Bersa vs. Taurus


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JaxNovice
March 17, 2008, 05:36 PM
Thinking of buying an inexpensive pistol to keep in my car. What brand you pick and why? This could be for their .380 or 9mm offerings. I am just trying to get a feel for the perceived quality levels.

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thunder173
March 17, 2008, 06:06 PM
I have several of the Bersa's,...actually the SGS Firestorm versions, but the same gun,.....22lr, a .380, and the .45 ACP MiniFireStorm, only complaint I have on any of them is that they come with just one mag, and the extra's are expensive. Dependability: the 45 has well over 1500 rds through it, never hiccuped once with either standard 230 grain ball, or federal hydra shoks......Bought the .22LR for my wife to do her ccw cert's with,...after about 500 rounds in a week,...she ran it through with no problems,..the .380 has only had about 300 rounds through it, but performs well with both ball and federal low recoil JHP's,.....no complaints on any of the three,...and they are fairly priced. Quaility of workmanship. None are jewels,...but I have seen uglier,... (I also have a keltec P3AT and a P-11),...all solid functional pieces of hardware that doesn't break the bank. They all do their part when I do mine.

TimboKhan
March 17, 2008, 06:11 PM
I said Taurus just because I have always had good luck with thier pistols. In general, I like the way they shoot and I like the way they look. Plenty of Taurus bashers will tell you horror stories about Taurus customer service, but I don't think it is always as bad as people make it out to be. I will happily admit that Taurus, at one point, might not have been the greatest company around. That was then, this is now. I think they make a quality product, at a good price, and I think that they listen to what their customers want, as you will never find a company that produces more new models than Taurus.

With that being said, there are legions of happy Bersa owners, so while I don't have first-hand experience with Bersa, I can say that it appears that they are a good little gun.

For .380, I have a Kel-Tec, that will likely be replaced by the new Ruger LCP in a couple of years. I like the caliber in a pocket gun, not as big a fan in a bigger platform. Personally, if I were to carry a larger .380, it would be the Beretta model 84, popularly known as the "Cheetah". My dad owns one, and for whatever reason, I can really shoot those pistols! Of course, the problem with the Cheetah as a carry arm is that it is relatively large and heavy, and for the same (or close to the same) size/weight, I could upgrade to a 9mm, a caliber that I have more faith in over the .380. There is something to be said for the fact that I can shoot the Cheetah well, but I know I can shoot a 9mm about as well, certainly well enough to defend myself with it.

Ultimately, for roughly the same size/weight, I opted for a revolver, specifically a Taurus 605 in .357. I definitely prefer the .357 as a "combat" round over the .380 or the 9mm, and I like the inherent reliability of the revolver. You open yourself up to the standard revolver v. auto arguments, but for me it has been a good choice.

By the way, I wasn't kidding when I said I like Taurus pistols. In addition to the mentioned revolver, I own a PT1911 and a PT99. I have owned one other PT99 that I sold because I didn't need two, and a 24/7 that I sold in order to buy one of my PT99's. I also owned a different 605 that was my buddies, then it was mine, then I sold it back to my buddy. In any event, I have been happy with every single one of them, and particularly happy with my PT1911, a gun that I very honestly believe is the best mass-produced 1911 on the market.

bensdad
March 17, 2008, 06:21 PM
I can't legitimately vote. My family has one of each, and both have been wonderful. I shoot a Taurus 745 milpro. My wife has the Bersa Thunder .380.

The Bersa looks and feels a little nicer. The Taurus has a much higher round-count and only hickupped on some of my early home loads. I don't hold that against it.

saturno_v
March 17, 2008, 06:34 PM
I recently bought a brand new Bersa Thunder 40 in .40 S&W and I'm extremely satisfied with it...Full Size but "feels" compact (in dimension and weight), paid only $320 + tax.
I went through more than 300 rounds so far (FMJ and JHP of different brands) not a single problem, very accurate and consistent...aestetically is the .40 pistol that I like the most with the Beretta 96.

Bersa owners are generally very satisfied (the little Bersa Thunder 380 sells like hotcakes) and I heard very good things about customer service if you ever need it.

I agree with Thunder 173 that coat finishing (in the blued models) is not totally top notch but construction is very solid, tight tolerances, very good crisp trigger, no sharp edges.
The only real downside is costly extra magazines, however the mags are extremely well built with stainless steel follower rather than plastic.

I like Taurus too and I was considering buying their PT-101, a clone of the Beretta 96.

Taurus became more popular in recent years, they have a wider product range compared to Bersa and invests more on advertisement and trade shows, this somewhat make their guns a bit more expensive.

Bersa as company has been around since the early 20th century (they assumed the name Bersa in the last 45+ years).
They spend literally NOTHING on advertising and have a somewhat limited production (the gun shop that sold me my Thunder 40 told me that the distributor run into shortages very often)...they base their design on the Walther models: PPK for the Thunder 380, P-88 for the bigger Thunders, 9, 40 and 45.

I suspect Bersa prices for all models will go up very soon, their 2008 list prices for the Ultra Compact models are already significantly increased....buy a specimen already in store or you will miss the train....

modifiedbrowning
March 17, 2008, 09:10 PM
I have no experience with Taurus, but I own three Bersa 9mms (well two Bersas and one Firestorm made by Bersa). All three have been 100% with over 1K through each. I shot 1K through my Fullsize Thunder 9 with no cleaning whatsoever and had nary a hiccup. That Pistol has probably 3K through it now and still runs great.
All my Bersas have nice triggers from the box and only get better with use. I would say they have the best triggers of my DA/SA pistols at this point.
I carry my Firestorm Mini 9 daily, that tells you how much confidence I have in it.
Buy the Bersa.
also checkout www.bersatalk.com for more info.

Dionysusigma
March 17, 2008, 09:14 PM
Didn't vote either. :o

Both are great. :)

wally
March 17, 2008, 09:15 PM
A lot more options with Taurus. All the Bersa I've looked at were DA/SA operation which I dislike enough to not buy for this reason alone.

--wally.

gmflash88
March 17, 2008, 09:22 PM
+1 for the Bersa.

Full disclosure... don't own a Taurus auto but some family members do and they like them. My wife's primary gun (when she's not stealing my Ruger GP100 at the range :) ) is the Thunder 380. Mags are tough to come by and expensive but I bought one yesterday (used but who cares) at a gun show for $23. I like the gun quite a bit and used it myself for my CCW shooting test. Put 39 of 40 rounds in center mass and the one that wasn't was 1/4" out. This was at 15 (15 rnds), 25 (15 rnds), and 40ft (10rnds). I was shooting a little faster then I normally do and more pointing then aiming. This was her first auto (revolver gal... I knew I married a keeper) and she likes it quite a bit.

thunder173
March 17, 2008, 09:31 PM
Back again,...agree with Timbokahn on the Beretta 84 in .380,...carried one for several years as a back up and cc, as well as a Walther PPK for about 15 yeays prior to the Beretta,....both really good guns,...but they never did anything any better than the Bersa's, just looked prettier. Right now,..the Bersa .380 is riding in my old PPK holster....this is my wife's discreet and open carry piece,....the .22 is identical in size and operation, and is her plinker. Along with these and the KelTec's, I also have a S&W 36 Chief 3 inch in .38 Special that still see's regular service, and a Taurus 627 4" Tracker .357 in stainless,...and a few more. I carry everything I have at one time or another. Each has a purpose,...and they all function well for those purposes, and more. I guess what I am saying here is this,....Don't get hung up on brand. Some are better,...some are more expensive is all. I have had great cheap guns,...and bad expensive ones. Get one that fits you,...meets the need you have in mind for it,...in a caliber you can handle,...that hits where you point it. If it works,...and it's reliable,....use it. if not,...lose it and try another. Do some looking, and hopefully some experimenting with different types and styles. Good luck in your travels doing so. The neat thing about an adventure isn't the destination,...it's the journey,.....

hexidismal
March 17, 2008, 09:37 PM
I think I comparison between specific guns would be far more appropriate. A simple "vs" competition between opinions of gun companies is never going to give you any real relevant info. People's personal brand loyalties often have little to do with factual information. Between two guns one can use facts and figures.

Wilson2
March 18, 2008, 03:45 PM
I have a Bersa .380 that I bought back in the early 90s and love it. I consistently hear more favorable comments on the Bersa pistols. Taurus certainly gets good marks, however, it seems there are a few more problems with them. My opinion is based more on observation of feedback concerning the Taurus.

ZeSpectre
March 18, 2008, 03:58 PM
Owned several Taurus, had troubles with all but two. God I -wanted- to like them all but just too much trouble so I finally sold or got rid of everything.

Picked up a Bersa Thunder 380 (concealed carry model) that has been absolutely reliable so far and have b handled/fired a Thunder 40 that I enjoyed quite a bit (though it'll never challenge my SIG229 for taming the .40 "snap"). The owner of the Thunder 40 was also very happy with his firearm.

kyarcher
March 18, 2008, 04:06 PM
The Bersa is the most under rated pistol out there.
I have four of them. Actually five but its been backordered forever.

saturno_v
March 18, 2008, 04:14 PM
Picked up a Bersa Thunder 380 (concealed carry model) that has been absolutely reliable so far and have b handled/fired a Thunder 40 that I enjoyed quite a bit (though it'll never challenge my SIG229 for taming the .40 "snap"). The owner of the Thunder 40 was also very happy with his firearm.

The recoil of my Bersa Thunder 40 is very mild (my own impression)
Tonight I should try a Sig P-226 in .40 and I will compare the two.

MICHAEL T
March 18, 2008, 08:11 PM
Bersa of course The 9mm 40 and 45 are suppose to come with 2 mags nowdays 380 still only get 1 mag
lifetime warrenty and on http:// bersatalk.com We have a warrenty smith ready to help if needed . Also freebee's given away several times a year. Over 2700 members and growing
A good relieable pistol at a fair price.

Ala Dan
March 18, 2008, 08:26 PM
I voted for the Bersa, as I feel its a better pistol for the money~!

weregunner
March 19, 2008, 12:56 AM
Didn't vote as both companies build very good pieces for defense.

Here's both sides of the coin so to speak. There are many people who own both Taurus and Bersa pistols or both.
http://www.taurusarmed.net/forums/index.php?topic=4356.0
http://www.taurusarmed.net/forums/index.php?topic=1673.0
http://www.taurusarmed.net/forums/index.php?topic=1521.0
http://www.taurusarmed.net/forums/index.php?topic=2418.0
http://www.taurusarmed.net/forums/index.php?topic=5402.0
http://www.taurusarmed.net/forums/index.php?topic=2622.0
http://www.taurusarmed.net/forums/index.php?topic=934.0
http://www.taurusarmed.net/forums/index.php?topic=5683.0
http://www.taurusarmed.net/forums/index.php?topic=5025.0
http://www.taurusarmed.net/forums/index.php?topic=5499.0
http://www.taurusarmed.net/forums/index.php?topic=681.0
http://www.taurusarmed.net/forums/index.php?topic=2152.0
http://www.taurusarmed.net/forums/index.php?topic=1814.0
http://www.taurusarmed.net/forums/index.php?topic=3244.0


www.corneredcat.com and www.womenandguns.com are also good sources of info. There's also Taurus Talk at MSN.

weregunner
March 19, 2008, 12:58 AM
Oh yes. Do own a PT111 Mil/pro and a PT22 that are giving sterling service.

No FTEs or FTFs.
Have a 24/7 OSS on the way at the end of March.

DAVIDSDIVAD
March 19, 2008, 02:19 AM
Out of the 3 times I've seen a bersa at the range they jammed two of the times.

XDKingslayer
March 19, 2008, 09:19 AM
I have both the Taurus Pt-138 in .380 and the Bersa in .380. I love the Bersa.

Putting all of my problems that I've had with the Taurus aside, the Taurus has 2 distinct advantages. First is capacity and second is the second strike capability.

On the 2nd strike capability, it's nice, but in the 100,000s of rounds that I've fired in my life time in just about every caliber you can think of, I've never needed it.

The capacity is nice, but it makes the Taurus much heavier than the Bersa.

Both are priced about the same, but I like the reliability of the Bersa. It's a great weapon. It's more accurate than the Taurus, it's easier to use than the Taurus. It's easier to field strip than the Taurus. My wife can manipulate the Bersa, she can rack the slide and activate the slide release, she can't do that on the Taurus. It's just way too tight. Even after a long break in period it's still too tight for her to manipulate.

I'd take the Bersa over the Taurus any day of the week.

David, if you're seeing Bersas jam at the range, it's more than likely caused by cheap mags. Bersas are probably just as magazine particular as 1911s. The cheap magazines are a problem waiting to happen.

And as far as customer service goes, Bersa is light years ahead of Taurus.

Hokkmike
March 19, 2008, 10:38 AM
Quality wise they are about the same but the Bersas are cheaper hence abetter value.

tinygnat219
March 19, 2008, 12:36 PM
Taurus guns are a crap shoot, mostly landing in the "crap" category. Don't waste your money on one of these. Get a Bersa instead.

ZeSpectre
March 19, 2008, 12:47 PM
David, if you're seeing Bersas jam at the range, it's more than likely caused by cheap mags.
+1 on that
or caused by folks trying to run the Thunder 380 mags in the Thunder 380 Concealed Carry model (or vice versa). the two do NOT interchange. They'll slide in but the gun won't run.

T380 - 7 (or 9 in the "deluxe") round mags.
T380CC - 8 round flat bottomed mags.

XDKingslayer
March 20, 2008, 02:04 PM
Quality wise they are about the same but the Bersas are cheaper hence abetter value.

I would put the Bersa way above the Taurus in quality. I've yet to see a Bersa come from the factory with the rear sight installed backwards, the front sight come loose and fall out on the first magazine, and the crown of the barrel cut improperly.

That's exactly what happened with my Taurus.

Old Dog
March 20, 2008, 02:46 PM
Ah, well, another opportunity for the legions of Taurus-bashers to come forth. I've been perfectly satisfied with every Taurus pistol and revolver that's ever come into my hands or into my family's hands. Yet the masses that claim "I've no experience with Taurus" still come out extolling the virtues of the Bersas (perfectly adequate pistols, no doubt), thus further skewing the poll and possibly the perception of those who don't know any better.

Taurus guns are a crap shoot, mostly landing in the "crap" category. Don't waste your money on one of these. Another example of a reasoned post, complete with documentary evidence in support of one's position ... or not.

SeanMTX
March 20, 2008, 02:58 PM
I sent my PT145 back to Taurus for work on the sights (way low and left), as well as work on the slide catch lever (was slipping under the magazine follower and creating issues)....after about 500 rounds.

I called 3 weeks into the process, got a woman who knew what she was talking about and said it'd be sent back at the end of the following week.

Sure enough, her estimate was bang on, and I got the gun on a Wed.

Total out of pocket: $0. Taurus covered shipping.
Total calls to Taurus: 2. Good information both times.
How'd it turn out?:

Runs like a champ. Shoots POA, zero problems at all with the slide catch. Functions like it was brand new.

The only gripe I can say is they returned the gun dirty as hell...like they fired 100+ rounds.

DawgFvr
March 20, 2008, 03:07 PM
I never owned or fired a Bersa. I do own and carry a 2nd generation, DAO Taurus Millennium Pro PT145. The Tarui is a fine weapon...smaller than a Glock 19 and it carries 10 + 1 .45 ACP pills. I found it very reliable. It did not like cheap Wichester White Box ammo...gave me some light strikes on their hard primers. That, of course, is what I value in the DAO pistol...you just pull the trigger again and it usually fires the next time...although such cheap ammo would not be my carry ammo...no way. Now...my pistol does love good ammo...and I never had a problem with any Corbon, thus, my carry ammo is the 160 grain Cobron DPX all-copper bullet. After 2000 rounds, my front sight came off...so, I screwed in another set and used a little lock-tite and she works fine. I wish my government 1911 worked as well as this Tarui!

http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e61/DawgFvr/PT145/PAT145sights.jpg

Lobotomy Boy
March 21, 2008, 12:21 AM
I had one of each brand and liked them both quite a lot, but I have to give the nod to the Bersa over the Taurus just because the Bersa was trouble free and the Taurus had a couple of minor issues.

Jkwas
March 21, 2008, 02:56 PM
For .380 go Bersa, for 9mm go Taurus. Personally, I like a short barrelled revolver for a car gun. No brass flying around.

weregunner
March 21, 2008, 05:48 PM
Just for giggles as this is a Taurus thread and Bersa thread.....
http://www.thehighroad.com/showthread.php?t=349277
This is very recent.

weregunner
March 21, 2008, 05:50 PM
Just for giggles as this is a Taurus thread and Bersa thread.....
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=349277
This is very recent.

weregunner
March 21, 2008, 05:53 PM
Then there's this:
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=348723

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