s&W pistols


March 1, 2008, 03:00 PM
i was at the gun store picking up some 10mm ammo
and i also picked up the 2008 smith&wesson catalog
one thing i noticed is the absence of their pistols
not sure the name of them but the steel ones you probably think of when you think smith and wesson pistol
the only ones in the catalog are the sigmas the m&p models and the 1911 style
did they drop that entire line?

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March 1, 2008, 03:42 PM
Yep. They are officially out of the non-1911 metal-frame pistol business.

March 1, 2008, 05:04 PM
That. Reeks.


March 1, 2008, 09:44 PM
seperate catalog for pistol and revolver

The Lone Haranguer
March 1, 2008, 10:12 PM
Almost none of their old-style autos are left. :(

The one bright side is that there are lots of used ones around, and don't command collector prices. I picked up a 6946 (Third Generation, compact double-stack 12-round 9mm, stainless slide/aluminum frame, DAO action) with night sights for $330 out the door. (Unfortunately with no magazines, which accounts for some of the price reduction). Even with a recoil spring compressed and bent to two thirds of its original length (this has now been replaced; it cost a buck and a half) it functioned perfectly - something I expect from these "third-gen" pistols. I also have a 3913 LadySmith - a light, slim and very accurate pistol - and once owned a 5904.

March 2, 2008, 02:05 AM
Is S&W the first company to discontinue steel framed non 1911's?

Alan Fud
March 2, 2008, 01:14 PM
Appears that way. If you want a steel / alloy auto-loader that is not a 1911, don't bother with S&W. Amazing how things have changed in a decade. Ten year ago S&W was my favorite handgun company offering the 3913, 5906, 4013, 4006, 4513, etc. Today, they don't have any auto-loaders that I'm interested in.

March 2, 2008, 02:04 PM
You might occasionally see a few new S&W third generation or TSW guns out there. They'll produce limited runs for LE contracts. Possibly for distributors, but I don't think any distributors would request enough to make the production run possible. The key is production overruns. They accidentally make more than the agency wants, we benefit. I recently saw a dealer with 2 of the new 4006TSWs that S&W is making for the CHP. Probably T&Es for that contract, but they finally got the rail correct (machined as part of the frame rather than riveted afterward). A pity they only started doing it right after regular production ceased.

March 2, 2008, 03:28 PM
I've never understood the fascination, seemingly unending, with the 1911 auto design. First, it's old, and though it's a time-honored design, it's hardly flawless. You just can't expect the same reliability out of a 1911 that you can out of a Beretta or a Glock. Second, it's unreasonably expensive. I constantly hear complaints that even Kimbers often need work to achieve exacting reliability.

I wouldn't go so far as to say that the best type of pistol is a revolver, but I will say that I would have pit the reliability of an out-of-the-box 5906 or 659 against an out-of-the-box 1911 of just about any make, especially Colt! And I'd pit the reliability of an out-of-the-box Beretta or Glock against an out-of-the-box 5906 or 659 any day.

The 1911 was an absolutely fantastic design in...well...1911, and I would have put an out-of-the-box Colt 1911 up against an out-of-the-box German Luger for reliability any day.

Times change, but to pay $1,200+ for a 1911 auto that most likely will need work is a bit like paying $450+ for a plain-looking pocketknife (any Sebbenza owners here?).

Anyway, I hate seeing S&W getting rid of its innovative line of steel-framed autos to crank up production of yesterday's best.

March 4, 2008, 07:08 AM
Visiting S&W's website, it's true there are no more steel frame, non-1911 autos. I suppose polymer is thought to be adequate for modern pistols in that it provides toughness and light weight. I'm still convinced the polymer ones won't last as long as the stainless steel framed models, but with the price tags being substantially lower, who can afford steel frames these days?

The GOOD news is that you can still get really great deals on 5906s (almost nothing) and 659s. And the 645s, while based on the 1911 design, seemed to be flawlessly reliable out of the box, something many 1911s aren't known for.

There was a time when S&W really made horrible automatics. The 39s and 59s were pathetic, then, just when their reputation was gone, ruined, S&W fixed the problem somehow and by then it was too late. The next generation, the 459s and 559s (I had a 559 and sold it, can you believe it? It's probably a collector's item now.) were considered a bit boxy but totally functional. The big grips were thought to adversely affect accuracy.


A 1979 magazine, a private venture, touted
the Raven .25ACP as being "better" than a S&W 59
automatic. Why? Because, the writers said, the
diminutive Raven worked!

March 4, 2008, 08:59 AM
kinna crazy so are they gonna prove their guns are tough by chambering for the 10 mm again? i dont think the m&p will hold up to that round

March 4, 2008, 06:31 PM
I stopped wanting 3rg gen S&W pistols after they started putting rails on them and that dumb tactical marking. Also they always seemed to be kind of expensive for new ones and heavy. I have a 1006 though and I had a friend that loved them, he got the 4506,5906 and the 4006.

I miss the gun of the week era and I wish I had that wheel I heard they put out to help decipher the models!

Ala Dan
March 4, 2008, 06:40 PM
I've got an old one that I'm mighty proud of:

a S&W Model 39-2 9m/m~! :D ;)

March 4, 2008, 06:51 PM
I really want a 639 for some reason. Anyone like the 2nd gen ones?

March 6, 2008, 08:56 PM
I've got a Model 39 also...it is a good gun. I haven't seen a lot of those floating around.

March 6, 2008, 10:54 PM
I've never understood the fascination, seemingly unending, with the 1911 auto design.and probably never will. ;)

Smith made some very reliable all steel auto's. It is a shame they have given up on them entirely.

March 6, 2008, 11:14 PM
seperate catalog for pistol and revolver

Not for the print catalogs. The downloaded ones are different, but the print catalog has everything in one.

S&W makes what sells. Police departments are going to polymer. Citizens buy poly pistols or 1911s. If they'd been selling those autos well and profitably, I guarantee you they'd still be in production. Steel semiautos are going to become a thing of the past, with the exception of the very popular designs, like the 1911, Sig, CZ, and maybe a precious few others. Everybody else is switching to polymer for one reason: it sells.

conrad carter
March 6, 2008, 11:18 PM
they screwed their own pooch... and they'd sell more guns if they got rid of the internal locks.

Alan Fud
March 8, 2008, 11:42 AM
Yeah, the rails were a big turn off ESPECIALLY on their compact models.

Of course, all of the M&P's also have rails and even some of their 1911's have rails.

It appears that polymer and rails are the wave of the future -- glad I purchased the guns that I did when I did because very few of the new offerings appear to me right now.

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