Multiple charges


PDA






crashresidue
March 31, 2008, 04:44 AM
Cheers guys,

I've read a lot of posts about "multiple powder charges in one case".

Can I ask how/why?

I've only been reloading a couple of years, but when I started, I figured out real quick - no matter which stage of reloading I'm in, if I'm interrupted, I leave the charging handle of the press DOWN - as in "completed". There is then no doubt about whether the: case has been re-sized, been belled, been charged, or been finished. The handle is DOWN - that particular case is done!

Am I missing something here?

Gentle winds,
cr

If you enjoyed reading about "Multiple charges" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!
schnarrgj
March 31, 2008, 04:57 AM
It is not following safe reloading proceedures. I always visually check all of the cases before I seat the bullet. I only use a single stage press. Through the years, I have caught myself on a number of mistakes that were caused by not paying attention, complacency and just plain stupidity. Which caused me to look in the mirror and ask the reflection if anyone was home. Having been reloading for more than 30 years, I have probably made every mistake possible and by double checking and a set reloading proceedure, have kept them from coming back to haunt me.

The Bushmaster
March 31, 2008, 10:37 AM
Multiple or double charges of powder is caused by not paying attention to what you are doing because of distractions or laziness (short cuts) and complacency (as schnarrgj has said)...Some powders will over flow a case if you double charge. Some will not over flow the case when double charged. Illiminate distractions and pay attention. Look into each case to insure you have not double charged that case before you seat the bullet. Remember...You are messing with high explosives...

ilbob
March 31, 2008, 11:45 AM
I agree. Its not a problem with the reloading gear, but with the operator. Too many people like to watch TV, yak, or listen to the radio while they should be paying attention to what they are doing.

Idano
March 31, 2008, 12:47 PM
You can help safeguard yourself if you choose powders and work up loads that use 55% or more of the case volume, that way if there is a mistake it is obvious. This is especially important if you load on a progressive press.

Schleprok62
March 31, 2008, 01:49 PM
Idano -

As much as I agree with you, and am not in anyway attacking you, but I have noticed that there aren't many powders for .45 ACP (for example) that use that much of the case capacity. There is still the need to visually inspect each stage of the process.

ArchAngelCD
March 31, 2008, 02:07 PM
I refuse to choose a powder just because it will fill the case more than half full. I want to use the powder I think will work best for the application I'm creating. I NEVER consider how much or little the case will be filled when I decide upon which powder to load.

If you pay attention the the details and always practice safe loading routines you will probably never double-charge a case. I know accidents can and do occur but if you pay close attention to everything you are doing while reloading those odds shrink drastically.

Don't misunderstand what I'm saying. I don't think those who choose a powder because it will not allow a double-charge are wrong in any way for doing so, I just don't factor that reason into my powder choices.

The Bushmaster
March 31, 2008, 02:29 PM
Then there is the good ol' .38 Special...I have yet to come across a powder that will fill that case to 55% or more.

And I agree with ArchAngelCD...Reloading is a 100% contact sport...I use a lot of W-231 and there are few, if any, that it fills to 55%

Steve C
March 31, 2008, 02:38 PM
I think progressive and multi station presses are often the culprit with double charges stemming from the operator not paying attention to everything that's going on.

There can be times when you get powder bridging in the measure and the first charge doesn't drop but the second cycle you have 2 charges drop.

As others have said, interruptions and not paying attention to what's going on after the interruption is probably the number one reason.

Other reasons:

Carelessness like using a load for a different powder or miss reading the manual.

Using the wrong powder, IE filling the measure back up with a fast powder when you had been charging with a much slower powder.

ArchAngelCD
March 31, 2008, 02:55 PM
The Bushmaster,
You got that right. I also use a lot of W231 in my .38 Special rounds and I'm betting you can triple charge a .38 Special case with W231 and still not hit the top. (you know I have to try it now, don't you!! LOL)

Walkalong
March 31, 2008, 02:58 PM
Eyeball EACH and EVERY powder charge you seat a bullet over and you will be fine. :)

If you dont, it's like playing russian roulette, sooner or later, it's going to happen. :uhoh:

I like bulky powders for a couple of reasons, but they are not always the best for a given load.

Idano
March 31, 2008, 02:59 PM
Schleprok62,

I agree the larger the caliber it does get to the point where is not feasible, in those cases I try to choose a powder that fairly forgiving but even that is not always an option. There is nothing that can take the place of good reloading methodology, but I do like to put as many factor in my favor as possible.

I NEVER consider how much or little the case will be filled when I decide upon which powder to load.

ArchAngelCD,

Wow I hit a nerve here, sorry. Everyone chooses powders for different reasons or else we would just have one for every caliber. I choose my initial test powders based upon chamber pressure and velocity followed by case capacity then start dialing them in, if not move to another. This method has done me very well for thirty years so I stick with it. What really scares me is seeing new reloading looking for the powder that they can get the most cartridges out of, some of those loads are so hot and so small it would be impossible to see a double charge even with a light. It's like you said you can take all the proper precautions but accidents can still happen.

ArchAngelCD
March 31, 2008, 03:08 PM
Idano,
Come on, how did my post even make you think you hit a nerve? You took one sentence out of a whole post and formed an opinion upon my feeling from it. Why didn't you also quote me when I said:
Don't misunderstand what I'm saying. I don't think those who choose a powder because it will not allow a double-charge are wrong in any way for doing so, I just don't factor that reason into my powder choices.
That statement was made so nobody would think I was talking down their choices or their opinions. Everyone has a valid opinion and they make choices based upon reasons they think are important.

You didn't hit a nerve or anything else and I clearly didn't discount anyone for choosing a powder based on density.

cmidkiff
March 31, 2008, 03:12 PM
I'm one who does try to select a powder that takes more than 1/2 the volume of the case. Call it an insurance policy.

There's a few calibers where that's difficult, but not many. Bullseye in .38 and .357 is the one that comes to mind. I still use it, but I watch even closer than usual.

Just last Friday I had a .44 case I was loading that somehow ended up with a clump of brass polishing compound stuck in the case after tumbling. I dumped 19g of 2400 in each of 50 cases, and immediately spotted the offending case through my normal visual inspection on the way to bullet seating. The powder level was within a quarter inch of the case mouth.

I've only been reloading for about a year now, but it's things like this that keep me using a single stage press. How do you spot issues like this if you're using a progressive press?

Idano
March 31, 2008, 04:20 PM
ArchAngelCD,

Sorry about that I thought you were imply something with the capitalization, but I see from your following email that wasn't the case.

ArchAngelCD
March 31, 2008, 05:54 PM
Idano,
Not a problem at all.... It's sometimes hard to know exactly how someone feels when chating on the Internet because you can't hear their vioce or see their face.

Walkalong
March 31, 2008, 09:44 PM
Caps are yelling in email and may be taken that way in a post. I have seen enough of ArchAngelCD's post to know he is a straight up kind of guy and did not think much of it, but it LOOKED serious. ;)

If you enjoyed reading about "Multiple charges" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!