Prvi Partizan vs. Lithuanian vs. Igman for 7.62x51


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cuervo
February 13, 2008, 12:49 PM
Has anyone shot both of these to compare them?

I may have to bite the bullet and buy some .308 while prices are high, and wasn't sure which of these two is better.

The Prvi Partizan and Igman are a little less expensive, but Ammoman is calling the Lithuanian "near match" if that really means anything.

Assuming I reload someday, is one set of brass better?

thanks

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gunnerh
February 13, 2008, 02:35 PM
I shot the Prvi Partizan in .308,.223,6.5 Swede and 6.5 Carano. It shot well and the brass is clean and reloaded well. The Igman in .223 worked well but was dirty. I have not shot any of the Lithuanian.

Dave R
February 13, 2008, 03:11 PM
Don't know these cartridges--but if reloadability is an issue for you, check to see whether the ammo is boxer primed or berdan primed. Boxer primed is reloadable. Berdan is not (unless you got special non-standard equipment.)

MOST surplus is Berdan primed, and not reloadable. Exceptions exist (IVI and Hirtenberger, for example.) MOST commercial ammo is boxer primed and reloadable. Exceptions exist.

fireflyfather
February 13, 2008, 03:26 PM
Prvi Partisan will be boxer primed. It's the same factory that makes Wolf Gold/Hotshot. The brass is perfectly reloadable. It is NOT surplus unless you buy it in a spam can with no brand name on the ammo boxes.

AndyC
February 13, 2008, 04:15 PM
Igman is boxer-primed - so is the Prvi brass-cased ammo. I believe that Lithuanian is Boxer-primed as well, according to a friend who has some - he knows his ammo and was impressed with it.

jonnyc
February 13, 2008, 09:40 PM
"Near Match" means the same as "almost pregnant". The Lithuanian is good ammo, but that's just foolishness.

All 3 are good shooting ammo and reloadable. Get the cheapest.

TexasRifleman
February 13, 2008, 10:25 PM
"Near Match" means the same as "almost pregnant". The Lithuanian is good ammo, but that's just foolishness.


From another post I made here, and the results of MUCH data gathering on this from lots of folks that shoot LOTS of 7.62x51


The case to case deviation alone puts this in "near match" category. Bullet weight and MV comparisons are around as well, and they show similar quality and repeatability.

This is THE best 7.62x51 ammo you will find for sale today, and unfortunately there probably won't be much more depending on how the elections go.

It's not "match grade" but it's as close as you can buy on the market today, qualifying it I'd say for the term "near match"

If you have DATA that rebukes this please post it. Otherwise I have to ask, how much of this ammo have YOU used?

To the OP, if you reload the Lithuanian is the brass to have since Lake City is all but unobtainable.

Several of the importers that specialize in this type of ammo have tested the Lithuanian surplus and find that it is comparable to Lake City.

Some info.... GGG is the Lithuanian.....

weight of fired cases:
GGG(Lithuanian)=181.6 avg
Lake city= 183.25
Winchester= 163.42
RP = 169.6
Federal = 184.12

Winchester varied the most ranging from160.8 to168.9
RP had a variation of 2 gr+or -
Federal had a variation of + or- 1.8
Lake city had a variation of 1.5
GGG had a variation of .5
GGG fit through Dillon case gage 8 times out of 10 after firing.
10 cases of each chosen at random after tumbling.

From the research done by the importers it appears that Winchester setup the manufacturing process for the Lithuanian plant that's turning this stuff out about the same time Clinton gave them M14s and no ammo. The fact that the brass is boxer primed would tend to lend believability to that since you'd really expect Berdan priming if it were "third world" equipment.

The brass does not have a NATO headstamp, they didn't receive the certification for that until 2005. This ammo was 2004 and before for the most part but the weight of the brass indicates they planned for this certification even then.

The company that's making it is ISO9001 certified.


Here's the companies website..... http://www.ggg-ammo.lt/en/index.php

Bazooka Joe71
February 13, 2008, 10:33 PM
I have yet to shoot any Igman, but I have shot Prvi and Lith, and I prefer the Lith as far as accuracy is concerned.



BTW, you better watch what you say about Lith when Texasrifleman is around...He bites!:p

jonnyc
February 14, 2008, 07:19 AM
I agree it shoots well. However...it is still military surplus ammo, and I put very little faith in any manufacturer's website tests. The term "near match" is too vague to have any real meaning. If it was the same price as the two other milsurp flavors I would get it. It isn't (for the time being), so it is not really worth it for me or most "non-match" shooters.

TexasRifleman
February 14, 2008, 09:35 AM
I agree it shoots well. However...it is still military surplus ammo, and I put very little faith in any manufacturer's website tests.

Of the 3 ammo brands mentioned in this thread only one is "surplus" and that's the Igman. The PP is not even 7.62x51, it's .308 and the GGG is not surplus either.

There's tons of testing that didn't come from anyone but shooters here in the US, none of the data I provided came from GGG.

And as for the price, did you notice the brass measurements? The brass from GGG ammo is thicker than anything on the market so if you reload the small price difference per case of this is easily made up for in MUCH longer brass life. The fact that it will fit into a case gauge after firing, without resizing, the majority of the time is certainly an indicator of the thick brass.

It is 2 cents a round more than the other 2 brands mentioned here, easily justified by the quality of the brass. Total price is so out of line it's crazy but all ammo is that way. The price delta is what's important, and it's only $20/1000 difference.

The OP asked which to buy for reloading and the GGG is leaps and bounds ahead of the other 2 for its' brass.

It's the best ammo around right now mainly for the brass. And if you're not saving .308/7.62 brass now, even if you don't reload, then you ARE crazy.

Cannonball888
February 14, 2008, 03:57 PM
I've heard from various sources that Portugese milsurp is the most accurate. Of course being that it is scarce.

El Tejon
February 14, 2008, 04:01 PM
The Baltic ammo has been a great performer for me. I've been able to get the Lith ammo at $.20 a round recently.

jonnyc
February 14, 2008, 04:27 PM
Where?!?!?!?

apocryph
February 14, 2008, 04:34 PM
Where?!?!?!?

What he said!

El Tejon
February 14, 2008, 04:38 PM
Indy 1500 gun shows. Next one is in March. Two brothers, younger guys, from Ohio. They always give me a break as I buy all they have.:)

apocryph
February 14, 2008, 04:41 PM
Indy 1500 gun shows. Next one is in March. Two brothers, younger guys, from Ohio. They always give me a break as I buy all they have.

That's one helluva break! I'd feel lucky to find it at twice that price.

El Tejon
February 14, 2008, 04:44 PM
Never be afraid to ask, buy all they have and pay cash.:)

Of course, it pays to be lucky too. I hit on some RSA .308 ammo at a Lafayette show for .10 last year. I don't expect to repeat that one.

Magnuumpwr
February 14, 2008, 05:34 PM
Does $475+shipping/1000 sound about right for Lith. 308? It will be $510 delivered.

Soybomb
February 14, 2008, 05:47 PM
Does $475+shipping/1000 sound about right for Lith. 308?

I'd go further and say that it sounds like a better than usual price.

LeibstandarteAdH
February 14, 2008, 06:18 PM
All three are boxer primed, and are the three best sources of 7.62x51 at the moment in terms of quality. The brass on the lithiuanian stuff is a little softer to me when reloading for my G3. Personally i'd go with Igman, just for personal prefrence. Igman and Privi are at least on par with Lake City in my book.

Magnuumpwr
February 14, 2008, 06:26 PM
Here is the info on the Lith. 308 @ $475/1000rds.
The make is Lithuanian GGG and its a FMJ brass case 146 grain, M80 Ball, military grade (meets all U.S and NATO specs), It has a boxer primer and is reloadable, non-corrosive, and near match grade. We have full manu. certification, this ammo is 2003/04 production and is certified for 10 years from the manufacturing date. It is also completely insured. This is for a crate that contains 5 Battle Packs with 10 boxes of 20 rounds each for a total of 1000 rounds per crate. Delivery depending on location and is between 30-60 dollars. Please inform us if we would be shipping to a business or residential address. Each case is standard size weighing 71.42 pounds.

ilcylic
February 14, 2008, 10:42 PM
Link?

AndyC
February 14, 2008, 10:55 PM
Here's another one:

http://www.ammoman.com/webstore_308.htm

LITHUANIAN 762x51 AMMUNITION - 146 GRAIN
FULL METAL JACKET - MILITARY GRADE - FULL NATO SPECS.
BOXER PRIMED, NON-CORROSIVE and RELOADABLE
2003 / 04 PPRODUCTION

COMES IN SEALED MILITARY BATTLE PACKS - BRIGHT & SHINY
EXTREMELY ACCURATE - NEAR MATCH GRADE
NOT EASILY AVAILABLE AT THIS QUANTITY IN THE U.S.

1,000 ROUND CASE SHIPS IN THE FACTORY WOOD CRATE
FULL CRATE IS 60 POUNDS AND SHIPS FREE

CASH PICK UP PRICE
$465-CRATE OF 1,000 OUT THE DOOR

FREE SHIPPING

Part Number #762-146GR-LITHU-500, -1000, -5000

Magnuumpwr
February 14, 2008, 11:40 PM
LITHUANIAN 762x51 AMMUNITION - 146 GRAIN
FULL METAL JACKET - MILITARY GRADE - FULL NATO SPECS.
BOXER PRIMED, NON-CORROSIVE and RELOADABLE
2003 / 04 PPRODUCTION

COMES IN SEALED MILITARY BATTLE PACKS - BRIGHT & SHINY
EXTREMELY ACCURATE - NEAR MATCH GRADE
NOT EASILY AVAILABLE AT THIS QUANTITY IN THE U.S.

1,000 ROUND CASE SHIPS IN THE FACTORY WOOD CRATE
FULL CRATE IS 60 POUNDS AND SHIPS FREE

CASH PICK UP PRICE
$465-CRATE OF 1,000 OUT THE DOOR

FREE SHIPPING

Part Number #762-146GR-LITHU-500, -1000, -5000
But the shipping price is $520. Here is their phone number at AmmoWorks Phone: 1-888-535-AMMO(2666)

stubbicatt
February 15, 2008, 11:00 AM
Anybody know whether the Lithuanian ammo has a tar sealant? My rifle hates that stuff.

Magnuumpwr
February 15, 2008, 11:10 AM
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=92320496 There is a photo here of the ammo and it doesn't appear to have any sealer:confused:, seems alittle odd for surplus.

TexasRifleman
February 15, 2008, 02:00 PM
seems alittle odd for surplus.

Over and over again..

THIS IS NOT MILSURP AMMO

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