.22 cal, low noise loads


PDA






Picknlittle
February 23, 2008, 02:23 PM
I live in a sparsely populated residential area that is more woods than houses. We border on farmland and do hunt some in these woods. I mostly bow hunt, but would like to squirrel hunt with a .22 rifle. I'm looking for low noise, sub sonic loads. I'm not expecting an air gun "pfft", but something that won't alarm neighbors.

There are sub sonics in both long rifle and shorts, but I wonder about the difference in noise between them

Any help?

If you enjoyed reading about ".22 cal, low noise loads" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!
CBS220
February 23, 2008, 03:48 PM
Get the long rifle subsonics. They aren't that loud and they don't carry the noise far. In addition, they will cycle semiautos. I like the Remington Subsonics because they are cheap, and accurate enough for $2.25/50.

If you need air-gun quiet from your .22, look at Aguila's Colibris and Super Colibris. CCI's CB caps are about as quiet, but more powerful and cost much more.

Vermont
February 23, 2008, 04:56 PM
I wouldn't get the Aguila Super Colibri .22LR. They are powered by the primer only and they should be used only in handguns because the bullet may get stuck in the bore of a rifle.

I got some by accident because I didn't read the warning on the Midway website. Fortunately I went back and read it after I saw on the box that they had no gunpowder. I didn't fire any so I can't say what the chances of it getting stuck are, but I wouldn't chance it. The non-super Colibri might work for you though.

Sorry I can't help you with the long vs. short question.

ScottsGT
February 23, 2008, 05:06 PM
I have an old Savage bolt action .22 that I have used CB shorts/subsonics in and it sounds like a high power pellet gun. Just becareful, don't aim for squirrels up in trees. If you miss, you have no idea as to where that bullet is going to land!

CBS220
February 23, 2008, 05:09 PM
I'm not sure if that's a myth or what, but I've fired many, many bricks of SC with no problems from both rifles and handguns.

JoeG52
February 23, 2008, 05:51 PM
For what it is worth, the CCI cb caps don't have powder either, just a primer. I suspect that is what all cb caps have.

goon
February 23, 2008, 05:57 PM
The Wolf Target loads are very quiet and accurate in my CZ-452.
They're quiet enough that the bullet hitting the squirrel seems as loud as the actual firing.

Ratshooter
February 23, 2008, 06:08 PM
Hate to tell you this JoeG52 but the CCI cbs do have powder in them. I just cut one open and checked.

If you want to shoot Colibri loads use the Super variety. Make sure they come out of your barrel. I had one stick in an old remington with a 24" barrel.

They seem to work OK in a 10-22 barrel but don't have a lot of power. The best way i have found to get quiet shooting is to use your longest barreled rifle with the CB 22s. A 24" barrel really cuts down on the report.

Starter52
February 23, 2008, 09:00 PM
We use thousands of CCI Target Shorts each summer at camp. They are both quiet and accurate.

The CCI target short is more powerful than the CB-style shorts. They will take care of squirrels if you do your part.

You might want to try the target shorts. Don't go with the Hi-Velocity shorts. They are not subsonic from a rifle barrel and are quite a bit louder.

627PCFan
February 23, 2008, 09:06 PM
I use Agiala SSS 60 grains. Shoots more accurate than any standard velocity 22, and is quiet enough for me not to be nervous about-

U.S.SFC_RET
February 23, 2008, 09:08 PM
CCI sells a nice salve that goes on and stops the pain and swelling when the neighbors are around. At about 710 Feet per second they make the pain go away. I hate squirrels, especially when they get into attics, cars, boats ect..

TimM
February 23, 2008, 09:19 PM
Check these out. a=0350103&cm_ite=0024232215204a&_requestid=73146"]http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/templates/links/link.jsp;jsessionid=FW2C5SLQA4LRXLAQBBJCCNVMCAEFGIWE?id=0024232215204a&type=product&cmCat=froogle&cm_ven=data_feed&cm_cat=froogle&cm_pla=0350103&cm_ite=0024232215204a&_requestid=73146[/URL]

http://i193.photobucket.com/albums/z126/instag8r/22jpg.jpg

230RN
February 24, 2008, 02:47 AM
I suspect the 60 gr SSS bullet (post # 12) would go too far in the case of a miss, and still be dangerous when it came down. The 20 gr bullet from the Aguila Suoer Colibri sans poudre rounds would not be as dangerous. It is about the equivalent of a #4 buck pellet. Probably not fun to get hit with, but the 60 gr SSS is about the equivalent of 00 Buck pellet, weight wise.

I found the first shot of the SC sans poudre rounds got stuck in a well-worn 18" Remington Nylon 66 bolt rifle barrel, but I ramrodded it out and ran a Boresnake through the rifle and all the rest (about twenty rounds) went through OK.

With a 25" barreled Reminton 512, no shots stuck in the barrel (about 10 rounds) but by then I had gotten smart enough to run a Boresnake through the barrel before trying it.

Both these rifles are "well broken in," having had thousands of rounds through them, so the barrels are pretty smooth by now.

The 60 gr loads seem to have fair accuracy out of my Ruger MK II pistol and do cycle, but have a tendency to not feed well.

The 20 gr loads shot about 3" to the right out of the Nylon 66 at about 30 feet. It is not impossible that this was because the rifle lost its zero at some point in transporting it. Penetration was anywhere from 150 to 200 pages of dry telephone book. Group was about 2", but the scope was not focused for this distance. I cannot find the target for the same loads out of the Remington 512, so I can't give any sighting information on the 20gr loads in that rifle.

In a pistol, even the Super Colibri sans poudre loads give a substantial report... enough to make one's ears ring indoors.

Out of the 25" barrel, the firing pin click is louder than the report, although the little 20 gr bullets do make a smack when they hit telephone books. The 18" Remington makes a moderate "pop," not enough to disturb anyone.

I am pleased to note that the Telephone Company recently was generous enough to leave more free indoor backstop material at my front door for future, more comprehensive, testing
--Terry

ColinthePilot
February 24, 2008, 06:04 AM
I've shot some of the CCI cb's out of a Ruger 96/22 in .22LR (ruger's site lists the 96/22 as .22WMR so I'm not 100% on the model number.) My friend had a raccoon problem, but his neighbors are pretty close and didn't want to deal with them, so we tried some out, firing into a hill behind his house. It was no louder than my Daisy.

PointOneSeven
February 24, 2008, 01:39 PM
I popped a squirrel with a remington subsonic round. Went right into the shoulder and didn't exit. Pretty clean kill, and was pretty quiet. A few pops through a rifle won't wind anybody up with those.

BackCountry
February 24, 2008, 04:09 PM
I use the Aguila SSS for shooting beaver in our neighborhood. They work effectively and are quiet. I used to use #4 Buck shot, but in recent years we have had retired Californians (some with wifes from other countries) move into the area. They get upset at the shotgun blasts at dinner time - I told them to move back to California if they don't like Colorado traditions. The problem with the .22lr is that the beaver come out only at night (they are very destructive to our trees and water rights/irrigation) and I can not see my iron sights when they are finally out. My solution was to switch to my AR-15 with red dot or illuminated reticle sights and a weapons mounted light. I hand load 55 gr. .224's with 2.5 gr of Green Dot. This gives a sub sonic .22 round that makes almost no noise and destroys beaver. These won't cycle the gas operated system of the AR but are very accurate and don't disturb the neighbors.

rcmodel
February 24, 2008, 04:15 PM
I use Agiala SSS 60 grains. It should be noted that these bullets are way too long to stablize in most standard twist .22 LR barrels.

I tried them in a Ruger 10/22, a Winchester 62A, and a Browning .22 Auto rifle, as well as a Colt Woodsman pistol, and they key-holed at 30 yards out of all four guns.

Shoot'm if you like, but try them on paper at 25 yards and see what the results are first.
I bet you will be disappointed!

I wouldn't get the Aguila Super Colibri .22LR. They are powered by the primer only and they should be used only in handguns because the bullet may get stuck in the bore of a rifle. That's lawyer COYA speak.
I have used both Colbri & Super Colibri for function test ammo for about 10 years now in the shop.
That includes shooting them through every type of old & new .22 rifle, including some Winchester 1890's & 06's that had bores that looked liked an old stove-pipe.

I have never yet had one stick in the bore on any rifle.

Perhaps if you had a 32" long barrel or something, maybe?

rcmodel

JoeG52
February 24, 2008, 04:52 PM
Ratshooter,
I've pulled CCI cb caps apart and there is no powder, just a heavy priming. The ones I have are about 10 - 12 years old, maybe they changed?
I also have some remington cb caps, haven't pulled any of those open yet.

C96
February 24, 2008, 08:56 PM
CCI used to make both a "target" short and a non "target" short. The "target" short was quieter than the non target version in my BL22. I didn't notice any power difference but I didn't look for any. So my experience is a bit different than Starter52's experience. I also used a few RWS target shorts, expensive and hard to find. If you shoot some .22 Bullseye you may run into the RWS if it is still around.

My BL22 would handle the shorts quite nicely and was quite accurate to twenty yards or so. Lots of shorts will produce the need to do some serious chamber cleaning, just part of the fun, right ?

Ratshooter
February 24, 2008, 10:14 PM
Hey JoeG52 how you doin'. The CCI Cbs i used are marked 22 CB. These are in a plastic 100 round count box bought at Wal-mart for $4.37. I've had them a while. In typical CCI fashion they don't telll you anything past that.

Maybe we are lookin at two different loadings? If you find out something new then please post it. I love quiet ammo. Its surprising how usefull this stuff is. Thomas.

C96
February 25, 2008, 12:47 AM
Went to CCI's web site and they list:

0026 22 Short CB 29 LRN 710 fps muzzle
0027 22 Short Short HV 29 GLRN 1080 fps muzzle
0028 22 Short Short HP 27 GLHP 1105 fps muzzle
0037 22 Short Short Target 29 LRN 830 fps muzzle

They say that their part 0026 has the same specs as their 22 CB Long, part # 0038 and refer to those parts as their low noise ammo of choice.

Now all you have to do is figure out how to get some for trying. Some of those will be hard to find.

allan

chris in va
February 25, 2008, 03:28 AM
Supressor.

possom813
February 25, 2008, 07:40 AM
I'm going to have to call bs on the Super Colibri's getting stuck in a rifle barrel. I use them quite often from a Springfield 87A and it's the longest .22 I own and I've shot several hundred through it with not one getting stuck. And the great thing about them is when fired they sound like a fart in the wind.

I'm not saying that they absolutely won't get stuck, but it's never happened to me in that gun. The only other gun I've fired them out of was a single six.

-John

627PCFan
February 25, 2008, 09:01 AM
"It should be noted that these bullets are way too long to stablize in most standard twist .22 LR barrels."

if your shooting them in a handgun forget it. Some slow twist rifle barrels wont work either-

"I suspect the 60 gr SSS bullet (post # 12) would go too far in the case of a miss, and still be dangerous when it came down."

Word to the wise, 60 grainers bounce and richochette horribly if you don't hit what your aiming at.

Picknlittle
February 25, 2008, 10:09 AM
Thanks a bunch folks,...lots of good recommendations.

mbt2001
February 25, 2008, 10:10 AM
http://www.cabelas.com/prod-1/0029401214245a.shtml

xsquidgator
February 25, 2008, 11:08 AM
Not quite what you're looking for, buuuut... I found out while working up some 45 loads that 2.0 grains of W231 under a 230LRN sounds like a quiet .22 It does get the bullet out of the barrel, I do know it will go at least 50 feet or so. I've never heard a suppressed handgun before but I imagine it sounds like this. There's not enough umph in it to cycle the slide, so you have to jack the slide by hand with each shot. How cool would it be to quietly hunt squirrels with a 45?

230RN
February 25, 2008, 09:10 PM
Possum 813, if you are referring to my Post 13, calling BS (your Post 23) is a serious matter.

It did happen to me, and just because it hasn't happened to you doesn't mean it's impossible.

You will note that I did not have any get stuck in the barrels after I ran a Boresnake through them.

You also said that "I'm not saying that they absolutely won't get stuck, but it's never happened to me in that gun."

Therefore, you are contradicting yourself by calling BS and then saying it's not impossible.

And neither of the long guns I tried them in was a Springfield 87A... they were a Remington bolt Nylon 66 and a Remington 512.

And Aguila specifically recommends against using these cartridges in a rifle to alert folks to this possibility.

If you were indeed referring to my post, I shall have my seconds call on you in the mawnin', suh, with the full expectation of receivin' an apology. :)

possom813
February 25, 2008, 10:17 PM
Possum 813, if you are referring to my Post 13, calling BS (your Post 23) is a serious matter.

It did happen to me, and just because it hasn't happened to you doesn't mean it's impossible.

You will note that I did not have any get stuck in the barrels after I ran a Boresnake through them.

You also said that "I'm not saying that they absolutely won't get stuck, but it's never happened to me in that gun."

Therefore, you are contradicting yourself by calling BS and then saying it's not impossible.

And neither of the long guns I tried them in was a Springfield 87A... they were a Remington bolt Nylon 66 and a Remington 512.

And Aguila specifically recommends against using these cartridges in a rifle to alert folks to this possibility.

If you were indeed referring to my post, I shall have my seconds call on you in the mawnin', suh, with the full expectation of receivin' an apology.

Nope, wasn't referring to your post. I was in a hurry this morning typing a reply(had to get to work). I didn't bother trying to read a lot this morning, just offering up my experiences with the Super Colibri's.

You're right upon reading how I wrote it that I contradicted myself, I'll write that off as still being asleep.:p

But what I was trying to say is that the 87A is freakishly long for any .22 I've owned except for an old Remington my mom had. They were pretty close to the same length. So what I meant was that if anything, it should get stuck in the really long barrel as opposed to the short barrel of say a 10/22 carbine.

And for Aguila specifically recommending not to use it in a rifle, c'mon, who reads the directions on dangerous stuff??? :D

And finally, I'll go ahead an apologize to ya for the confusion. Usually if I'm replying to a specific post I'll quote the part I'm replying to.

-John

230RN
February 26, 2008, 01:23 AM
I figured it was something like that. I occasionally skip over some posts myself and fail to read instructions, but that confession is between you and me and don't tell anyone else.

You are a gentleman, suh.

(And mine's bigger than yours. :neener: The Remington 512 barrel is 25" long. ;) )

Ratshooter
February 26, 2008, 01:39 AM
For what its worth i have a Remington 512 with a ring in the barrel from shooting Super Colibris. Numbers one and two made it out. Three and four did not. The ring is just short of the end of the mag tube. I have a 581 that shoots them just fine.

I'm guessing some barrels are tighter than others. Both barrels are very smooth.

Just because it hasn't happened to you doesn't mean it can't happen.

230RN
February 26, 2008, 04:24 AM
Too bad about that ring in the barrel, Ratshooter. Seems that's about where they would stop after running out of pressure and momentum. Does it still shoot OK anyhow?

I theorize, but cannot confirm, that perhaps since there is more fouling after firing a powdered round, that swabbing out the barrel first helped. Thereafter, I think, since there is a lot less residue after firing the sans poudre Colibris, that you can shoot a few of them before fouling builds up enough to stop one.

I make sure that every one of those little 20-grain bullets gets out before loading the next cartridge. If I don't see a hole in the paper, I check the barrel.

For what it's worth, the Remington Nylon 66 Bolt gun feeds them from the box magazine, but the 512 won't bring them up from the tubular magazine, with all that cartridge-lifting mechanism involved.

possom813
February 26, 2008, 07:42 AM
(And mine's bigger than yours. The Remington 512 barrel is 25" long. )

Nah Uh, IIRC the 87A barrel is 28 inches, neener neener boo boo :D

230RN
February 26, 2008, 03:19 PM
Nah Uh, IIRC the 87A barrel is 28 inches, neener neener boo boo...

I skulk away in shame.:o I thought you had said 24".

stevgrix
January 31, 2010, 03:17 PM
as with any 22 ... U must try this or any ammo on target first, the accuracy will
vary depeding on the firearm it is shot from, and the batch and manufacturer...
My cz 452 likes winchester sub sonic x22lrsuba.... yours may not....
the longs and shorts vary so much, they are all but not worth the effort, try some on target and watch them fly down range.. they are not connsistent ... I tested at 50 yrds
and grouped at 1.5 inches or worse... win x22lrsuba held better than .5 inch group at 50 yrds.... this is a trail of what your firearm likes.... search.. and find what works for you and your weapon... thats the best answer.....

lions
January 31, 2010, 03:43 PM
Supressor.

I'll second that.

Oyeboten
January 31, 2010, 05:28 PM
I dug out my old boyhood .22 single shot Rifle recently, put a few rounds through it at the Range.

I was very surprised how with Standard Velocity Rounds, seems like the sound is very slight, more or less just a 'snap'.

In a damp or damp and verdant setting, I doubt it would carry much.

Conqueror
January 31, 2010, 06:40 PM
If you live in a free state, get a suppressor. You can shoot full-power ammo, it sounds like an airgun, etc.

Ratshooter
January 31, 2010, 07:28 PM
possum813 I posted the report about the colibri sticking in the barrel. I see you live in Dallas. I live in Burleson just south of Ft Worth. Send me a PM and I will give you my address and you can look at the ring in my 512 barrel made by a Super Colibri yourself. It is 20" down the bore. Maybe that round had a smaller amount of priming compound in it. Its not worth the risk to me to use these anymore in a rifle.

They shoot out of a short barrel like on a 10-22 but it is a risk out of anything longer. Besides when they do exit a 25" barrel they are very slow. The barrel drag kills the velocity. Even out of the 10-22 they are marginal for squirrels.

I now use the remington CeeBee22s with the heavier 32gr (IIRC) bullet. They are a touch louder than CCI CB rounds but seem more accurate in the 1/16 twist. I have a 1/9 twist barrel for the SSS 60gr "Sniper" rounds that fits on my 10-22 rifle.

I made some light loads for a Marlin 1894 in 32 mag using a 76gr lead bullet and 2.2grs of Titegroup that were ever bit as quiet as cb 22s. These went over the chono at just over 900fps. Too bad these little rifles are so hard to find now.

Encampment2
September 17, 2010, 05:00 PM
Here's my experience w the SC.

I shoot in my backyard in the suburbs so normally use CCI CB longs or shorts or Fiocchi LR subsonics. Picked up brick of the Super Colibri at the local Sportsman's Warehouse. First shot thru an old Stevens model 67 (a single shot bolt action w a 22" barrel) did not exit the barrel. Went to my shop
and removed the bullet w a bore cleaner pushed from the chamber (bullet was close to the muzzle).
Tried again, and the second shot made it thru the barrel and richocheted back of of my target backed by a 2"X6" and stung me on the neck (reinforced the importance of wearing shooting glasses).

Not to be deterred (I'm a slow learner) tried the same ammo in a BSA Sportsman 15 (a tube feed bolt action w 21" barrel). First shot stuck in the barrel again. At this point, I will only use these in a revolver.

FWIW, have never had any problems w any cb shorts on longs or any other subsonic rounds. This includes the use of the old CB and BB caps that were imported by Stoeger from Germany.

GLOOB
September 17, 2010, 06:25 PM
Everyone here knows that there's Super Colibri and then there's plain old Colibri?

The lawyer speak says the same thing on the box, but the rounds are different. Regular Colibri comes in a "fruity" yellow/red box and is very quiet in pistols with 4+ barrels. Super Colibri comes in a silver/blue box and is quite loud from a pistol. It is supposed to be 200fps faster than regular Colibri. It is very rare that a Super Colibri will stop in a clean rifle barrel. Heck, it's pretty rare for a regular old Colibri to stop in my rifle.

rcmodel
September 17, 2010, 06:31 PM
Clean the crap out of your barrels with a new bronze bore brush and solvent.

Likely leading in them.

I have used Colbri in my basement shop for about 20 years for function test firing .22 rifles I work on & for zeroing scope install jobs to get them on paper at longer range..

I have never ever yet had one stick in a barrel, even in very old rough Winchester barrels.

rc

gofastman
September 17, 2010, 07:08 PM
for low noise use CCI CB longs, for a little more noise but quite a bit more punch use Remington CBee's

Zanad
September 17, 2010, 07:31 PM
something that may be of help:
Testing Five Different .22 Bullets

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o25ieULe_Ik

Caliper_RWVA
September 19, 2010, 10:22 AM
Everyone here knows that there's Super Colibri and then there's plain old Colibri?

I was thinking the same thing. The SC only hits 1/2" lower at 25yd than the CCI CB's out of my Rem 597 so it's got some reasonable push behind it, don't see how it would fail to leave the barrel unless a squib round.

Only problem is the Super Colibris pattern at 25yd for me. Talking 4-5" with five rounds :barf: Almost worried that the scope was loose until I followed that up with a 5 shot cloverleaf with Aguila SSS. :D

Speaking of the SSS, if they don't stabilize, pay attention to the temperature. The 597 will stabilize them in 80-90* weather but not once the weather turns cold.

My favorite really quiet round are the Remington CeeBees. Good accuracy and work well if you accept that your semi auto is not anymore. I like the CCI CB longs, but more than 5 is sure to jam up my mag due to the shorter length.

Carl N. Brown
September 19, 2010, 10:44 AM
The SubSonic Sniper 60gr is about 945 fps and has the muzzle blast of a standard velocity .22 long rifle. It does not have the supersonic crack of a high velocity .22 LR, but 60gr bullet & 945 fps equals about 120 ft/lbs linetic energy or close to the .22 high velocity 40 gr load. It is very good choice for an urban animal control round in a gun with a silencer.

The CB rounds are a 29gr bullet at ~720 fps or about 32 ft/lb kinetic energy. OK for squirrels as game or pest control at garden ranges, but not for putting down mad dogs.

The Colibri are zimmerpatronen: indoor target practice rounds. I would not use them on game or pest animals.

The CCI CB short and CB long seem to be the same ballistics. The CB Long does not crud up the firing chamber like the short. Both are quiet from a rifle barrel, but are still suprising loud from a 6" pistol (I was hoping they would be quieter).

Animal Mother
September 19, 2010, 11:09 AM
I've shot hundreds of rounds of the Super Colibri out of my Henry lever action .22, it is extremely quiet and I have yet to encounter a stuck bullet in the barrel. The impact of the bullet on the target is louder than the actual report so it is very easy to tell if you were to have a stuck bullet. I could see where a very tight, long, or fouled barrel could cause these to get stuck though, so be careful. I tell you though these things are great. An earlier poster had commented how they were as quiet as a fart in the wind, and that is a fact. They are quite loud out of pistol however, but in a rifle with a closed action...I don't even need hearing protection when shooting those, a pellet gun is louder.

Mountainman38
October 8, 2010, 03:51 AM
I've shot dozens of rounds of the Super Colibri's through my 10/22 with no trouble. I like how quiet they are, and that they'll still hole a water jug or can.

The down side is that the accuracy of the Super C is very poor.

bhk
October 8, 2010, 09:26 AM
Depends how quiet you want to go and how effective you want the round to be. Subsonic long rifle hollow points (Remington, Winchester, Lapua, Ely, etc.) are often extremely accurate, quiet, and expand well on game. The lower powered rounds (CBs, Colibris, etc.) are quieter, but lack quite a bit when it comes to accuracy and killing effectiveness.

keyboard commando
October 8, 2010, 09:35 AM
CB longs in a 24" barrel are quieter than my pellet gun by far.

makorunner013
October 8, 2010, 09:46 AM
.CCI CB's make no sound at all. The only noise you hear is the sound of the Bolt clicking the load into the pipe. Box of 50 here in Florida are around $8.00 Also The Remington "SUBSONIC" round is just as quite for around $6.00 for a box of 50. BUT REMEMBER These rounds are .22 SHORT'S and will make noise in any .22 handgun {Revolver or Auto}. There is a way to load them into .22LR LONG gun but it has to be loaded one by one and by hand. DO NOT put shorts in the magazine it will jam.

If you enjoyed reading about ".22 cal, low noise loads" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!