[Nightwing]

Guys. I'm thinking of starting to open carry.
I need to know anything that could potentially get me in trouble in this situation. What CAN I do and what CAN'T I do?
I've looked into it for months now and I just feel like anything can happen at any time and I'd hate not to have the tool that could save my life or someone elses. I never intend to even have to remove this gun from the holster.... or even have to reach for it. But I do feel that I would like that protection for my family and friends.
I plan on getting my CCW in the next few months, but for the time being I have decided that I want to open carry if it doesn't pose too many inconveniences for what it is.
Any info is appreciated.

[CountGlockula]

opencarry.org (http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum13/) may help you.

[phonesysphonesys]

Don't do it in Denver.

Semper Fi

[Nightwing]

^^^
Why?

Oh. now i See.

Wow. everyone told me it was ok to carry in Denver.
I've had some interesting run ins in Denver and wished I'd had some protection with me late at night. Guess that'll still have to wait for the CCW.

[Nightwing]

So... what I'm really looking for is what is considered brandishing? What situations am I going to get myself into trouble in and what are perfectly legal.
I don't intend for this gun to ever leave it's holster, but what if I have a situation where it has to come out? I don't want to be the one getting in trouble just for pulling it out as a safety measure in an extreme situation. I know the line between legal and illegal action is thin sometimes so I NEED TO KNOW whatever it is that you guys know. I think I'm pretty educated, but don't need any surprises

[NavyLCDR]

1. Denver county is off-limits, which it looks like you have been informed.

2. Review the CO state laws to determine what establishments you cannot carry in. Just google CO revised statutes. You will eventually get to LexisNexis. You want Title 18, Article 12.

3. Simply carrying a firearm cannot be considered brandishing. The line between brandishing and defense is if you threatened someone either by referencing the firearm or by actually presenting it - in an other than defensive situation where you felt your life or someone else's life was in danger or grevious harm.

4. When you are carrying, you must be careful to not become involved in situations that you would normally avoid if you weren't carrying. For instance, road rage...some guy starts approaching your vehicle and you would normally drive off if not carrying - don't change that and stop and engage the person just because you are carrying.

Now, if you see a crime being commtted and a person's life is in danger, than that is different, of course. You might not become involved if you weren't carrying, but now you might be justified in doing so and be safer because you are.

Anyway, if you just non-chalantly carry it and are just your normal decent person anyway, you won't have any problems. If you do have to draw the weapon, make sure you are the first one to call the cops and volunteer that you drew your weapon because of the situation.

It appears from the statutes that you are OK carrying in your vehicle as well. I know in Washington State, open carry is allowed, but it has to be unloaded in the vehicle without a CHL.

[DaveBeal]

what I'm really looking for is what is considered brandishing?

In Colorado law, it's referred to as "menacing", which is a felony. It requires the intent to intimidate.

There is also a similar misdemeanor, but I don't recall the terminology. It's something about displaying a deadly weapon in a public place in a manner that causes alarm. As I recall, it does not require the intent to intimidate. When I took an NRA Basic Pistol course a few months ago, this is the statute that the instructor said you are most likely to run afoul of if you carry openly.

[CountGlockula]

So... what I'm really looking for is what is considered brandishing? What situations am I going to get myself into trouble in and what are perfectly legal.

This and many, many others will be answered in your CCW course. Take plenty of notes.

[Kind of Blued]

You seem like you've a decent head on your shoulders and you've already displayed the FIRST requisite to carrying openly... KNOW THE LAW.

A number of police officers DO NOT know the law. Be prepared to state the law (the number or code or whatever it is called) that says that you can legally open carry without a permit, and it might not be a bad idea to have a copy of the paragraph in your wallet.

Secondly, wear nice clothes, make eye contact with people, say hello, be presentable. Let people realize that non-murdering felons aren't the only people with guns.

Third, I'd reccomend some sort of retention holster. Nice looking brown leather with a retention strap perhaps.

Fourth, the Colorado "menacing" law is INCREDIBLY vague. One is made to believe that the ONLY way to legally protect yourself with a gun in a hostile situation is to fully unholster the gun and make its presence known visually. Here it is:

18-3-206. Menacing.

(1) A person commits the crime of menacing if, by any threat or physical action, he or she knowingly places or attempts to place another person in fear of imminent serious bodily injury. Menacing is a class 3 misdemeanor, but, it is a class 5 felony if committed:

(a) By the use of a deadly weapon or any article used or fashioned in a manner to cause a person to reasonably believe that the article is a deadly weapon; or

(b) By the person representing verbally or otherwise that he or she is armed with a deadly weapon.

According to this, like I said, it is APPARENTLY illegal to put your hand on your holstered weapon to let the assailant understand what he is dealing with. It is also apparently MORE illegal to put your hand on your holstered weapon and plainly tell the assailant "I'm armed, don't come any closer" than it is to stick your hand under your shirt and threaten him with a gun that you don't actually have.

It's pretty ridiculous.

Anyway, just keep the gun holstered unless your last option is to "go guns", and you'll be fine legally.

Also, if it concerns you, write to a local government figure about the nebulous nature of the "menacing" law, and get signed up in the CCW Class ASAP!

Let me know if you need any suggestions for teachers. I think there is still an opening in the class on the 31st of this month at Gunsmoke Gunsmithing. I'll be there. Its 4 hours, get your certificate THAT night.

[Dravur]

I have carried openly sometimes and people either assume I'm a cop, look at me strangely, or don't notice it at all. You will find the majority of the people never even notice. You could wear the gun in a bright pink holster and string Christmas lights from it and most people would not see it.

I openly ware one at a dog park several times, and no one said boo.

So, take the class either at Gunsmoke or from another group. But, whatever you do, don't take a gun to be worked on to Gunsmoke.... or buy anything at Gunsmoke...

Well, unless, you like having your gun worked on by untrained chimps or like to pay full retail plus on everything.

Ask me how I know...

[MachIVshooter]

Where do you live? Because that's gonna be the difference between OC being perfectly acceptable or a constant hassle. Where I'm at (Elbert County), most folks don't care at all. But the overwhelming majority of the population out here own guns.

CCW eliminates all the hassle, and opens up city and county of Denver. Get it.

[Bailey Guns]

There is no statute in CO that "allows" open carry. On the other hand, there is no statute in CO that prohibits open carry. It's pretty much left up to local jurisdictions to restrict or allow.

Most municipalities strictly prohibit open carry under their "Disorderly Conduct" ordinances. Most such ordinances are at least a little vague and don't require any sort of threat on your part with the gun. Generally, not always, OC is OK in most unincorporated areas.

You should avoid open carry and get your CCW unless you want to become intimately familiar with all the laws in all jurisdictions. You can easily get in trouble without doing anything other than carrying your gun.

[DaveBeal]

Here's the misdemeanor statute I was referring to. I was wrong - it does require "a manner calculated to alarm".
18-9-106. Disorderly conduct.

(1) A person commits disorderly conduct if he or she intentionally, knowingly, or recklessly:
...
(f) Not being a peace officer, displays a deadly weapon, displays any article used or fashioned in a manner to cause a person to reasonably believe that the article is a deadly weapon, or represents verbally or otherwise that he or she is armed with a deadly weapon in a public place in a manner calculated to alarm.
...
(c) An offense under paragraph (e) or (f) of subsection (1) of this section is a class 2 misdemeanor.

[Zak Smith]

I believe the 2003 SB25 clarified open carry throughout the state, and specified how a locality can prohibit open carry.

[MachIVshooter]

There is no statute in CO that "allows" open carry

Um, yes there is. That'd be Article II, Section 13 of the state constitution.

The right of no person to keep and bear arms in defense of his home, person and property, or in aid of the civil power when thereto legally summoned, shall be called in question

It's pretty much left up to local jurisdictions to restrict or allow.

No, it's not. Per C.R.S.29-11.7-103

Denver got away with their OC ban because, as in many instances, Denver was granted special legislative authority by the Colorado supreme court using provisions of Article XX of the state constitution (home rule). City and county of Denver sued the state over C.R.S. 29-11.7-103 and won using these clauses.

[William Lee]

Interesting stuff guys. I'm curious to know whether a CCW holder in Colorado can get in trouble for printing in an open carry jurisdiction. I ask only because I just bought a 4" GP 100 for a car gun and was thinking about carrying it. However, it's a pain to conceal 100% in all manners of dress, so I was wondering if I have a shirt draped over it and the outline of the grip is pretty obvious if that would still be considered bad form. Otherwise I'll spring for a shoulder rig.

[luigi]

http://www.rmgo.org/faq/#OpenCarry

Here's a good resource

[Crawford]

It's been several years, but the city of Boulder also had restrictions on open carry. From what I have read in the news lately, you can bet the Republic of Boulder will have the most restrictive laws and regulations on fire arms permitted under the state codes and constitution.

[CoRoMo]

I don't think Boulder is quite what you're describing. I'll have to do some searching. BRB
...the overwhelming majority of the population out here own guns.
Hmmm? I don't live in Elbert County, but just from my own observations/experiences, I have been forced to believe that the vast majority of Coloradoans don't own a gun. A lot do. A higher percentage than a whole lot of other states, but I can't say that more than 50% of us out here are gun owners. I hope so, and I'd love to have miscalculated in my casual encounters.

[luigi]

Unfortunately I think more people live in Denver than the rest of the sate combined and as such Denver dictates to Colorado like Chicago dictates to Illinois

[CoRoMo]

In regards to Boulder...

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=510428

Whether or not this thread concludes with the correct and definitive answer, Ida know.

[PTK]

Don't do it. I'm thoroughly soured on CO as a state after my experience with "eek it's a gun".

[ichiban]

Rule #1: If you are going someplace that you think you will need a gun, don't go there.

[LemmyCaution]

Rule #1: If you are going someplace that you think you will need a gun, don't go there.

This is America. You shouldn't need a gun anywhere. But sometimes you do. That is never a reason to live in fear, however.

You live your life. You take your chances.

[.455_Hunter]

Rule #1: If you are going someplace that you think you will need a gun, don't go there.

You are right to a point...

Walking around the side streets of East Denver/Aurora on Saturday morning @2:00 am just because you can = BAD IDEA

Walking around the 16th Street Mall/LoDo on a Saturday evening @ 10:00 pm after enjoying a nice dinner with the wife = PERFECTLY OK

I refuse to be a hostage in my own home just because I carry a gun and MIGHT have to use it.

Don't be cavalier, just act like a normal responsible adult.

[Shmackey]

I don't want to be the one getting in trouble just for pulling it out as a safety measure in an extreme situation.

In a situation that requires you to draw your weapon, getting into trouble will be the least of your concerns.

BTW I got my CCW in Boulder County (city of Boulder, even), and it could not have been easier unless the card came with a free gun.

[Robert]

There is no statute in CO that "allows" open carry. On the other hand, there is no statute in CO that prohibits open carry. It's pretty much left up to local jurisdictions to restrict or allow.
This is what was taught to us in the CO State Patrol Academy in 2003. Now that has been a few years ago, and as MachIVshooter points out there is some argument to refute that statement. But if you can get your ccw and don't worry about it.