AR-15 upper, lower slop


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cracked junior
March 25, 2008, 04:12 PM
I am wondering what is the best method for removing the slop between the upper and the lower?

I have seen the orange wedge, and the expanding take down pins but which is better, or is there something else.

I know ar15.com would be a better place to ask. I tried making an account over there but they want a better email address. My @yahoo.com isnt good enough for them.

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Andrewsky
March 25, 2008, 04:15 PM
How about a foam ear plug?

taliv
March 25, 2008, 04:16 PM
it's a non-issue

if you want a safe queen, get one without slop in it, instead of trying to put a bandaid on it

if you want something to shoot, slop doesn't matter, and sticking bits of plastic in there is a galactically bad idea.

Coronach
March 25, 2008, 04:19 PM
Concur with Taliv. Upper/lower slop doesn't matter.

Mike

vzenmn
March 25, 2008, 04:21 PM
I'm in the same boat as you with ar15.com with the e-mail thing (rimfirecentral.com too). A real pain when you see something you like in the EE but can't so anything about it. Mabye we should start are own ar15 forum.

I read somewhere that people who use ARs in national matches bed the lower to the upper sort of like you bed a stock to a rifle but I don't know how hard it would be. And like everybody says, its not really neccessary.

taliv
March 25, 2008, 04:24 PM
also, changing it so that you have to have tools to open the upper, instead of just using the push-pin, is a whole heaping helping of wackadoodle

taliv
March 25, 2008, 04:27 PM
hey, i just watched a 12 hrs Dukes of Hazzard marathon. what should I do next? oh, I know! I'll weld my upper and lower receiver together and paint the whole thing orange!


now where can I get a horn that plays "Dixie"... hmmm

Organdonor
March 25, 2008, 04:29 PM
That little plastic wedge works... and it's placed towards the back of the receiver, so it's out of the way of the trigger group.

And for $3, what more could you want? (midwayusa.com)

As for having a better email address, go sign up for a free email address at aol.com. They're free, but most of the forums haven't realized that, and still think they are more secure than hotmail, yahoo, juno, etc.

Coronach
March 25, 2008, 07:12 PM
That little plastic wedge works... and it's placed towards the back of the receiver, so it's out of the way of the trigger group.

And for $3, what more could you want?A beer and one less thing to go wrong in my AR-15.

Seriously, the slop is a non-issue, and most of the remedies to the slop add something to the rifle, and that something is one more thing that can slip out of place, break, erode, whatever and end up with small pieces in places where small pieces can cause problems.

If the slop was an issue, I think the accuwedge type stuff would be a good remedy. But it's not, so why not save your three dollars and put it towards something useful, like a bottle of Sam Smith Oatmeal Stout?

Mike :)

Fast Frank
March 25, 2008, 08:42 PM
My Smith and Wesson is tight, so I agree that this is a non-issue.

But if it was loose like some ARs I've seen, it would probably bother me that the rifle I paid damn near a grand for wiggles in the middle while the Chinese rifles I didn't want do not exhibit this same sloppiness.

Sure, I've fired rifles that are loose, and I agree that they feed just fine and show the same accuracy as the tight ones.

I think it's the "Pride of Ownership" that suffers when the rifle wobbles like the guy that built it was drunk.

I'm glad mine doesn't do that (Yet).

cracked junior
March 25, 2008, 09:28 PM
Fast Frank said it best. The slop isnt as bad as some I have held at stores or shot but its there.

The pin does seem like a pain since it requires a tool as said above. The wedge I see no way of it moving once you get the upper and lower together. So I think I will add the wedge to my magazine order.

Beer money is a non-issue right now. I can be called to work at anytime and the managers like to use the in office breathe tester.

Ridgerunner665
March 25, 2008, 09:32 PM
Slop matters to me...get the wedge.

RH822
March 25, 2008, 09:47 PM
My Colt came with an accu-wedge already installed. It hasn't caused me any problems and I can still pop the rear pin with my fingers.

RH

Onmilo
March 26, 2008, 12:10 AM
Slop can matter, especially when shooting past three hundred meters.
The problem usually shows itself as consistent vertical shot grouping.
I use Accu-Wedges on target and hunting AR15 type rifles.
I do not consider the Accu-Wedge neccessary for a combat type AR rifle.
I have yet to see an Accu-Wedge that has fallen apart and wedged pieces into the action stopping the function of a rifle.
Depending on the depth of the machining on the lower receiver, sometimes it is neccessary to trim the top of the Accu-Wedge to allow clearance for the bolt carrier to enter the extension tube.

The Accu-Wedge will compress to a point it not longer exerts enough tension to control slop and the vertical string reappears, replace the Accu-Wedge at this point.

taliv
March 26, 2008, 12:46 AM
hey, it's the internet... there'll be a thousand people along shortly to tell you it's flat out impossible for something to happen, until it happens.

http://www.thehighroad.org/showpost.php?p=3409734&postcount=5
At the EAG Carbine class I'm in the middle of, an Accu-Wedge wedged itself into the trigger group of one of the rifles rendering it inoperable until broken down and the pieces removed.

hankdatank1362
March 26, 2008, 01:38 AM
Sam Smith Oatmeal Stout?


Someone with some taste. Nice.

jpwilly
March 26, 2008, 02:22 AM
Sam Smith Oatmeal Stout?

October Fest is pretty good too. I'm on to IPA's lately.

Zak Smith
March 26, 2008, 01:07 PM
I've seen Accu-Wedges in AR15s and recoil buffers in AKs "migrate" somewhere else in the action or FCG and cause massive malfunctions.

Coronach
March 26, 2008, 02:08 PM
I've seen Accu-Wedges in AR15s and recoil buffers in AKs "migrate" somewhere else in the action or FCG and cause massive malfunctions.What he said. I've never seen this happen, but I have a LOT less experience than Zak in this field. I can see how it could happen, though. So, you're introducing an item to the AR that can cause (and has caused) major problems, in order to "fix" something that is not a problem at all. Seriously? Bad idea.
Someone with some taste. Nice. October Fest is pretty good too. I'm on to IPA's lately.I've never had their October Fest, but their Nut Brown Ale, Imperial Stout and Oatmeal Stout might be the best things you can get for under $3/bottle. Traquair House Ale and Thomas Hardy are good, too, but more spendy.

Mmm...Chimay. Mmmmm...Orval...mmm...Fullers ESB...

So many better ways to spend $3 (+s/h) than on an Accuwedge.

Mike :)

jrfoxx
March 27, 2008, 05:08 AM
galactically bad idea.
sorry, that just really made me laugh.Dont think I've ever heard that phrase before.+10 points for originality.

whole heaping helping of wackadoodle
I like this one too."wackadoodle" is just plain fun to say :D

Onmilo
March 27, 2008, 10:32 AM
I didn't say it was impossible for anything to happen.
I did say I DO NOT consider the Accu-Wedge neccessary in a combat or tactical rifle, most especially in a rifle or carbine intended to be used in one of these "Combat Course" or in real combat where instructors and combatants go out of their way to break things that shouldn't be considered breakable.

I did say I use Accu-Wedges in hunting and Target rifles to maximize the accuracy potential of the weapon.
Like it or not, the use of an Accu-Wedge can perform this function.

I also said that due to machining variations in lower receivers it is sometimes neccesary to trim the top of an Accu-Wedge to prevent the buffer from catching on the wedge.
If an Accu-Wedge shifts position enough to tie up the trigger group this is probably what happened.
Somebody did not test their equipment well enough before they attended one of the 'let's see if we can break your stuff in one thousand rounds or less' "Combat classes".

I am in the school of 'if the military isn't using it on their combat rifles and carbines you probably don't need the item either.'
However, there are other applications where those items do provide some benefits.

ocabj
March 27, 2008, 10:36 AM
The Accu-Wedge doesn't help accuracy, but it doesn't hurt it. As everyone has already stated, upper and lower looseness doesn't have any adverse effect on accuracy.

I tried the Accu-Wedge once, and it chucked it after I found it was more of a hassle to clean the rifle because it was too difficult to lock the receivers together with it in.

cracked junior
March 27, 2008, 10:37 AM
I ordered the wedge with my magazine order so shipping is non issue.

I will report back on how I like it and if I ever have issues with it.

Thanks

Billy_H
March 27, 2008, 10:41 AM
I've never had their October Fest, but their Nut Brown Ale, Imperial Stout and Oatmeal Stout might be the best things you can get for under $3/bottle. Traquair House Ale and Thomas Hardy are good, too, but more spendy.

Mmm...Chimay. Mmmmm...Orval...mmm...Fullers ESB...

So many better ways to spend $3 (+s/h) than on an Accuwedge.

I was just about to post up about their Imperial Stout and Nut Brown Ale...but thankfully you added them into the list as well as some other mighty fine choices.

Guess I'm a member of the 'drinks Samuel Smiths with a rattle-trap AR' crew.

Glockster35
March 28, 2008, 06:56 PM
I have seen and worked on many an AR that had massive slop. it is a non issue IMHO.

Of course if you are building a high dollar long range rifle, you might feel the need to correct it, otherwise, take that poodle shooter out and have fun. Don't waste too much time on it though, the price of ammo is still climbing!

Mr White
March 28, 2008, 09:42 PM
Glenn Zediker talks about wedges in one of his books. Basically says that slop is a a non-issue for accuracy, like everyone says, but that tight lockup is a feel good thing and if not having slop makes you feel better about your gun, you'll likely shoot it better.

I personally feel that $3 is too much $$$ for a little piece of rubber, so I made a few of my own out of some pieces of rubber I had around. After 3 years, the first one hasn't worn out or gotten loose yet.

AK103K
March 28, 2008, 10:04 PM
The slop may be a non issue, but it is damned annoying. My Bushmaster had a lot of slop and drove me crazy. I tried the Accu Wedge, but it wasnt big enough, so I made one from a piece of white drafting eraser. I also used the "O" ring trick on the front post. Tightened her right up.

This is where the "O" ring goes if your confused.

http://home.comcast.net/~jesse99/o-ring1.jpg

NetJunkie
March 29, 2008, 01:06 AM
I was just about to post up about their Imperial Stout and Nut Brown Ale...but thankfully you added them into the list as well as some other mighty fine choices.

Guess I'm a member of the 'drinks Samuel Smiths with a rattle-trap AR' crew.

Been a member for years. :) Man..now I want an oatmeal stout....

Bendutro
March 29, 2008, 01:25 AM
Mmm. Oatmeal Stout.

Don't forget the Rogue brewery and Sierra Nevada too.

fchavis
March 29, 2008, 03:04 AM
I had some Stone Russian Imperial a few hours ago, that is some delicious beer. Sammie Smith make a fine brew as well.

Significant slop shouldn't be any worse that a recoiling bbl, right? What was the longest confirmed hit with an M2? Would slop in an M16 effect full auto fire? Semi auto should be fine and consistent, but what about a specifically timed system? Might require an adjustable BC/auto sear release.

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