Mosin Naggant


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ChrisAHF
March 15, 2008, 08:50 PM
Ive been thinknig about this is the back of my head and thought I would bounce it here. I was thinking of buying a mosin nagant and putting a synthetic stock on it.

(http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/MGR341-45476-985.html)

Then buying this optic mount. It replaces the straight bolt to a slanted bolt so the optic can sit much father back.

http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/MGR342-45477-1930.html

My freind has a good bushnell that hes just wants to get rid of. So for $200 I could have a very effective long range rifle. I know some will say keep it original but if your only reason to not do this is it will lose its value, I could just buy another one for $90 if I just wanted to put it on the wall.


Any suggestions or Info would be great.

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Vicious-Peanut
March 15, 2008, 08:52 PM
Do whatever you want, but be aware that they are not all that accurate. 3-4 moa is the norm, so for a 'very effective long range rifle' I would look elsewhere. For a ton of fun and relatively cheap shooting I love my Mosin.

MiddleAgedKen
March 15, 2008, 09:33 PM
ChrisAHF, Vicious-Peanut has a good point, but on the other hand Hero Sniper Zaitsev ;) used an M91/30, so there are good ones to be had. If you want to do as you have described, find the most pristine bore and crown you can lay your hands on.

35 Whelen
March 15, 2008, 09:59 PM
Chris:
Go ahead and get a Mosin. If you get it from jgsales.com, they're only $59.95 and for $10 more you can get a one handpicked for a shiny, strong bore. I have two Mosins that both have shiny bores and good rifling and they shoot wonderfully especially with cast bullets!
http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h6/308Scout/MNGroups.jpg

Those are all 100 yd. groups with open sights. The group on the orange target was even fired with milsurp ammo.
I'd strongly suggest you bed it into the stock.
Good luck,
35W

Mr White
March 15, 2008, 10:08 PM
CHRIS, STEP AWAY FROM THE PLASTIC STOCK!!! DO NOT DESECRATE THE C&R RIFLE!!! REPEAT, DO NOT DESECRATE THE C&R RIFLE!!!

j/k. Its your rifle and yours to do with what you want.

To help accuracy, you'll probably want to bed the receiver and float the barrel. You might have to take a Dremel to the stock to remove plastic where it touches the barrel.

fireflyfather
March 15, 2008, 11:51 PM
As long as he keeps the original stock, what's the harm?

Can always put the old stock back on. A bent bolt is another matter entirely. You can buy a bent bolt handle and swap it out, so you can replace it with the original if you want.

35 Whelen
March 16, 2008, 01:16 AM
There were something like 17 MILLION Mosins produced...that's why they're only $60. So, have fun with it.
35W

Lon371
March 16, 2008, 10:18 AM
I love the Mosins. I have two M44s. 1 I refinished, 1 I just picked up for $20.00. The second has a plastic stock open sites and straight bolt. Had a fuzzy barrel, which is now shiny. Will fire for the first time today.
The first one was a cosmo baby. Spent a month cleaning and refinshing. Had a scope mount installed, bent bolt handle.
Honestly, everyone should have one. They have a lot of cool factor at the range. Between the loud boom and the fireball, everyone has to look:D

savetheclaypigeons
March 16, 2008, 10:41 AM
I suggest saving money by not getting the syn. stock and free floating the barrel. You can also adjust the trigger pull
http://www.surplusrifleforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=856&hilit=adjust+trigger+nagant

ChrisAHF
March 16, 2008, 02:04 PM
Sorry, I really dont know anything about gunsmithing. So could I get the synthetic stock, bed the reciever, and free float the barrell? How much would it cost at a gunsmith to bed the reciever and free float the barrell? Thanks.

Also one more thing. Is there a difference between the m-44 and the m 91/30?

Mr White
March 16, 2008, 02:17 PM
I don't know what a smith sould charge for bedding and floating. I do all my own work.

a 91/30 has a much longer barrel and a detatchable bayonet. An M44 has a much shorter barrel, the bayonet is attached to the gun and folds out and locks into fixed position.

jpwilly
March 16, 2008, 02:43 PM
The bent bolt will cost as much as the rifle! Mosins are only cheap if you leave them alone! Add a synthetic stock too and you could have bought a much more accurate Mossberg ATR or Stevens bolt gun!

Otherwise if that's what you have to have...have fun. It's your rifle!

Vaarok
March 16, 2008, 02:59 PM
The ATI stock and scope systems are affectionately known collectively as the "rape your rifle kit".

They work, but they are lowest-bidder cheap and chintzy, and a bad rifle won't shoot well and a good rifle won't shoot better.

You're far better off getting a scout mount and pistol scope or just using it as-is.

And if you modify a Finnish Mosin, Siimo Haaya's ghost will snipe you from the grave.

Mike 56
March 16, 2008, 04:00 PM
Here is my raped 91/30 and target. This is how i bedded it http://collectorguns35625.yuku.com/

Mike

http:// Targets 004.jpg (53.7 KB)

35 Whelen
March 16, 2008, 04:20 PM
Sorry, I really dont know anything about gunsmithing. So could I get the synthetic stock, bed the reciever, and free float the barrell? How much would it cost at a gunsmith to bed the reciever and free float the barrell? Thanks.

Bedding and floating is very light gunsmithing. Easy stuff with only basic handtools required. If you want to do something simple, just bed it in the wood stock and don't float the barrel. Most thin profile barrels like the Mosin shoot better supported. If it doesn't shoot well supported, then float it.
Pay a visit to www.surplusrifle.com There's a plethora of info on MilSurps including tons of info and how-to's for the Mosin.
35W

VirgilCaine
March 16, 2008, 04:28 PM
Mike 56: Nice looking rifle you have there.

pinstripe
March 17, 2008, 12:00 AM
I have a few mosin nagants. They all shot good. I have a 91/30 that the barrel looks like a sewer pipe, but I can still get 2" groups at 100 yds. with it. Good cheap shooting.:D

rangerruck
March 17, 2008, 12:42 AM
I am going to be selfish here; do it, and tell us about it, I've allways though that mosin were more accurate than most people gave credit for, but really needed to freefloat the bbl, and now you can get that stock, and it would be much easier to sandpaper out a few sticking points with that stock, than an origional stock. Plus it has to make it a lot lighter, and the pistol grip part of it has to be much more comfortable. And you can tell us about the comfort , and weigh the two parts as well.

vzenmn
March 17, 2008, 01:00 AM
I free floated my 91/30 stock and now will only shoot good with the bayonet attached. It won't keep 5 rounds on a 8 1/2 x 11 printer paper with the bayo off but with it attached it'll still do 2 - 4 moa. Sense then I have pledged never to p#@% off the Mosin gods ever again.

The snobby hunters at my range think I'm a nut when they see me with that 18" pig sticker on a 5 foot rifle.

Dr. Peter Venkman
March 17, 2008, 01:05 AM
It won't be anymore 'effective' after you switch out the original parts for plastic poo-poo. You are not going to get any better accuracy between switching out stocks, et cetera. The barrel is all that matters.

You won't be anywhere near approaching the accuracy the Mosin is capable of either due to a) bore condition or b) correct bullet diameter. You would have to reload for b), but if you did you wouldn't waste your time on doing it for a typical $90 Mosin unless you already knew what it was capable of. You won't be getting solid results either using old surplus ammunition. I've got Albanian, Hungarian, and Bulgarian, and it's ALL over the place. The only consistent ammo type I have is Czech Silvertip, but good luck finding that.

Buy a K31 for $200, Buy a no-drill/clamp/screwupyourrifle St. Marie mount for $70, and add your buddie's scope to it. Now all you have to do is buy ammo ($.50 a pop for GP-11 surplus but it is 'match' quality) but you will get the 'sniper rifle' results you are looking for. For $270 you now have a Swiss Rifle made during WWII (or before/after) that still retains it's historic value, and can shoot quarters out at 100 yards.

Don't get me wrong, I love Mosins. I've got two Russian ones (91/30 and M44) and two Finnish ones (91/30 and M39). I wouldn't dare screw up the Finnish ones (which shoot great) because of their historic value, and besides, why make it something that it is not? It is the same for the Russian ones.

If you want a nice military surplus 'sniper', go ahead with the K31 plan I outlined above. If you want an 'effective long range rifle', save up to purchase a Remington 700.

Dynasty
March 17, 2008, 01:56 AM
Is there a noticable difference in terms of recoil between the Mosin 44 and 91/30?

Dr. Peter Venkman
March 17, 2008, 02:04 AM
Is there a noticable difference in terms of recoil between the Mosin 44 and 91/30?

The M44 is more like a punch, the 91/30 like a shove.

Jackal
March 17, 2008, 02:11 AM
It sounds like you would be better served by a $300 Stevens rifle in a modern caliber.

Dynasty
March 17, 2008, 02:17 AM
Dr. Peter Venkman- What ammo does the 91/30 seem to like the best?

Dr. Peter Venkman
March 17, 2008, 03:30 AM
Dr. Peter Venkman- What ammo does the 91/30 seem to like the best?

Each 91/30 will be different because of bore diameter and how worn out it is, but my most consistent surplus ammunition that has produced good groups in my Mosins and other shooters has been Czech Silvertip. With other ammunition (you can look around on other forums), ammunition quality from other arsenals seems to vary by the batch. Your mileage may vary.

The only downside to Czech Silvertip is that the lacquer on the casings will give you 'sticky bolt' if your chamber is not clean. The remedy for this is to give the bolt a hard slap!

GD
March 17, 2008, 01:39 PM
There is not much difference in the recoil of a M91/30 and a M44. Both are pretty stout. What is different is the muzzle blast from the M44. You will definitely feel the difference in the concussion.

Franco2shoot
March 17, 2008, 02:28 PM
I keep improving my 91/30 in small ways. Cleaner barrel, cork wrap up near the front band. However, the bullet you push down the barrel seems to be one of the key factors in accuracy. I don't load my own, but have run boxes of Norma (high price not great performance) Wolf, ( not bad ), Brown Bear (fair, not as good as Wolf), packs of FMJ surplus, ( really not much difference), a tin of Hungarian ( don't like this cuz the copper wash sometimes causes stiff ejection of spent) and the best shooting which was steel surplus. Unfortunately, I cannot find anymore of the steel variety but the bottom line is all of it was 1 MOA or 1.5 MOA once I got the barrel and screws all tightened up.

KKKKFL

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