Questions on the DPMS LR-308B


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tkcomer
March 13, 2008, 12:51 PM
Does anybody have one of these? I'm thinking of getting one with the A-3 upper as I'm a lefty. Not sure if I'd use their upgraded trigger or install one myself. One reason I'm thinking of DPMS is, if I get one, and it works out OK, I may get a 243 upper for it. How do these things do with mil surp ammo? I have a bunch of '79 Indian ammo from years back. Will it cycle OK through this gun? I will reload for the gun as I'm set up for that and that's all it will have after the Indian rounds are gone. Main use will be fun gun and paper punching. Occasional critter if I have it out and see one. Is the accuracy OK with good ammo? Any inputs will be appreciated.

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Magnuumpwr
March 13, 2008, 01:58 PM
I don't have an LR-308B, but I do have a recently purchased LR-308 Classic with an A-3 upper and 20" heavy barrel. The only differences I see between the 2 other than the barrel lengths is that my upper has the forward assist, shell deflector, dust cover, and an A-2 front sight. My rifle has functioned flawlessly using 1975 OFV Indian ammo and shot groups leave little to be desired, for my needs. I hope some of this can help answer your questions. Sorry about the error on my part, with the A-3 upper. My rifle slings the brass back to about the 5 o clock position with the deflector and I haven't noticed any dings in the brass from it either.

tkcomer
March 13, 2008, 02:30 PM
I'm not expecting great groups with the Indian ammo, just thought I'd use it to break the gun in and for trigger practice. Glad to hear it works. I've read where other brands don't do so hot with mil surp and I have about 1K laying around. I want the flat top for scope use.

Magnuumpwr
March 13, 2008, 02:43 PM
Here is a pic of my rifle.
http://i249.photobucket.com/albums/gg205/magnuumpwr/LR-308A3upper20inchbarrel001-1.jpg

Bazooka Joe71
March 13, 2008, 02:44 PM
I have a LR308B and have used surp with success so far...I will tell you though that using Indian voids the warranty, so beware.

Magnuumpwr
March 13, 2008, 02:54 PM
Joe, no where in the literature that came with my gun does it state that Indian ammo will void your warranty. It states reloaded, israeli, korean, chilean, pmp, south african, laquer coated ammo. Doesn't say you can't use poly coated steel cases either.

Geno
March 13, 2008, 03:07 PM
If you want extreme accuracy, get the steel upper receiver. :) That is what I have in a DPMS AP4 variant, in 7.62X51. At 50 yards off the bench, it prints tight little clovers. One of these days I plan to mount the 36X and take it to the 100 yards bench. :D

I still have the original "thick wall" aluminum upper receiver and plan to have that barreled with a .260 Rem if I keep the rifle.

I have been thinking of selling it, and the 1,200 rounds of .308, to buy a very high quality, all original M1 Garand.

According to the folks at DPMS, the barrel weight is not the critical factor in their rifles' accuracy. They assert that adhering to the 200 rounds break-in process is the critical factor. The process is to fire 1 round, disassemble, clean, reassemble and fire 1 round...repeat 200 times. :)

Thus far, I have 20 rounds fired through mine. The process is slow, but my groups are coming out extraordinarily tight. By the way, it can be configured as the "A3" style with the carry-handle. They cost $139.00. The front sights range from $59.00 to $159.00 depending on style.

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e364/Doc2005/IMGP0896.jpg

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e364/Doc2005/IMGP0897.jpg

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e364/Doc2005/DPMS1.jpg

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e364/Doc2005/DMPS2.jpg

tkcomer
March 13, 2008, 03:50 PM
Nice rifles! Why would mil surp void a warranty? Any warranty? I know why reloads do and can understand why coated rounds would. Just never figured out why the mil surp rounds would. Doc2005, glad to see you could mount a scope without the use of another part to move the scope forward. I had to do that on my AR-15. Does it use a standard Picatinny scope mount? The reason I ask is that I have a 3-Bucc brass catcher on my AR-15. Works great. Thought I might try it on the DPMS if I get it. That barrel break-in seems a pain though. Is that what DPMS recommends?

Geno
March 13, 2008, 04:00 PM
The rail is standard Mil Spec Picatinny. These are standard Leupold rings. In fact, it is the very same scope and rings that I use on my Weatherby Mark V. :)

The break-in is recommended for maximum accuracy. It isn't required. I doubt most people go though this extent of breaking in the barrel.

Bazooka Joe71
March 13, 2008, 04:38 PM
Joe, no where in the literature that came with my gun does it state that Indian ammo will void your warranty. It states reloaded, israeli, korean, chilean, pmp, south african, laquer coated ammo. Doesn't say you can't use poly coated steel cases either.


Yep, my mistake! I guess I was thinking of Israeli when I saw Indian.:rolleyes:

And all this time I thought I didn't make mistakes.:confused:

:p

Now looking at it again, that sucks that Port voids the warranty.:(



BTW, not to hijack the thread, but how would they ever know if you used a certain kind of ammo anyway? I can see maybe them checking around for laquer residue, but brass???

Titan6
March 13, 2008, 04:50 PM
I doubt most people go though this extent of breaking in the barrel.

I did. About half way through I almost quit with all the strange looks I was getting shotgunning and rodding my weapon every few rounds but I did it anyway. Don't know if it helped any but can't say I am disappointed with the way it shoots either.

tkcomer
March 13, 2008, 05:09 PM
OK, another question. What kind of triggers are you running in these guns? Standard, upgrade or aftermarket? I use a Chip McCormick in one AR-15 and a RRA in another. I actually like the RRA better. The fact that I want an A-3 style upper with no other mods other than the trigger means I'll probably have to order this gun. I'm a plain Jane kinda guy other than I like free float tubes. One problem is where to get the gun if I go this route. There are no DPMS dealers around me. They seem to like Armalite.

Bazooka Joe71
March 13, 2008, 05:13 PM
I found a steal on a NIB 2.5-3lb timney drop in and it rocks...But if I had to pay full price for it, I probably would have spent the extra $$$ and got a Jewell.

The 308B comes with a free float tube and not much else anyway.

Talk to fellow THR'r aloharover. I ordered mine from him...Great price and even better communication throughout the process.

Geno
March 13, 2008, 05:18 PM
tkcomer:

Mine is a free-floated barrel. I have the stock trigger. On this rifle, as with all of my firearms, I use light oil and "Moly" on the trigger. It is what Bushmaster recommends. It helps the trigger break very nicely. Re: where to buy one, have it ordered. Or find one here on-line. I have seen several sell here.

Doc2005

kcmarine
March 13, 2008, 05:27 PM
Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the Indian surplus 7.62 NATO incredibly poor ammo if you get the stuff from a certain time period?

tkcomer
March 13, 2008, 05:30 PM
Once again, another question. Is the DPMS ammo sensitive? I load 40.6grs of Ramshots Tac behind the 168 Sierra Matchking for my Remington 700 stainless varmint special. Very accurate load but it is on the light side. The sniper dude on the local police force is amazed at this load at 100 yards. Does the DPMS need a "stout" load to cycle? Sorry for all these questions but I'd like to know what to expect from the gun. And yes, the Indian ammo doesn't group worth a crap.

Geno
March 13, 2008, 05:35 PM
I haven't had any issues with mine. Zero failures. But remember, I am still at 20 rounds. :) For all intents, it's still new. The ammo I have been using is "American Eagle, 150 Gr. FMJ Boat-tail".

I also have Winchester FMJs, Remington FMJs, etc. Finally, I have about 600 rounds of Chilean, but haven't fired any yet. :) Yet. I asked DPMS about handloads and they told me I could. They said their concern is people reloading who don't know how and destroying it.

Magnuumpwr
March 13, 2008, 07:13 PM
Doc, when it comes down to it, verbal authorization doesn't leave you a leg to stand on if something happens. I would be more apt to follow the written recommendations.
TKC, DPMS operators manual states: To achieve the best results for acuuracy you should clean the chamber and bore after every round for the first 25 rounds and then every 10 rounds up to 100 rounds. It usually takes about 200 rounds per barrel for optimum accuracy. Please keep in mind that our barrels are production barrels and not custom barrels. Accuracy is dependent upon many factors such as bullet weight, powder load, rifling twist, rifling lands, operator technique, etc. Our production barrels have achieved anywhere from 1/8" to 1 1/2" M.O.A. Obviously, we would hope that every production barrel would shoot 1/8" M.O.A., but with all the above factors, we cannot guarantee a specific group size.

tkcomer
March 13, 2008, 07:45 PM
I'm not going to argue barrel break-in. 1/8 MOA? I can't shoot that good. I spent today trying to get a Winchester 94 to print under 3" at 50 yards with my low power loads. I did break in my AR-15 with a Model 1 Sales 16" varmint upper with a similar procedure. It will shoot consistent 1" groups at 100 yards. That's with Sierra Matchkings. With bulk FMJ, it's more like 3". Thanks for all these answers. Now I need to find a dealer who can order this gun. Or at least to see what it will cost.

ramey84
March 13, 2008, 08:36 PM
i shot just over an inch@100 yards with winchester whitebox ammo out of my 308b last weekend

Geno
March 13, 2008, 09:09 PM
Yeah, it shoots well. One of the best-ever rifles I have had was my Remington M700V chambered in 6mm Remington. The 95 Gr handloads consistently grouped 3/8" at 300 yards. That was a shooter. That, of course, was back when I practiced several times per week. The folks at DPMS told me that many people report consistent .5" groups at 100 yards with their DPMS rifles.

I paid around $1,100ish for this DPMS. When I sent it back to DPMS because the upper receiver was too tight, they upgraded the receiver to steel for $125.00, and corrected the over-tight aluminum one. The steel upper usually cost $300.00. The 19-round magazines cost $44.00 each, but I paid $33.00ish each.

Any FFL can order one.

Titan6
March 14, 2008, 04:48 AM
What kind of triggers are you running in these guns?

I kept the clunky factory trigger. Only because it shoots just like my carry M4.

The folks at DPMS told me that many people report consistent .5" groups at 100 yards with their DPMS rifles.

With the right ammo at a rest, nearly all groups are touching. Off hand no bigger than 4" till I get tired. Can't complain about the accuaracy and I am not that good of a shot either.

Urbana John
March 14, 2008, 05:53 AM
I've got the DPMS AP4 and it shoots my reloads without any problems, but I'm still "breaking it in". I put a McCormick trigger in it,but haven't shot it yet and I've got a muzzle brake to put on it too.
I was talking to a Columbus police officer about his, but his is a different model, anyway he was "out shooting" Columbus SWAT officers with his!!! He said he changed the "buffer" and with the muzzle brake, his "felt recoil" was like a 22LR!!!
So now, I'm trying to contact him again to find out what "buffer" he's got!!
UJ

Titan6
March 14, 2008, 09:37 AM
Putting in a heavier buffer might reduce recoil it will also certainly lower your cyclic rate of fire. You might not want that.

Magnuumpwr
March 14, 2008, 10:12 AM
Sounds like a hydraulic piston buffer. Just a guess on my part.

tkcomer
March 14, 2008, 10:26 AM
Wouldn't the heavier buffer make the rifle more prone to short stroking with lighter loads?

Organdonor
March 14, 2008, 10:48 AM
I'm picking up a .308 AR in the next few weeks. I had my heart set on a DPMS LR-308L, with the hollow stock and custom muzzle with the break. But trying to find on in stock is impossible, and I was told it's a 4 month wait (or longer!) from DPMS.

So, I switched gears slightly and now am looking at picking up an Armalite AR-10 in AWB configuration. Non free floating 20" barrel, with comp, standard A2 furniture, A3-style upper. It's about $150 more, but I think it will easier to get, and have a lifetime warranty.

Any thoughts on this?

Geno
March 14, 2008, 11:21 AM
In all due respect, I would not touch an Armalite in .308. I checked them out before buying my own DPMS AP4. I handled both rifles side-by-side. After handling the DPMS, the Armalite felt like a sloppy toy.

Magnuumpwr
March 14, 2008, 07:02 PM
Organdonor, if you go back to the first page you will see my rifle. $974 less the bipod and pistol grip. Came with 2) 19 rd mags, cleaning kit, hard case, and a sling, all brand new. Look for an LR-308C, that is the model of my rifle.

Geno
March 20, 2008, 02:48 PM
Quite frankly stated, when the DPMS representative told me that they had several customers who were achieving single-hole groups at 100 yards, I was less than trusting. I finally stopped my break-in process for my own DPMS AP4 at 50 rounds of fire 1 shot, and break down to clean. After the 50th round and clean, I tried my hand at the best group I could.

As I see precision-shooting, it holds but one single problem: sustained and repeatable capability. With my varmint and target bolt-action rifles, that has seldom been problematic. But I never in my life would have expected an autoloading rifle to present such tremendous accuracy. My Remington M700V in 6mm Rem would consistently pattern 3/8" at 300 yards with an 18X scope. But this, this is just shocking to me.

The following 3-shot group was fired at 100 yards, with the advent of a benchrest, a Harris bi-pod, a sling and sandbag under the buttstock and zero wind. The scope was a Leupold Vari-X III, 4.5-14X40 AO. The 3-shot cluster measured .25 MOA (1/4") center-to-center:

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e364/Doc2005/IMGP0898.jpg

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e364/Doc2005/IMGP0909.jpg

tkcomer
March 20, 2008, 05:52 PM
Wow, that's amazing. I can't shoot that good. One reason for a semi 308 is I have bursitis in my shoulder. The 700 can really set me back for a few days if I'm not careful. I had a HK 91. It didn't kick as hard as the Remmy and I "hear" the AR style 308s kick even less. Accuracy is my main concern, but I don't want a 24" barrel. Too unwieldy. It's great to see these guns can group. I actually called about the gun, but the guy was out of his office. Wow, that breaking in procedure is even more intense than my AR-15. Not sure if I"ll be that disciplined.

velocette
March 20, 2008, 06:38 PM
I have a DPMS LR 308B and have found it to be extemely accurate, reliable and easy to shoot. From a concrete bench on a Harris bipod with my shoulder at the rear, (no sandbags etc) I get consistent 3/4" 10 shot groups with my reloads and usually much better with 3 shot groups. I found the the best factory ammo was Federal power shok 150 grain psp. blue box cheap stuff $13.00 at walmart. It shoots just under 1" 5 shot groups. My reloads work better. Both with 168 gr Sierra MK, IMR 4895, 41 gr. & Federal brass. Reloder 15, 42 gr. with RP brass. both with Federal match primers. I also tried Sierra 155 Palma bullets and got 7/16" 10 round groups but with some fliers out to 1 1/2" (could be me of course) I never had any problems with function with reduced loads when working up to my best accuracy loads either.
The LR 308 is a great rifle, I get a lot of enjoyment from easily outshooting a whole bunch of bolt rifle owners that think an autoloader is inaccurate.

DoubleTapDrew
March 20, 2008, 07:19 PM
Does the DPMS need a "stout" load to cycle? Sorry for all these questions but I'd like to know what to expect from the gun. And yes, the Indian ammo doesn't group worth a crap.
I am considering a LR308B as well and was wondering about ammo, like if the lithuanian 146gr mil-surp was ok to shoot. I emailed DPMS and they replied with this: "The rifles function well with American factory ammo and only really functions with 165-180 gr ammo."
Have any of you owners had problems with the lighter stuff?

Geno
March 20, 2008, 10:25 PM
These were 150 grain American Eagle. At my request, DPMS made the chamber extra-tight. When I chamber a round, then extract it unfired, their are very observable markings the full length of the round. The chamber is so tight, I have to allow the bolt to slam forward to chamber. To boot, there is no forward-assist on the receiver.

ToadPS
October 14, 2008, 09:02 PM
DPMS has a page explaining their "Ammunition Warnings" on the website.

Here's their beef with SA ammo:

PMP
South African produced surplus
We have used this ammunition in the past for testing purposes and found the brass is extremely soft and can "flow" into microscopic pores and grooves in the chamber creating "sticky" extraction. This has been reported in many types of rifles, but is more prevalent in semi-automatic weapons.



They have commentary or Israeli, Korean, Porto, Chilean and the Russian steel/laquer stuff too.

If interested: http://www.dpmsinc.com/support/warning.aspx

I was about to buy some SA PMP but I guess I'll go GGG now. Haven't heard of any problems with that in my studies so far.

Emfuser
October 15, 2008, 12:10 PM
I see that some DPMS AR-10s are listed as .308 chamber and some are 7.62x51. Is there the same relative danger in cross chambering present putting 7.62x51 into a .308 AR-10 as when you put 5.56 NATO into an AR-15 chambered for .223?

TWAJeff
October 29, 2008, 04:52 PM
Been doing some digging around on THR looking for opinions on this rifle and found this topic. The LR-308 is most likely my next purchase.

Doc2005, is there any way you can repost the pics of your groups? Looks like the photobucket links are dead. Thanks!

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