Russian PPSh-41 Semi-Automatic Rifle Copy?


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MechAg94
February 11, 2008, 02:59 PM
http://www.militarygunsupply.com/shop2/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=14_15&products_id=133
Does anyone own one of these ppsh semi-auto copies? I have seen them advertised in various places over the years and have always thought it would be a cool rifle to own. That is to say it would be cool if it worked and wasn't a POS. I saw one at a gun show recently, but didn't really think about it until I saw this link.

I am curious what sort of quality I would be getting with this. Is it a generally reliable gun? Is the fit and finish anything to brag about? I am not sure of the manufacturer. Any information would be welcome.

http://www.militarygunsupply.com/shop2/images/sappsh41.jpg

They show a PPS-43 also. It looks cool, but I am not sure I want a pistol only.
http://www.militarygunsupply.com/shop2/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=14_19&products_id=132

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silverlance
February 11, 2008, 03:16 PM
I really want to get a ppsh41 but i dont knwo of anybody who has bought one. a little expensive for an experiment.

Walkalong
February 11, 2008, 03:18 PM
a little expensive for an experiment.I'll say. Cool though.

Vaarok
February 11, 2008, 03:38 PM
Lotta guys on Gunboards got 'em. They're not perfect, but they run well. Also, so long as you don't use wartime Russian drums, they do actually accept the drum mags fairly readily, so the disclaimer about needing to be individually fitted to a rifle is more for exceptions than a rule.

Personally, the only reason I don't have one is because I don't wanna have to stock 7.62x25TT. If they made a 9mm version, I would have one already.

The build-your-own guy that advertises in competition with MGS used to work for MGS and quit in a huff over royalties, and his version is not as nice. Further, the old SR-41s InterOrdinance sold long ago are sketchy in reliability, safety, and tend to burp and then jam.

So really, you just need to ask if you want to pay the pricetag or not.

MechAg94
February 11, 2008, 07:12 PM
Thanks Vaarok. That helps. I might have to see about getting some ammo first. I can always get one of the pistols later.

RecoilRob
February 11, 2008, 08:32 PM
There have been MANY problems with these guns....and the manufacturer has not been exactly co-operative in their resolution for some. The change from open bolt to closed involved the removal of material from the bolt. This causes it to move a LOT faster when fired and many rifles have bulged cases as a result.

They also tried to stop this early bolt movement by hogging out the rifling in the first 10" of barrel to reduce the pressure. I'm not kidding! The barrels are sometimes nice...others have gotten real sewer pipes. Some guns will not hold a 10'' group...at 25yds!

In other words, these fellows seem to be a real crapshoot with these rifles. Sorry to be negative about this but it is the truth. The Gunboards has removed all negative posting about the rifles because the manufacturer is a Sponsor and friend of the board owner.

My advise would be to go and look carefully at the rifle you intend to buy. Test fire it. Examine the accuracy and fired cases. If all looks good...buy it and be happy!

armoredman
February 11, 2008, 08:32 PM
I wanna PPsH41. I don't have da $. Too bad.

chauncey
February 11, 2008, 09:38 PM
friend of mine has a 43. keeps denting the primer of the second round after firing the first, and double-firing on light primers. it's already been back to the manufacturer once, I think the second time, it will stay there.

his customer service has been ok, just slow

GBExpat
February 11, 2008, 09:55 PM
I really want to get a ppsh41 but i dont knwo of anybody who has bought one.

I bought one ... and waited a year to receive it ... and then ...

... in 3 cases they couldn't manage to install a decent barrel on my rifle ... in the 4th case, they wouldn't.

A few pics from my 4+month effort to get a decent barrel from MGS for the PPSh-41 that they sold me ...

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y285/Jungesblut/WLA%20PPSh-41/Range49Feet_2.jpg

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y285/Jungesblut/WLA%20PPSh-41/ChamberGrinding3.jpg

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y285/Jungesblut/WLA%20PPSh-41/CartInChamber2.jpg

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y285/Jungesblut/WLA%20PPSh-41/YugoRomy2.jpg

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y285/Jungesblut/WLA%20PPSh-41/3BulgedCases_SB.jpg

4 different barrels were installed on my rifle ... the final barrel was sent with the throat and first several inches of bore damaged ... ruined ... actually sabotaged ... which I think should provide you a really good insight into Military Guns Supply, Noble Firearms, Inc. (owner of MGS) and Wise Lite Arms (the company that actually crafted the product) since they have been universally silent on the subject since I received it last September.

Caveat Emptor ... BIGtime.

Leif Runenritzer
February 11, 2008, 11:25 PM
I was cured of badly wanting one of these a while back. And all i heard was that you're not supposed to use surplus ammo. What am i supposed to use this 1952, bulgarian картечен ammo for now?

wally
February 11, 2008, 11:55 PM
I'm very happy with the PPSh-41 I got from Military Gun Supply. All the mags and the drum that came with it functioned fine with Romanian surplus 7.62x25 ammo.

The drum I got from CDNN didn't feed, but comparing it to the one that worked, I could see the angles on the bullet guide tabs were wrong. Bent them back in to proper position and it seems to be feeding OK now. The 71 round drums are a blast to shoot with and I saw no funky bulges or dings in my empties. The brass ejects pretty much straight up and is not too hard to find afterwards.

Takedown is authentic -- push the rear top cover forward and pivot, makes for very easy cleaning after shooting corrosive ammo. Price is high for what it is, just a fun plinker, but I've no regrets. Its too bad there can be no new full autos, as these just cry out for it!

The PPSh-43s really need to be made as Short Barreled Rifless or have the barrels extended so the folding stock could be made to work.

I didn't try any accuracy shooting off a rest as initially I was only worried about function, but shooting off-hand and blasting away, the paper at 50 yards looked pretty much like what a I get when I do the same with an AK.

--wally.

gunnerh
February 12, 2008, 12:08 AM
I looked one over at MGS but I did not buy too much $$$ for an oversized plinker. I have dealt with David Noble and the late Fred Noble since the 70's. I always got treated in a fair and honest manner.

Cannonball888
February 12, 2008, 07:29 PM
Comrades! No complaints here about my MGS PPSh41.
My wife likes it too.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v45/Cannonball888/OlyaPPsh2Sepia2.jpg

armoredman
February 14, 2008, 11:17 AM
Cute pic!

MechAg94
February 16, 2008, 07:54 PM
I saw the Military Gun Supply people at the Houston gun show today (George R. Brown CC). They were selling the Sig P225 used pistols is the reason I stopped by. Anyway, the guy had a couple of the "pistol" 43's and 44's shown on their site. He said they would have carbines available within a couple weeks to a month. Just in case anyone wants to get one.

http://www.militarygunsupply.com/shop2/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=14_15&zenid=b1kstoe6i4ph2v85orhaaf5085

JWarren
February 16, 2008, 08:12 PM
I've only had one experience with MGS and it was OK.

I ordered a converted Saiga 308 and they sent me a converted Saiga 12. They corrected the problem quickly and the 308 was a great rifle and a great conversion.

In retrospect-- considering the cost of Saiga 12's now, I should have let the mistake stand.


-- John

TulaMosin
September 5, 2008, 05:24 PM
I just got one of those today and so far I've only got one thing to say about the experience.

I will never buy a gun from Military Gun Supply ever again. Dealing with them was not pleasant AT ALL.:mad:

As for the rifle, I'm impressed with the look and feel and I can't wait to take it to the range.

Halo
September 5, 2008, 06:03 PM
Are these rebuilt from original parts or new manufacture?

As an aside, in the German film Stalingrad the Germans are shown carrying the PPSh almost all the time. I'd read about how the Germans liked them but this was the first movie I've seen that made a point of it. "They're better than ours, they never jam!"

TulaMosin
September 5, 2008, 06:10 PM
Does anyone here know if the drum magazine can be completely taken apart. I'm trying to get it cosmolene (sp?) free.

Halo
September 5, 2008, 06:27 PM
TulaMosin sorry to not directly answer your question since I don't know anything about the drums, but if you can't disassemble it one thing you can do is put it in hot (close to boiling) water. The cosmoline melts at about 130 degrees and floats up to the top. Once no more comes out of the drum, remove it and dry it. It should be cosmoline-free by then.

TulaMosin
September 5, 2008, 07:06 PM
Thanks, I figured out how to get the thing apart. It's now cosmo free and should function well.

arthurcw
September 5, 2008, 07:22 PM
My wife keeps seeing one of these at gunshows. It's all I can do to drag her away from it. She wants one so bad.

If they made it in 9mm, it'd be in the safe right now.

TulaMosin
September 5, 2008, 08:31 PM
Why is the fact that it's not 9mm stopping you? 7.62 Tokarev ammo is extraordinarily cheap. Heck, that's one of the main reasons I got one.

macadore
September 6, 2008, 12:50 AM
They also have a parts kit with a 10 inch barrel and a reproduction semi-auto receiver. Would it be possible for a civilian to build one and get it approved as a SBR, or does one have to have a license to do that? Even with the $200 tax, it would be cheaper than the one with the 16 inch barrel.

leadcounsel
October 6, 2010, 07:37 PM
delete dupe.

leadcounsel
October 6, 2010, 07:38 PM
I'm considering getting one of these. Anyone else want to chime in on the quality and durability after some 'long term' use, or even new owners with their impressions?

WardenWolf
October 6, 2010, 07:41 PM
Get a Finnish M31 Suomi. They're pretty much the same thing, but in 9mm. They're also a lot cheaper:

http://www.jgsales.com/product_info.php/p/finnish-m31-suomi-9mm-submachine-gun-style%2C-16-25in-/products_id/3889

These guns get great reviews, too. People say they run great unless you get a lemon, and you can always have it exchanged if that happens.

leadcounsel
October 6, 2010, 08:05 PM
Good point. But 9x19 is 4 times as expensive as 7.62x39, and the latter is way hotter...

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