[alemonkey]

It's always good to know what the other side it up to, and I know a lot of people subscribe to the Brady's mailing list for that reason. But are there many message boards dedicated to gun control? I did a brief search and found a few poorly organized ones, but nothing like the number of sites like this one, Firing Line, etc. The ones I read seemed to have a lot of emotional postings mainly composed of illogical arguments and name calling.

It seems to me the anti's aren't nearly as well organized on a grass roots level, and that got me thinking. My theory is apart from a few elitists who think they know what's best for the rest of us, most people don't get as passionate about taking a right away from someone as they do about keeping it. No matter what the reason, I think it bodes well for us.

If there are many of these, maybe we need a coordinated effort to post well thought out arguments on them. I'm thinking we won't convert any dedicated anti's, but the casual reader who browses the boards might be swayed.

[Rabid Rabbit]

Most of them are run by anti-gun groups with paid staffers. You won't see much traffic because their focus is so small.
Poster 1: Guns are bad lets ban them!
Poster 2: +1
End of thread.

Not much to post about and their arguments are laughable. Take a look at the Heller arguments, absolutely stunningly bad, they suck the intelligence right out of your brain. This is the best they had to offer?!

My time is best spent not engaging a paid staffer of an anti-gun group but the politicians that sometimes do pay attention to the voters. Heck we even had a swing vote in MD publicly say he changed his mind because of the emails and phone calls.

[Coastie2010]

The lack of activisim by the antis definitely shows up on facebook. Students for Concealed Carry on Campus grows every day, with active boards and wall posts. The anti-gun groups tend to have at most a few hundred members (many of whom are pro-gun and looking to change minds) and never make any arguments. They jsut say "guns are bad! ban all guns so no one dies everrrr!" and let the group exist.

[High Planes Drifter]

Democtatic Underground has a subforum on guns. I lurk there occasionally. Like you said, it never hurts to know what the other side is up to.

[ZeSpectre]

High Planes Drifter... I visited that site (Democtatic Underground)...thought my head was going to implode!

[RLsnow]

I used to think Michael Moore was a man of truth and reason :uhoh:

but i was quite fascinated by firearms and such, i found this forum on my search for info. (love the reading) and i was hit by the ray of wisdom and reason that is THR :evil:

Logic and good thinking like found here kind of rubbs off on you :)


so spreading the word might work :D

[LawBot5000]

even democratic underground's gun area is mostly pro gunners. Occasionally one of the liberal retards from the other 95 percent of their forums walks in and says something stupid before getting mercilessly attacked. If I remember correctly, there is one person on there from another country (it was UK, Canada or AU) who posted 99 percent of the anti-gun nonsense. The rest of the people took turns debunking her.

They ban people for saying anything that sounds like sympathy for conservative views or (god forbid) construed as criticism of the democrat party. For liberals, they have an awfully narrow view of free speech.

[ronwill]

I don't subscribe to anti mailing lists, magazines, etc. In doing so you may go on their list of "supporters" that is used when they approach politicians. I do, however, visit their sites occasionally to keep abreast of their plans. I just don't register on any of them.

[IllHunter]

If I want to know what the anti's are up to, I read the Chicago newspapers.:banghead:

[WildeKurt]

The Democratic Underground gun forum is interesting. Mostly pro RKBA's from what I could tell. The anti stuff was pretty thing, usually clocking in at 1 line or less. How's that for intelligent arguments. Methinks some people from here go there as well.....

[Kino74]

even democratic underground's gun area is mostly pro gunners. Occasionally one of the liberal retards from the other 95 percent of their forums walks in and says something stupid before getting mercilessly attacked. If I remember correctly, there is one person on there from another country (it was UK, Canada or AU) who posted 99 percent of the anti-gun nonsense. The rest of the people took turns debunking h

I've been to the DU a few times to see the gun forum and also they have a outdoor section. I think I know the ones you are talking about. One is supposed to be a lawyer in Canada and there are two others I see running anti gun proganda. They actually try to assume they are more intelligent and morally superior to gun owners. I have say though, they have quite a few pro gun people there and they do not back down one bit. Even the other forums on DU know any anti gun posting will be countered, quite fiercely I might add. I find it ironic and interesting that the most level headed people at the Democratic Underground tend to be the gun owners.

[Feud]

I think that a significant factor is that it is hard to make a hobby out of being "anti" something.

For pro gun people there is always another question, what do you think of this new model, that caliber, these new grips, etc. For those who are anti there isn't much to talk about unless you are actively organizing some type of movement, but that only requires a limited number of people dealing mostly with logistics.

[bogie]

Frankly, some of the folks have been making themselves a fairly lucrative living - I'm suspecting that the anti folks get some fairly serious donations... And I bet they also solicit a bunch...

If I was running their show, I'd hire folks to do nothing but hang on the pro-gun forums, and sow dissent... You could keep it fairly small - less than 10 or so people involved, and by using multiple computers/accounts/etc., keep it dispersed... One operator could have a dozen or more IDs on each major forum.

[Deacon Blues]

If I was running their show, I'd hire folks to do nothing but hang on the pro-gun forums, and sow dissent... You could keep it fairly small - less than 10 or so people involved, and by using multiple computers/accounts/etc., keep it dispersed... One operator could have a dozen or more IDs on each major forum.It makes you think about all those x vs. x threads out there... :scrutiny:

Imagine if the antis did have an answer to THR. I suppose it would be called TheHighHorse.org. :p

[CBS220]

Most of the Anti activism on the internet comes from forums populated with nanny-staters, mommies, and people for whom guns are not the focus. But some boob posts a link to a poll, and they all spam it mercilessly.

[The Wiry Irishman]

For pro gun people there is always another question, what do you think of this new model, that caliber, these new grips, etc. For those who are anti there isn't much to talk about unless you are actively organizing some type of movement, but that only requires a limited number of people dealing mostly with logistics.

Exactly. This is a point I always try to make when someone gets despondent over the prevalence of anti-gunners. We have a common interest and a common ground that brings us together on a much deeper level. Is there anything you could really call the anti-gun community? What would they talk about on an anti-gun forum? Consensus would come pretty quickly that guns are bad then.... what? There wouldn't be any focus to it, and it would dilute any common purpose they had. We may be a little smaller, but we're a lot stronger.

Though it does amuse me to think of an anti-gun board with threads like:

"Which is a deadlier, more evil gun: Glock or 1911?"

"Which is a better child killer: 9mm or .45?"

"What assault rifle gives criminals the biggest advantage over our police: AK or AR?"

[Warren]

think that a significant factor is that it is hard to make a hobby out of being "anti" something.

For pro gun people there is always another question, what do you think of this new model, that caliber, these new grips, etc. For those who are anti there isn't much to talk about unless you are actively organizing some type of movement, but that only requires a limited number of people dealing mostly with logistics.


I've been saying this as well.

They have no positive "glue" to hold a movement together. Just hate and fear.

[M249MachineGun]

"What cell phone for bears/zombies/ninjas?"
"Hey guys, I know some of you are just going to call me a 'Mall Victim' but I've got this idea for a tactical wheelbarrow that can be used to haul away my dead body after the SHTF..."

[Im283]

But some boob posts a link to a poll, and they all spam it mercilessly.

I have not had that good a laugh this early in the morning since I can't remember when, thanks.

[ZeSpectre]

I tend to agree with the conclusion that others have reached that the "anti" groups have difficulty holding together because of focus. For example, someone's relative is injured/killed and they go "anti", others rally around them...for a time, but eventually tend to drift away since it wasn't them directly affected.

Those of us fighting the good fight for RKBA on the other hand, that's something we EACH own and that makes it a bit more personal for each and every one of us. That the right is embedded in a tangible, item (firearms) that most of us own pretty much "keeps it real" since we have a physical reminder present in each of our lives and with that reminder I think it's a little easier for us to keep focus and stay in the fight.

[shdwfx]

What cell phone for bears/zombies/ninjas?
:D

...kills me.

[retgarr]

no, thats the problem. If you loose it and start blasting away the cellphone can't kill you!

[HonorsDaddy]

but they seem to be VERY quick on the "Ban" button if you support the 2nd Amendment.

[redsaber75]

Very true about the facebook anti-gun groups.

CSGV has taken to banning people who disagree with them from their groups.

For the antis, it is more of a way to collect a paycheck than a passion.

Even Ladd Everitt (DC's Million mom march director) pulled out of a debate with a college student on the board. They get scared when you post the truth.

Anecdotal stories are the best to post on their groups since they never have anything to say to them or they usually make themselves look stupid trying to respond.

[NeveraVictimAgain]

The fact that the antis arguments are always based on emotion is exactly what concerns me. If someone feels strongly about something that can be very convincing to those who don't know enough to think critically and ask for facts. There's also the fact that they propagate lies and statistical distortions, like the infamous "three kids a day die from guns" that I still hear. The Brady Bunch doesn't tell people that the study that whopper is based on was discredited years ago.

My biggest concern is the pyschos who give the rest of us a bad name. The Virginia Tech tragedy is a good example. The media broadcasts those things repeatedly but rarely even mentions there is another side to the gun control argument, much less cover it. Therefore I feel it is the duty of every gun owner to memorize the facts that people never hear from the media. ( It seems pointless to say "the liberal media" since all the most powerful are liberal ). I didn't know guns are used more often to protect a life than to take a life until I read about it at Gun Owner's of America website. They have what I - as a new convert to the cause - found to be some astonishing facts. When I try to tell people the truth about concealed carry they say "Then why didn't I hear that on the news?" Compared to the propaganda that is spewed daily by the mass media the facts put out GOA and NRA seem to get drowned out. This is why I not only memorize the facts of the work of John Lott et al but try to publicize it in my own low budget way. For example, I like to print out "Just For Skeptics" from GOA and copy "The Armed Citizen" from NRA and post them in liberal gathering places like my local library.

There is a good book called "What you can do to preserve your gun rights" and the first thing on the to do list is "Feed Your Head."

I suspect I haven't told any of you anything you didn't know but living in a liberal state like Vermont I often feel outnumbered and that the cause is hopeless. The person in charge of Net access at the local library "accidently" crashed my terminal after I got "caught" researching 9mm hollow points.

What is CSGV?
Thanks for "listening".

[redsaber75]

CSGV is Coalition to Stop Gun Violence.

Counter their emotion with emotional stories that get across our talking points.

The Channon Christian/Chris Newsome murders are a very good example.

[Blackbeard]

How to convert an anti -- post this on DU:

Imagine that November comes, and Barack Obama wins the general election by a good margin. GWB invades Iran in December for promoting violence in Iraq. The invasion and battle rages into January, and GWB declares that he's ordering the inauguration of the new President to be "delayed indefinitely" on national security grounds. When Obama, Pelosi, and Reid object, GWB has them arrested and taken to Guantanamo Bay as enemy agents.

Now ask yourself -- do you want a gun?

It'll work because this is what they think is happening already.

[PILMAN]

Any hobby forum, for example I post on Anime forums, scuba diving forums, jetski forums, paintball forums, gaming forums, atheist forums, ign, and others. You post offtopic about guns, you will get a bunch of uneducated ignorant anti statements.

[NG VI]

The DU forums look like they were put together by a schizophrenic who's been off his meds for a looooooooong time.

[IllHunter]

living in a liberal state like Vermont I often feel outnumbered and that the cause is hopeless.
In the words of a past (imperfect) president, "I feel your pain" Don't despair, share with me the secret of LibStateBOB, when the SHTF they'll be crowdin round your door, looking to borrow, buy or steal a gun. You'll have the opportunity to do some serious capital development or to "engage targets of opportunity" Your BOB should contain rubber bands for the cash and plenty of 9mm (If that was your conclusion after the librarian cut you off). I think it's a fine choice (9mm) and am partial to large capacity magazines as effective crowd control equipment.:D

[dubious]

Hey... pro gun democrat environmentalist liberaltarian here... please don't mock me, it's hard enough as is. I wouldn't be here with 229 posts if I didn't care. If you guys can point me to some message boards, I'll defend our RKBA from a genuine democrat (well far left) point of view. We may not agree on all the issues, but I represent my republican / libertarian friends more than you will ever know. EBR's are fine with me, but yes... I care more about the environment and health care. And I'm not the only one. Some of you may think that makes me your enemy... or a sell out. I just do what I believe is right, and I hope you can respect that. I definitely respect the gunnies on THR.

[cornman]

There is no "anti" board of any consequence. Nor are there any liberal boards where hate for conservitives is so strong as it is on gun and right wing boards in general. I have never read a quote on a liberal tag line that implies harm to another person. But on conservitive boards, gun ones included, I read this garbage all the time. The other day I read one on similar board to this one that said something to the effect that liberals/democrats look best through a scope. How disgusting is that??? This was person was a cop even! Just a guess but I bet you would be have a hard time finding a progressive cop charged with brutality. But that is just my opinion...

[Soodonim]

I read Democratic Underground gun forum, and the funny thing is that about half the posts were pro gun rights. The funny thing about the a lot of gun control advocates is that they read all sorts of rights into the Constitution through penumbras and emanations, but then do their best to ignore the black letter "right of the people" in the Second Amendment.

[rklessdriver]

I'd disagree about the Antis being poorly organized. If they are so poorly organized, just why are there so many of them in the Congress? Why is there even a Brady organization? When was the last time you saw a pro gun ad on T.V.? How about a Pro Gun scene in a prime time T.V. drama? How about the News?

I think they are pretty well organized. They have people set in the highest reaches of our Government, Hollywood, News, and most all other Media outlets willing to broadcast and print everything the Bradys say.

We Pro Gun folks are the poorly organized ones. Best we can do is a message board and a few organizations (NRA, GOA) that try to sell a pro gun stance (lobbies) to the Antis who are in power. Sure they take our money and then pass a "compromise" bill, chipping away at the 2nd every little chance they get.

Time is on their side not ours. With the Antis control of some things it's easy to indoctrinate more and more citizens that guns are bad and marginalize us into right wing gun bunnies. They are doing it every day, everyday you see a story beat to death about a school shooting, every time you watch Law and Order and see some one get arrested for having a handgun or worse using one, everytime you pay that $200 Tax stamp on your newest NFA transfer, everytime you allow your $$$ in the NRA to go towards some "compromise" gun bill, everytime you are buying into a system the Antis control.

That's just in the good ole USA. Let's just forget about the world political scene and the UN for a min. No lets not. How many other countries in this world even have the right to bear arms... Compared to those who don't?

They didn't build their system overnight. They built it a little at a time when WE let them. Don't discount how powerful it really is. Guns are just one of the things on the Antis list and since it's a mildy hot topic right now they are ignoring it but they will return to it when the climate is better suited to their agenda. This one lawsuit we may win in DC isn't even a pimple on the ass of the 1000lb gorilla we know as the Antis. It's going to take thousands of lawsuits all over the USA to get the message across. It's going to take gun manafactures suing the Bloomburgs and City Governments for allowing convicted criminals out of jail and back on the streets where they can use guns in a crime. It's going to take all GUN OWNERS reconizing how serious this is to vote every single Kennedy, Pelosie, Boxer, Reid and Finestine out of office forever, remove the anti gun agenda off our TV's/News Papers and that's going to take a Revolution one way or the other eventually.

Maybe a Revolution in they way we vote, think, organize ourselves, educate ourselves/others, our choices in careers (so that we may put ourselves in the fore front) or maybe we let it slip so long that it takes a Revolution in the strongest sense and arms have to brought to bear on those who try and opress us (God I hope it never comes to that). Have no doubt folks it's going to take one. Which fight sounds better to you? Now is the time to work/plan for the future and avoid the latter.
Will

[gmflash88]

"What cell phone for bears/zombies/ninjas?"

Just wait until they finally figure out that cell phones are turning our brains into scrambled eggs. Then they'll be screaming about those things too. I'm more afraid of the 17yr old behind the wheel of a car with one of those then I am of any legally armed citizen.

[ExSoldier]

I register with antigun groups and make certain to tell them I only want SNAIL MAIL. I get a bunch of junk mail that I recycle and it makes me feel warm that I'm BLEEDING them just a little bit with postage fees. Imagine what might happen to them if all the members of the NRA did the same? Infantile I know, but it amuses me. I doubt they'd do the same to the NRA. It would be too offensive for them to even see the initials of pro gun groups in their mail box.

[redsaber75]

I register with antigun groups and make certain to tell them I only want SNAIL MAIL. I get a bunch of junk mail that I recycle and it makes me feel warm that I'm BLEEDING them just a little bit with postage fees. Imagine what might happen to them if all the members of the NRA did the same? Infantile I know, but it amuses me. I doubt they'd do the same to the NRA. It would be too offensive for them to even see the initials of pro gun groups in their mail box.

This is an asymmetric political battle.

Paycheck versus passion