers yet.

rundm
February 11, 2008, 06:15 PM
how about anything for the 5.56/223. can you use the small rifle magnum wolf primers instead of just the small rifle primers? RG

jameslovesjammie
February 11, 2008, 06:50 PM
There would be no gain in using a magnum primer in a .223, not even with ball powder. It would give you too hot of an ignition, and usually wider groups. You would have to start working your loads up from the bottom again, as the hotter ignition would change the pressure curve.

James41
February 11, 2008, 07:04 PM
I have Wolf primers for Large pistol, small pistol, and small rifle. I use them thus:

Large pistol in a 45ACP
Small pistol in 9 mm, 40S&W
Small rifle in an AR-15 223 cal

I have used a little over 2 thousand of them so far and have had no problems with any of them, they work fine.

Ergosphere
February 11, 2008, 07:57 PM
I've used Wolf small pistol primers for 9mm; no obvious problems attributable to the primers after ~300 rounds fired. There were some FTFs but I attribute that to the gun, which had a problem with the sear and is now in the possession of the manufacturer for service.

I will soon be loading .45 ACP with Wolf large pistol primers; I have no concerns.

I purchased the primers from Wideners, which has pretty decent prices.

RustyFN
February 11, 2008, 08:19 PM
Roccobro:
Ron- Was there a price break at 50k or was it just a personal goal of some sort???

Justin
50,000 is the most you can order for one hazmat fee. Dave I am the same as most of the others. I have friends that have been using them problem free so I bought a bunch with them and haven't used any yet. Most of what they are using is SP and LP. They are shooting IDPA, GSSF and practice.
Rusty

bobaloo
February 11, 2008, 08:43 PM
Wolf recommends using their magnum small rifle primers for .223 if it's to be used in an AR. The reason is not for the extra fire, they say it's the same, the difference is that their magnum primers use a harder primer cup and are less susceptible to a slam fire.

evan price
February 12, 2008, 12:26 AM
5000 Wolf SP from Powder Valley.

Will be buying another 5K SP and 5k LP.
Started using them in 9mm and I like them a lot. Price is very good. Had been using Winchesters but trying to cut costs.

rundm
February 12, 2008, 07:14 AM
I was not trying to get a gain out of using the wolf small magnum primers for the 223/5.56. I was just trying to find a cost effective way of loading up thousands of rounds of the 223 without depleteing my stores of match primers that I have. I do not have many of the reg 205's or 6 1/2's right now. I only have the match stuff and see no reason to burn off those primers right now with pulled 62 gr ss109's or pulled 55gr fmj's with which I will not see great groups from anyways. With the cost of the feds and the rems regular or match primers, it would be a waste of those. I can save them for the stuff that I really want to tailor for the long range accurate stuff out of my ar's or other rifles. I had also been hearing that the wolf small rifle magnum primers was what they recommended for using in ar's because the cup was a little thicker than the reg small rifle primer and would decrease the possibility of slam fires in ar's. I personally have never had that happen but don't really want it to either. Anyways, I have not been able to verify the wolf info as of yet. At widners, on the front of there online advertisement, it states they have the wolf primers for sale and that they are the primer of choice for the 223/5.56, but when asked about them they told me they could not give out that info even though they listed them on the front page of their ad. I was just trying to find out if I could use them safely. For the price of their stuff, I have not found anything that compares as of now. I will also be trying to stock up on cheap components much more in the next couple of months because I can see primers also going the way of powder, cases and especially bullets price wise in the future. Especially if certain people make it in the political arena. I do not think they will get rid of guns, but they can, will and have already started trying to tax the crap out of components for loading. Why the heck ban anything when you can tax the people into submission. Nobody will be able to afford anything. Sorry for the long post, just want to make sure I don't make a mistake with a major order for something that I can't use. Thanks to anyone who might be able to help me out, RG

DaveInFloweryBranchGA
February 12, 2008, 02:03 PM
Another question for you guys I forgot to ask:

Have any of you experienced problems getting these primers to seat in your brass and if so, what sort of brass was it?

Thanks for the responses so far, sounds positive.

Dave

evan price
February 13, 2008, 04:14 AM
Dave,
S&B cases fit a little tight, but then, they fit tight with whatever primers I use not just wolf.
Otherwise I might think they were Winchesters if I didn't know better.

pwrtool45
February 13, 2008, 07:27 AM
Link (http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=56513&hl=wolf+primers) to thread on BE's site about Wolf primers. Runs from late 2007 to Feb 2008, so data is recent.

DaveInFloweryBranchGA
February 13, 2008, 01:27 PM
pwrtool45,

Thank you for the link.

Dave

luckylogger6
February 13, 2008, 02:50 PM
Can someone paste the artical in a post...I cant view that web page right now.

lordgroom
February 14, 2008, 08:24 AM
Bill Nesbitt

View Member Profile Nov 23 2007, 04:00 PM Post #1


Beyond it All


Group: Classified
Posts: 1012
Joined: 19-March 03
From: Barnesville, Ohio
Member No.: 2236



After all the primer talk I decided to try some Wolf primers to see how they work compared to Federal.

A revolver is a good way to test the power needed to set off the primers.

I have 3 K-Frames I shoot regularly. They all have the trigger pull set at 6 3/4 to 7 1/4 pounds. The 3 inch Model 10 smithed by Al Greco is smooth, runs 6 3/4 # and will set off CCI rifle primers.

The other revolvers are a 4 inch Model 10 and a 4 inch Model 15. 36 rounds with Wolf primers went through these 2 guns at 100%.

I reset the 4 inch model 10 to 6# and it will set off Federals 100%. Wolf primers went 2 misfires out of 6 shots. Both misfires went off the second time around.

I set the trigger pull to 6 1/2 pounds and 12 Wolf primed rounds went off OK.

All rounds were loaded on a 1050.

I'll compare some Winchester primers when I get a chance but it looks like Wolf will fall somewhere between Federal and Winchester.


--------------------

Bill Nesbitt


mwx40x40

View Member Profile Nov 23 2007, 04:11 PM Post #2


Sees Sights


Group: Classified
Posts: 277
Joined: 17-June 06
Member No.: 8415



I have been running Wolf primers in 9mm for my G-34 and M&P. Both guns have been 100% with Winchester primers. With the Wolf's I have been averaging 2 to 4 light strikes every 120 rounds. All but one have gone off with the second strike.
I will see if things change any as I get further into them. I have a couple thousand loaded and have been through about 500.


Bill Nesbitt

View Member Profile Dec 1 2007, 06:22 PM Post #3


Beyond it All


Group: Classified
Posts: 1012
Joined: 19-March 03
From: Barnesville, Ohio
Member No.: 2236



I needed to adjust the primer seating punch on the 1050 to give the Wolf primers that almost crushed look that we revolver shooters like so well. I then loaded more ammo with Wolf primers. I hope to load some ammo with Winchester primers in the next few days to compare them all.


--------------------

Bill Nesbitt


Bill Nesbitt

View Member Profile Dec 3 2007, 02:49 PM Post #4


Beyond it All


Group: Classified
Posts: 1012
Joined: 19-March 03
From: Barnesville, Ohio
Member No.: 2236



I've been doing more testing.

I have found that both Wolf and Winchester primers need the primer seating punch on my 1050 adjusted differently from Federal primers to get the almost crushed look. All tests from now on have the primers seated as deeply as possible.

I am still using my 4 inch S&W Model 10 in the tests. It is stock as far as I know except for a Vic Pickett spring kit. I bought it used and it had a pretty smooth action when I got it. I have the trigger pull set at 5 1/2 pounds for these tests. All shots were fired double action.

Federal primers. I ran around 300 rounds through the gun including about 100 at a local IDPA match. I had one light hit that went off the second time around. Of course it happened during the match. I didn't get a chance to examine the brass.

Wolf primers. 18 rounds with 3 light hits. 2 of them went off the second time around. One never did go off.

Winchester primers. 48 rounds with one light hit that went off on the second strike.

Conclusion: Wolf primers are harder than Winchester primers. My lot of Winchester primers came from Powder Valley a few months ago. They do not have the little white mark on the corner of the box. I just got the Wolf primers from Powder Valley a few days ago.

All of these rounds were in misc. brass that had been shot before.

These are all small pistol primers. Large primers might be different.

I had hoped that Wolf could be a subtitute primer but it looks like anybody with a super light action will still need to be looking for Federals or else adjusting their gun.

I hope this will help some of you choose a primer during the shortage.


--------------------

Bill Nesbitt


Rob Boudrie

View Member Profile Dec 3 2007, 03:05 PM Post #5


Area 7 Director


Group: Classified
Posts: 1749
Joined: 9-January 02
Member No.: 1727



QUOTE
They do not have the little white mark on the corner of the box.

Of what significance is this mark?



--------------------


Feb. 2006


Carlos

View Member Profile Dec 3 2007, 03:23 PM Post #6


Burned Out


Group: Classified
Posts: 2695
Joined: 19-December 01
From: Arlington, VA
Member No.: 348



QUOTE(Bill Nesbitt @ Dec 4 2007, 12:49 AM)
I've been doing more testing.

I have found that both Wolf and Winchester primers need the primer seating punch on my 1050 adjusted differently from Federal primers to get the almost crushed look. All tests from now on have the primers seated as deeply as possible.

I am still using my 4 inch S&W Model 10 in the tests. It is stock as far as I know except for a Vic Pickett spring kit. I bought it used and it had a pretty smooth action when I got it. I have the trigger pull set at 5 1/2 pounds for these tests. All shots were fired double action.

Federal primers. I ran around 300 rounds through the gun including about 100 at a local IDPA match. I had one light hit that went off the second time around. Of course it happened during the match. I didn't get a chance to examine the brass.

Wolf primers. 18 rounds with 3 light hits. 2 of them went off the second time around. One never did go off.

Winchester primers. 48 rounds with one light hit that went off on the second strike.

Conclusion: Wolf primers are harder than Winchester primers. My lot of Winchester primers came from Powder Valley a few months ago. They do not have the little white mark on the corner of the box. I just got the Wolf primers from Powder Valley a few days ago.

All of these rounds were in misc. brass that had been shot before.

These are all small pistol primers. Large primers might be different.

I had hoped that Wolf could be a subtitute primer but it looks like anybody with a super light action will still need to be looking for Federals or else adjusting their gun.

I hope this will help some of you choose a primer during the shortage.


Thanks Bill! I would not come to the same conclusion with such a small sample of rounds tested. Also, the fact that you actually had a light hit with a Federal primer suggests to me that either your gun is set on the very ragged edge of lightness where NO primer is 100% or there are some inconsistencies in your loads.

From my testing of these same primers in a highly tuned SP-01 with an very very light DA, I would (at a minimum) agree with the conclusion you reached in your first post: the PMC/wolf are BETWEEN the Winchester and the Federal primers in sensitivity. I have had exactly zero light strikes with my SP01, none with Federal and one with Winchester primers.

We all know that Federal uses a formula of lead styphnate: "basic" while the other 3 US based primers use the lead styphnate: "Normal" (it was in Front Sight).

Question is: does Wolf use Normal or Basic lead styphnate as its compound?

My best guess from the relatively tough primer cup AND sensitivity is that they are using Basic lead styphnate as the compound. Thoughts?



--------------------

Just another "simple civilian." Read all about it in the "BILL RUGER" letter.

No, my last name is not Hathcock. -C.

"When one who is honestly mistaken hears the truth, he will either quit being mistaken or cease to be honest." -anon.


Bill Nesbitt

View Member Profile Dec 3 2007, 04:17 PM Post #7


Beyond it All


Group: Classified
Posts: 1012
Joined: 19-March 03
From: Barnesville, Ohio
Member No.: 2236



Rob,

The corner of the box is white and it says: "New surface finish for improved sensitivity". I have some Win Large Pistol primers that say that. My Win Small Pistol primers do not say that.

Carlos,

I agree, my gun was deliberately set on the very ragged edge of lightness to test primers better. I normally run it with a heavier pull which gives the primers a harder strike.

I just went outside and fired 30 more rounds of the Wolf primed ammo. That makes a total of 48 rounds of Wolf primed ammo.

Do you realize just how cold it is out there.

5 light hits. 4 went off the second strike and one didn't go off at all. I made sure every one of these last rounds was in good shape and had a deep set primer.

I stand by my conclusion.





--------------------

Bill Nesbitt


SA Friday

View Member Profile Dec 3 2007, 04:56 PM Post #8


Brass balls...well, a picture of them, anyway.


Group: Classified
Posts: 1025
Joined: 18-February 06
From: CO, but currently exiled to MD
Member No.: 7549



By no means am I the brightest brick in the pile, but I wonder if the shape of the firing pin has anything to do with this. Glock strikers are considerably sharper at the point than many other firing pins. I believe the CZ's firing pin may also be sharper compared to say a 1911 or 2011. Is it possible that the shape could lend a more penetrating strike to the primer and thereby lessening the need for higher spring weight in a revolver? This might be something to tinker with for more consistancy. Just thinkin out loud...


--------------------

If you need it, you don't have it. If you don't need it, you have it.--Some dude who shoots really well.


Bill Nesbitt

View Member Profile Dec 3 2007, 06:10 PM Post #9


Beyond it All


Group: Classified
Posts: 1012
Joined: 19-March 03
From: Barnesville, Ohio
Member No.: 2236



QUOTE(SA Friday @ Dec 3 2007, 06:56 PM)
, but I wonder if the shape of the firing pin has anything to do with this. Is it possible that the shape could lend a more penetrating strike to the primer and thereby lessening the need for higher spring weight in a revolver? This might be something to tinker with for more consistancy. Just thinkin out loud...



I agree. The firing pin on my Randy Lee 625 is very pointy.




--------------------

Bill Nesbitt


JamesLovesJammie

View Member Profile Jan 8 2008, 03:44 AM Post #10


Looks for Range


Group: Members
Posts: 14
Joined: 23-November 07
Member No.: 12922



Bill,

Have you done any more testing? Have you tried a different firing pin, such as the Cylinder and Slide extended one?


--------------------

Some people are like Slinkies...not really good for anything, but you just can't help but smile when you see them tumbling down the stairs!


vrmn1

View Member Profile Jan 8 2008, 04:05 AM Post #11


Calls Shots


Group: Classified
Posts: 543
Joined: 28-April 07
From: South of Atlanta
Member No.: 11104



I have used about 3000 wolf lp primers without a problem in my 625. My trigger is set at 7#.











--------------------

USPSA A57011
NRA Lifer

luckylogger6
February 14, 2008, 12:26 PM
Thanks lordgroom

Roccobro
February 14, 2008, 03:18 PM
Now, THAT is a post!

Or maybe a novel... :D

Justin

rdhood
February 20, 2008, 04:52 PM
Would Wolf large magnum rifle primers be suitable for reloading 7.62x39 ?

I am looking for a substitute for CC#34, which happens to be out of stock at both powder valley and wideners.

If the CC #34 are stiff large magnum rifle primers, and since Wolf appear to be stiff primers AND produce a heck-of-a-lot of 7.62x39, would their large magnum rifle primers be appropriate for setting off A1680 for an SKS or AK rifle?

30Cal
February 20, 2008, 05:48 PM
I've shot a couple hundred small magnum rifle in .30Carbine and .223. Works fine. Excellent accuracy through the carbine. Didn't see the .223 accuracy results, but got no complaints at 600yds from the coach.

If you enjoyed reading about "Revisiting Wolf primers" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!