Assault wepon was a BASEBALL BAT! Self defense weapon was a 12 gauge shotgun!


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WAGCEVP
August 3, 2003, 09:37 PM
Assault wepon was a BASEBALL BAT! Self defense weapon was a 12 gauge shotgun!
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(CA) Roommate wounds violent assailants 07-29-03


Tables turned on suspected assailants
http://archive.redding.com/story.asp?StoryID={2258BDD4-F50D-4849-A0B2-0C1FFAEF80DC}

Tables turned on suspected assailants
Margo Horner
Published: July 29, 2003 in News

Tom Chu thought he might die Sunday night when two masked men kicked
down his front door and began beating him with baseball bats.

"They tried to take my knee out and that's when I went down to the
ground. When I went down they started pounding on me with the bats," the
Redding man said Monday.

Chu said they continued beating him until his roommate, Kyle Wymore,
intervened. The 20-year-old had retrieved a 12-gauge shotgun from the
garage and shot the intruders, according to Redding police.

A prosecutor said Monday that it appeared Wymore was within his rights
when he shot the two men.

"A man's home is his castle and you have a right to protect your home
from an intruder,"
Shasta County Senior Deputy District Attorney
Greg Gaul said. "It's slightly different if you're on the street and
somebody punches you. You wouldn't be able to pull out a gun and kill
them. But in your residence, the rules are a little bit different."

The alleged assailants, meanwhile, are hospitalized at Mercy Medical
Center in Redding. No charges have been filed in the case yet.

Wymore told Redding police the two men broke through the front door of
the Weatherby Court residence about 11:30 p.m. and began the assault on
his roommate.

Moments later he fired three rounds at close range. Galen Kusic, 20, of
Davis was struck in the abdomen and Levi Gardiff, 20, of Redding was
shot twice in the chest.

Police said the amount of force Wymore used was not excessive.

"In a combat situation you would fire as many times as necessary," said
Redding police Sgt. John Hawkins. "In this case there were three rounds
fired and two individuals hit. That is very reasonable."

Gaul agreed with that assessment.

"If somebody breaks into your house and they're armed, you can use
lethal force to stop them," he said. "You don't have to wait until
you're shot or you're beaten up or something like that.

"The penal code calls it justifiable homicide," he said.

After they were shot, the two men ran down the street screaming in pain
before some people stopped to help them, Hawkins said.

It was not clear why the men chose the Weatherby Court residence, or if
they were associated with the residents, Hawkins said.
Kusic was in stable condition, and Gardiff was in serious condition at
Mercy.

The two men could face charges of breaking andentering and assault with a deadly weapon, Gaul said.

Chu, meanwhile, said he is grateful that his roommate came to his aid Sunday night. The 20-year-old suffered bruises on his legs and had some abrasions.

"Kyle saved my life," he said.

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Jim March
August 3, 2003, 09:51 PM
Sure sounds like the gun was loaded with birdshot or something, doesn't it? 'Cuz two to the chest and the guy's running down the street screaming doesn't sound like the results of any load I'd use :scrutiny:.

3" Magnum 000 would leave him deader'n'Elvis.

Whatever. If it's stupid and it works, it's not stupid. Sub-optimal maybe :rolleyes: but whatever, it was a clean shoot and kudos to the roomie with a cool head even if the ammo choice was dumb.

eotp
August 3, 2003, 10:30 PM
"A man's home is his castle and you have a right to protect your home from an intruder," Shasta County Senior Deputy District Attorney Greg Gaul said. "It's slightly different if you're on the street and somebody punches you. You wouldn't be able to pull out a gun and kill them. But in your residence, the rules are a little bit different."

If a couple of masked guys on the street start beating me with a baseball bat, I'll pull out a gun and kill them if I am able to do so. And I don't see how in the world that I wouldn't be justified in such a scenario.

I wonder what DA Gaul would do in such a situation if he was the one getting whacked. :what:

goalie
August 3, 2003, 10:38 PM
In Minnesota, just the fact that there are multiple attackers, even without the bats, fufills the "disparity of force" requirement of self defense. And that is in a state that is pretty pathetic IMO

Telperion
August 3, 2003, 10:46 PM
Looks like the local law enforcement and DA actually believe in self-defense. Not surprisingly, according to Jim's big map, there's 3369 CCW permits issued for 163,256 county residents (around 2%).

FPrice
August 3, 2003, 10:48 PM
"3" Magnum 000 would leave him deadr'n'Elvis."

That ain't very dead. Why I saw the King last week chowing down on a couple of whattaburgers.

But i agree, it was NOT an anti=personnel round by any means.

Standing Wolf
August 3, 2003, 11:29 PM
After they were shot, the two men ran down the street screaming in pain before some people stopped to help them, Hawkins said.

<sarcasm> Victims, I guess. Poor, pitiful, helpless victims. </sarcasm>

Keeper
August 4, 2003, 12:01 AM
Yaaahhhhh!!! Good Guys. I was thinking bird shot also. If he was using 00 or even #4 those two are the luckiest dumbasses alive at the moment.

Carnitas
August 4, 2003, 02:04 AM
Shasta county Looks like the local law enforcement and DA actually believe in self-defense. Not surprisingly, according to Jim's big map, there's 3369 CCW permits issued for 163,256 county residents (around 2%).


Of course, Shasta County is not in California. Its in the stealth rural state that also uses the name California as part of its disguise.

4v50 Gary
August 4, 2003, 03:02 PM
Assault with a deadly weapon is OK but attempted murder is better - especially if there are any blows to the head. Kudos to the roomie who blasted away. Too bad he didn't do headshots. Shasta County would be saving a lot of $ in medical expenses right now.

greyhound
August 4, 2003, 03:16 PM
I don't get it. Half the advice I hear is that at close range, i.e. home defense, birdshot is as good as buck, and less likely to retain energy through walls, etc.

The other half of advice is don't use birdshot as the wound channel isn't deep enough.

So now I'll just go one birdshot, then one buckshot, etc.

But in this story, whatever they use sure didn't put 'em down (did end the attack though).

HBK
August 4, 2003, 03:51 PM
I would think shotgun blasts at close range would be lethal! What was he using, rock salt?

CMichael
August 4, 2003, 03:59 PM
I don't get it either. How were they able to run away after being shot at close range with a 12 gauge, even with birdshot????

GlocksRock
August 4, 2003, 04:59 PM
If the gun was retrieved from the garage I doubt that its pirmary role was defense. Maybe now these guys will be better prepared and have a more effective selection of ammo, and a gun closer by. I'm glad things worked out the way they did.

MicroBalrog
August 4, 2003, 06:58 PM
Pro-gun article from Untactikalifornia? The mind boggles.:what:

greyhound
August 5, 2003, 08:08 AM
What was he using, rock salt?

HBK-

Almost spit out my grapefruit juice at that one!:D

Richardson
August 5, 2003, 08:38 AM
It would be interesting to know just how far the shooter stood from the attackers, and just what size shot was used. Too many times I've heard that "even birshot, at close ranges, is like a slug"....

I guess I'll just keep the slugs in the buttstock sleeve....

Richardson

Kobun
August 5, 2003, 09:54 AM
Greyhound; So now I'll just go one birdshot, then one buckshot, etc.
Don't mix your ammo. You will probably become confused in the heat of battle.
It is better to have one sort of ammo, and then if you must, have addittional types on a sidesaddle.
Try shooting a shotgun match with different loads (bird, buck and slug), and see how that works when you need to reengage a target, and then everything is messed up for the rest of the targets. (Bird on steel, buck on close paper and slugs on long shots).
It is almost impossible to plan ahead in a competition, and really impossible to plan for a real life encounter.

K.

Carlos Cabeza
August 5, 2003, 10:54 AM
Its probably safe to say it wasn't the turkey gun with an extra full choke and a heavy load.

DMK
August 5, 2003, 11:08 AM
Shasta County Senior Deputy District Attorney
Greg Gaul said. "It's slightly different if you're on the street and
somebody punches you. You wouldn't be able to pull out a gun and kill
them. But in your residence, the rules are a little bit different."
Um, what? :confused:

If somebody is assaulting you and your life is in jeapordy, what difference does it make where they are trying to do it? :banghead:

MrAcheson
August 5, 2003, 01:58 PM
It matters because (1) they are punching you which is not deadly force and (2) on the street you can run away to somewhere safer. Most states require you to withdraw if thats feasible.

Where are you going to run to if you are at home, though? The neighbors I suppose, but your home should be your castle. Its the place you run to, not the place you run from, and most state's laws recognize that difference.

Quartus
August 5, 2003, 02:54 PM
Half the advice I hear is that at close range, i.e. home defense, birdshot is as good as buck


There's a lot of bad advice out there, folks. A lot of it on this board.


The reality is that chance happens, and there is no such thing as a sure one shot stop. Not even 00. No, not even a headshot.


You listen to GENUINE experts (not gun store commandos who brag about dropping the bad guys with one shot in the eye), and you do all you can to stack the odds in your favor with good choices of guns and ammo. And you train. And you refine your technique. And you strive to constantly learn and improve.


But there is no certainty.

Carlos Cabeza
August 5, 2003, 03:02 PM
Its certainly up to the individual to research the information of one's interests. Both of them punks would have died if it were me with the shotgun.:rolleyes:

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