[brigadier]

Just wondering if my own taste here is uncommon. Some animals I would kill in a pinch for food, but there are a few different species that I simply will not kill at all. Primarily, rabbits, chipmunks and skunks. For one, I am not fond of eating scavengers, none of them taste good IMO and I really have a soft spot for all 3.

What about you guys. Any animals out there that you won't kill?

[TAB]

Other then rodents.

I was brougth up, you shoot it, you eat it. Same with fishing, you keep it, you eat it.

So lots of things I would not hunt. Now for survival, every thing that walks, crawls, swim or flys is fair game.

[plexreticle]

I avoid shooting humans when possible.

[OMGWTFBBQ]

If an animal isn't destroying property, and I don't intend to eat it, I won't shoot it. Me being quite squeamish when dealing with the blood and guts part of hunting, I stick to varmints. 90% of my hunting has been rabbits munching on the garden or destroying the rose bushes.

As for specific animals I won't kill, chipmunks.

[Regolith]

I probably wouldn't kill a primate, unless it was about to kill me first (and this includes members of the homo genus as well), or something that was endangered. Other than that? Can't think of anything, given the right circumstances. That said, I don't shoot at anything that moves, either; I generally tend to need a good reason to kill an animal, either for food or to exterminate a pest.

[coloradokevin]

I was also brought up under the rules of "you kill it, you eat it".

I've also learned of the importance that every species plays in it's own way. So, I'm not necessarily into shooting varmints on public land, personally.

I've certainly plugged a few ground hogs here and there on some of our relative's farms back east, and I can understand hunting prairie dogs and the like when they are threatening someone's land and/or livelihood.

But, for me anyway, I don't see any point in shooting an animal (be it a P.D. a coyote, etc) on public lands without the intention of eating it! From where I sit, it seems awfully wasteful...

As for other personal opinions: I've always had dogs as pets, and even if they are useless poop factories, I kind of like them! As such, I don't have much interest in shooting coyotes myself!

As always, to each their own.

That said, I don't shoot at anything that moves, either; I generally tend to need a good reason to kill an animal, either for food or to exterminate a pest.

You did a good job of saying what I think I was trying to say here!

[SammyIamToday]

I'm not really a fan of hunting ducks because they mate for life. Just seems weird. Not against other people doing it by any means, just not my thing. Don't really like bird hunting at all, come to think about it. But then again, I've never really tried much, so maybe I don't know what I'm missing.

[MCgunner]

You don't like fried RABBIT!? Strange.

I won't kill anything illegal, don't particularly care to shoot predators other than coyotes for the ranchers. I like seeing bobcat and don't kill them, though I would to get a mount if I wanted one. I don't shoot dogs or cats unless they're feral and/or presenting me with a threat, but then if a human presents me with enough threat, I'll shoot him before he shoots me.

I don't know, I really don't shoot much of anything other than ducks, geese, doves, deer, and hogs all in season. I get to go squirrel hunting occasionally and will take a rabbit when presented, love fried rabbit. I shot a snake the other day to shut my buddy up who almost got bit by it. Had I been alone, I'd let him live. He wasn't threatening and I can side step snakes. We skinned it and he took it home for supper, so it didn't go to waste. Fried rattler....tastes like chicken. :D

I absolutely LOVE duck hunting. I don't anthropomorphize my game, either. They mate for life, so what? I like eating 'em, like shooting 'em, and LOVE hunting 'em. The deeks, the calling, it's all part of me. I'm an unabashed, non-apologetic waterfowler. When I hear that first flight of geese coming in in the fall, my heart rate soars, my hair stands on end, and I start to drool. :D

[BattleChimp Potemkin]

Funny you mention this, I have a skunk issue in my neighborhood. Problem is, he has a ranged weapon, as do I. Ive tried humane traps (smart jerks arent they). The main issue is by the time I can smell em, he is in range. Sort of like that Alien movie, but I need SPACE MARINES!

Anyways, I generally dont hunt if I have the money to buy meat. I hunted alot, hunt occasionally, but generally do it as a food measure, rather than fun issue. If a pest issue, then definitely. I dont like shooting chipmunks (generally harmless anyways) or badgers (had a friend that had one of these as a pet, you come to love them quickly). Badgers will keep your rodent population down generally too:D.

[GearHead_1]

But, for me anyway, I don't see any point in shooting an animal (be it a P.D. a coyote, etc) on public lands without the intention of eating it! From where I sit, it seems awfully wasteful...

This is the way I feel and I don't like the taste of any game save it be fish. Yes, I know that someone has a recipe that would make me change my mind but I've tried most of them and just don't like it. I used to hunt, elk, deer, pheasant, duck, dove and most any game that Utah has to offer. I found that I usually had to find someone to give my kill to as I didn't want to eat it. This typically wasn't a problem there is usually someone you are hunting with that will take the game. I guess for lack of a better description I had a streak of morality hit me. If I don't need it I don't shoot it. I've hunted enough to have the confidence and know that If I needed to take it I could. I'm not an anti-hunter. I don't have a problem with people hunting. I just don't do it for the sport.

[SammyIamToday]

I absolutely LOVE duck hunting. I don't anthropomorphize my game, either. They mate for life, so what? I like eating 'em, like shooting 'em, and LOVE hunting 'em. The deeks, the calling, it's all part of me. I'm an unabashed, non-apologetic waterfowler. When I hear that first flight of geese coming in in the fall, my heart rate soars, my hair stands on end, and I start to drool.

Not really sure it qualifies as anthropomorphizing since most humans do not mate for life. :D

Like I said, I have no problem with it, just not my thing.

[AKpacker]

I'd probably choose not to shoot the Sasquatch.

Actually, at one point there was a county in south western Washington State which actually made it illegal to hunt the famed Big Foot....

Amazing that....

[The Tourist]

I make no moral judgement on other hunters. I eat meat, and I help my friends in obtaining good quality equipment to enhance their hunts.

I say that for a good reason. I have gotten to the point in life where hunting is no longer my cup of tea. If invited on hunt by friends, I will eagerly take a spot on a "drive" to find deer. To me, it's a nice walk in some beautiful Wisconsin woods.

About eighteen months ago I sold my 45-70 with the idea that if I ever needed another I could find one for a specific hunt or vacation. That has never happened. In many ways, I am no longer a hunter or a varmint shooter.

[ArmedBear]

I like to hunt quail here. It's good exercise, it's fun, and the meat is delicious.

I'm considering doing some crow hunting; the birds ARE harmful, and they've decimated our desert tortoise population. I like the tortoises; I used to keep some as pets (needed a license from DFG since even then they were endangered).

The bunny-huggers protested and stopped the BLM from killing crows that were eating hundreds of hatchling tortoises each. Stupid! I'd do the job for them if I can figure out where to do it. But I don't much care to eat crows; they're vermin that have been brought in in large numbers by human disturbance of the habitat.

[charby]

I only hunt what I'll eat. I mostly hunt fowl and ruminants.

I used to hunt squirrels and rabbits but not anymore because of time constraints. I always think of a February rabbit hunt but I usually have other things to catch up from hunting every free moment from mid October-January.


-C

[fatguynlittlecoat]

Raccoons. I dunno, I just like them.

[jfountain2]

I'm with the kill it, then grill it group. I don't see the point of killing something just to say you did.... except for Sasquatch, I'm afraid I would just have to kill it if I saw it just so I could go on the news and put an end to the "real, not real" arguments.

[highorder]

I won't shoot anything in the weasel family, because I have 3 ferrets at home. They are more personable than cats and easier to manage than dogs. (which I also love)

[Deer Hunter]

Snakes and spiders.

The reason?

I hate rats and insects.

[wheelgunslinger]

I don't hunt or eat predatory animals or scavengers. That includes bears.
Though, if the Coyote population gets too much more, I may take up skewering them with my arrows.

[HGUNHNTR]

Nope, they are all on the list.

[H&Hhunter]

Yep lots of them.

[andrewdl007]

Im a softy. When I grew up we would have deer always on our property and they became like pets. I dont think I could bring myself to shoot one. When I grew up in California, I shout probobly hundreds of ground squirles because they would tunnel into our chicken coop and eat the eggs and bother the hens. when I moved to Virginia, I couldnt bring myself to shoot the tree squirrels since they never did any harm. I guess I would say I only would shoot it for food or if the animal was doing harm in some way that could not be stoped another way.

[rcmodel]

I will never kill a Jackalope, or a Nauga.

They almost wiped out all the Nauga's back in the 50's due to the high demand for Naugahyde.

And Cabala's is selling stuffed Jackalopes to city folks faster then they can reproduce around here anymore.

rcmodel

[MCgunner]

Quote:
But, for me anyway, I don't see any point in shooting an animal (be it a P.D. a coyote, etc) on public lands without the intention of eating it! From where I sit, it seems awfully wasteful...
This is the way I feel and I don't like the taste of any game save it be fish.

Probably a culture thing. I grew up in the country hunting. I reckon if I grew up in a city and my parents/grandparents didn't hunt and fish, I wouldn't have a clue.

I'd probably choose not to shoot the Sasquatch.

I wouldn't shoot a Sasquatch because I'd be afraid of being charged with murder when they unzipped the suit off him. :D

I will never kill a Jackalope, or a Nauga.

I would LOVE to fly to France for a Bungee hunt. Long, skinny critters that stretch in the middle. Amazing animals, those Bungees.

[Floppy_D]

They almost wiped out all the Nauga's back in the 50's due to the high demand for Naugahyde.

You silly goose. :D

My grandad caught me shooting sparrows when I was a kid, and grilled one and made me eat a piece. Not to knock his grilling, but that was awful... maybe just because I was mortified by the idea.

Now, unless I have a real good reason, I won't shoot what I won't eat. I shot prairie dogs wholesale when I was a kid, but my granddad was a rancher and that was my job.

[1/4MOA]

survival situation aside.... i shoot anything with a purpose.....

coyotes eat young turkeys and raid nest, also eat deer, quail, etc. i'll kill a predator on public land or private to preserve other wildlife whos numbers have been depressed.

only kill true "game" species during legal season unless its deer during growing season in crop fields. theres tons of deer here.

[john1911]

I'll shoot any legal animal in season.

[Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow]

If it's legal, it's fair game. If it's endangered in any way, I don't want to shoot it. Fortunately, it's illegal to shoot anything endandered so I don't have to worry about what'd endangered and what's not - just what is legal and what's not, and the first question subsumes the second. Probably the only animal species not endangered yet still illegal, which I think need their ranks thinned nevertheless, are homo sapiens sapiens and canis lupis.

In other words, all endangered species are illegal (that's good), but not all illegal species are endangered (bad, if they are a nuisance or taste good).

I do need a REASON to shoot anything. But that reason doesn't have to be "to eat it". It can be (a) to eat it, or (b) because it's a nuisance species.

Nuisance species (to ME) can include a wide variety of things, including animals which tear up crop fields (feral hogs), screw up the water drainage (beavers), and animals which kill game which *I* like to hunt (or their eggs). Including coyotes, bobcats, and things that eat turkey eggs and quail eggs (racoons, skunks, armadillos, possums, etc.). Yes, some humans need killin too, but for better or worse (better I suppose, to maintain an orderly society), killing the ones need killing is highly illegal. :)

But no, nothing is sacred, no matter how intelligent or how cute - if it tastes good or is a nuisance, its in jeopardy. :)

But I can't quite bring myself (thankfully) to cross the thresshold of using "because I want to stuff it / it would make a good trophy", alone, being legitimate. The culture I come from says that trophy hunting for trophy hunting's sake is wrong.

[ronwill]

I no longer trophy hunt, meaning I don't shoot anything I wouldn't eat. Controlled hunts help strengthen game populations and the fees help maintain hunting lands. Predators are not the problem when it comes to game reduction, it's usually poaching and over hunting. I also thought differently until I actually observed what wolfs, coyotes and cougars ate on a regular basis.

[MaterDei]

Unicorn?

[308win]

Songbirds, almost all birds though I have been known to shoot roosts of grackels and starlings at his request for the landowner who lets me shoot and hunt; all wild predators -except coyotes - which except for fox and other fur-bearers is about all we have here; don't hunt quail, pheasant, or waterfowl anymore; anything not legal. Thinking about taking turkey hunting up again if I can find someone who will eat it.

[john917v]

For the most part, I only kill what I will eat. The only exception is if there is a predator on a person's property that harms livestock.

[conwict]

The Tourist wrote:

hunting is no longer my cup of tea

I sympathize, but I personally have my own motivation for hunting:

To remind me what is in the neatly wrapped pink Styrofoam packages full of yummy nutrition that I buy every Sunday.

I don't think hunting is supposed to be 100% pleasant, all the time you do it. Certainly not everyone enjoys every aspect of it. But, it is almost a "duty" for me because I want to be more involved in a hands-on way in the food chain, so as to be in touch with my primal roots.

Truly, I think hunting one's own food--even occasionally--makes one a better-rounded, more aware person.

[qwert65]

I'll hunt for fun but only a species I'll eat It's never been that difficult for me skill wise though I've only hunted pheasant, quail and deer. though nj has so many deer that might be part of it. I no longer hunt pheaseant or quail because it's not worth it for the tiny amount of meat.

I'd like to try goose hunting when i graduate.

The only other animals i've shot have been fox(red and grey) some diseased chickens at the neighbors, feral cats that i couldn't catch after 6 mos of trying, a doberman that was killing my cats after repeated warnings to the owner and a couple groundhogs who refused to leave the barn/stop eating the grain.

I'm a vet student and really love animals so i only shoot nusiance animals when their on my territory kinda a you don't bother me I won't bother you deal. and cause i'm soft I once noticed a fox had kits and waited a month or so till they were weaned before I shot mom(not a good idea though I lost lots of ducks I was raising for meat

[Vern Humphrey]

I eat what I kill -- that includes rabbits, squirrels, turkey, ducks, geese, deer, elk, and so on.

I don't shoot skunks -- no reason to. I do shoot (and don't eat) many varmit species -- around here, crows and coyotes mostly.

[tkendrick]

I will never kill a Jackalope, or a Nauga.


RC, trying to remember what caliber we used to use. Personally, I don't regret almost driving Nauga's to extinction, nasty animals. How many Edsel dashboards do you need to re-cover anyway?

[pat86323]

I can see no reason whatsoever to kill a bird or prey, they are quite interesting and really dont do anyone any harm. They just kinda fly around, look beautiful, and eat things that i dont particularly want around.

[Grizfire]

I usually just kill what I eat. I won't harm canines, felines, or song birds (unless its those damned illegally introduced English sparrows that kill native birds).

[MCgunner]

I can see no reason whatsoever to kill a bird or prey, they are quite interesting and really dont do anyone any harm. They just kinda fly around, look beautiful, and eat things that i dont particularly want around.

That would be illegal and unethical in any event and COULD land you in prison.

I do shoot cowbirds, an introduced pest that is predatory on native bird nests by kicking the eggs out and laying theirs in their place. I have nesting doves on my place AND cowbirds, so occasionally, when I'm bored and the cowbirds are around, I'll pop a few. Was doing that for grins the other day with my .410 contender. It's legal here and encouraged by Parks and Wildlife, or at least they have a trapping, eradication program for them. Waste of time, though. They'll never get rid of all the cowbirds.

[MCgunner]

This thread brings to mind my annual dove hunt in Waco two years ago. My buddy from college and I get together every year to hunt a couple of times, once at his place for dove (he has lots of 'em), and down here for geese and deer/hog (I have lots of 'em).

So, we were out one morning on his 70 acre farm that butts up to his dad's 500 acres on a creek. His boy saw a bobcat and let him go. They don't get to see bobcat up there too often, I don't think, and he didn't wanna shoot it. It was small anyway and he was loaded with 7 1/2.

We get though with the morning hunt, go to his dads the following afternoon to try the back tank and creek there which is usually good. We were chatting with his mom and dad, up in their 80s now, both second generation Czech immigrants and old school. Larry mentioned to him that Christopher had seen a bobcat. His dad says, "Did he shoot it?" Larry told him no. The old man about had a hemorrhage fit. Yelled at Larry, "YOU DON'T EVER NOT SHOOT A BOBCAT! I GOT THREE NEW BORN CALVES OUT THERE!......yadda, yadda." So, now, Larry just figures don't tell the old man. ROFL!

[winchester243]

Got no interest in eating bear so I wouldn't shoot one unless I had to.

Now gophers and coyotes I'll shoot even though I wouldn't eat them either.

[pbearperry]

I watched a guy shoot a giraffe on a safari,and it made me sick.I mean what the hell?

[Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow]

I will amend what I said to also add bear to endangered species - just because my understanding is they don't taste none particularly good, and there's none enough of them to seriously depredate deer, I don't believe. Plus they are beautiful - rather let them walk. Except I wouldn't mind killing one brown bear with a bow from the ground, as a test of manhood/stupidity, provided that I ate it, of course - or gave the meat to needy/hungry people.

[marksman13]

Not a whole lot I won't shoot. The raptors get a repreive because they are pretty damn awesome and illegal to kill. Endangered animals are safe too. I'm not big on shooting something that will land me in jail. Turtles, snakes, crows and coyotes are the only animals I kill that I don't eat. I know. I know. I know. Somebody is gonna take issue with the fact that turtles. Save yourself some time, don't type a ***? response. They eat fish, and ducklings. I don't like 'em. Therefore I kill them. Get over it.

[Cosmoline]

No cats of any kind. Too much juju in a cat to mess with it. Plus I think they hold grudges into the next world. And also they may run the next world. Best not to tempt fate.

Except I wouldn't mind killing one brown bear with a bow from the ground, as a test of manhood/stupidity, provided that I ate it, of course - or gave the meat to needy/hungry people.

They're not endangered here, but I don't think you'd find many people wanting brown bear meat.

I probably wouldn't kill a primate, unless it was about to kill me first

I'll kill any primate that carries and M1 carbine and tries to catch me in a net! Damned dirty apes!

[Selfdfenz]

I'm not really a fan of hunting ducks because they mate for life.

I'm not sure that's 100% accurate. Ducks pair bond and stay that way but if something happens to one of the pair the other may/will pair up with a different member of the opposite sex.

Best,

S-

[308win]

Yeah, I am not convinced about the monogamous ducks either; a mallard drake that has been coming to our water garden (of all places) for about two weeks now with two hens - so polygamist I might buy. We have been watching them to make sure the hens don't start nests in the beds somewhere because the Shelties would make quick work of the nest if we didn't get them socialized to it before hand and they found it.

[MCgunner]

Yeah, I am not convinced about the monogamous ducks either; a mallard drake that has been coming to our water garden (of all places) for about two weeks now with two hens - so polygamist I might buy.

He ain't from El Dorado, Texas, is he?


I'm not sure that's 100% accurate. Ducks pair bond and stay that way but if something happens to one of the pair the other may/will pair up with a different member of the opposite sex.

Well, the line IS "till death do us part", ya know. :D

[H&Hhunter]

A couple of big misconceptions here.

PremiumSauces wrote,


. If it's endangered in any way, I don't want to shoot it. Fortunately, it's illegal to shoot anything endandered so I don't have to worry about what'd endangered and what's not - just what is legal and what's not, and the first question subsumes the second. Probably the only animal species not endangered yet still illegal, which I think need their ranks thinned nevertheless, are homo sapiens sapiens and canis lupis.

In other words, all endangered species are illegal (that's good), but not all illegal species are endangered (bad, if they are a nuisance or taste good)

This a very common misconception. There are plenty of species that are listed as endangered that are legal to hunt. Elephant, Leopard, cheetah, grizzly/brown bear, crocodile and certain types of zebra are just a few.

First of all simply because a species is on the "endangered" list does not mean that it is threatened in all or even part of it's habitat. In fact it may not even be close to being threatened in anyway at the currently. Or the species in question may be endangered only in a small part of it's habitat.

However once a species is listed as endangered it becomes a political issue and no matter how healthy that species is it becomes very difficult to have it de-listed. Especially if it something like an elephant that people tend to have unnatural anthropomorphic emotions about.

Right now as we speak there are 4 countries in Southern Africa which are screaming about their elephant overpopulation problems and are going to either have to start culling and killing thousands of these animals off or they are going to have a self induced elephant population crash of biblical proportions due to overpopulation. These elephants are eating themselves right out of their habitat. They are overpopulated yet while this going on right here and right now. I still have to hear on a nearly daily basis about the plight of the poor endangered elephant and how could anybody shoot one?:confused:


People need to break out of these fuzzy happy feel good misconceptions pull their heads out of the sand and look around. It us hunters who are responsible for just about each and every one of the good and healthy and in some cases unhealthy population come backs of just about every big game animal that was once or is now listed as endangered.

pbearperry wrote
I watched a guy shoot a giraffe on a safari,and it made me sick.I mean what the hell?

I've never killed a giraffe but I have seen one shot I agree that it is not on my need to do list. But I will tell you "what the hell"? Giraffe are considered a delicacy among many of the locals in Africa. The older and the stinkier the bull the better. So the biltong from that giraffe sells for a premium and once these bulls get to a certain age they become very aggressive with other bulls and need to be taken out of the herd.Many times old bull giraffe also become car and people aggressive. Yes it's true, even something that graceful and beautiful will stomp the crap out of you if it gets in a bad mood. Especially if it is on a game ranch that has limited space for a herd of giraffe. You know less than 100,000 acres of open country or so.

So for the ranch it is a triple good deal. One, they get a premium for the meat. Two, they get the trophy fees. Three, they get rid of an old non productive bull and get paid for the trouble.

It is sad to see such a graceful animal fall. But they aren't just doing it to be mean old hunters there is a very good purpose for it.

[MCgunner]

Wow, you'd need one HELL of a house to put a Giraffe shoulder mount on the wall! :eek: Got a friend who shot a 6x6 bull elk. He's got 7 ft ceilings. ROFL!

[308win]

MCgunner - If he is he is doing a lot of traveling to find a quite place to woo and sc*** - well, whatever.

[mr.trooper]

I believe that God charged man with the care and safety of His creation. As a steward of another's property, it would be irresponsible for me to kill an animal that I didn't have a legitimate need for.

I know how, and have hunted in the past. I am sure i will do so many more times in the future, but I don't hunt every season, or even every year, because most of the time I don't need to.

Our family spends a lot on food. 70lbs of venison diverts a LOT of money away from the food budget for long enough that we can use it to pay other bills.

[HM2PAC]

I do a lot of duck hunting.

These days I won't shoot mergansers, goldeneyes, sea ducks,......anything that is questionably palatable.

[Darthbauer]

I dont shoot animals for the fact that I dont want to have to gut and skin them after I do it. I'd honestly rather go to war and shoot a human than kill an animal for sport.


Now if the thing was atttacking me, then yeah, id blow the thing away.....



I still wouldnt gut it though.

[K3]

I leave snakes alone. I'm fascinated by them, and they eat rodents.

I won't kill a javelina. They're legal to hunt, and I see them every now and then, but I don't see the point in shooting one.

While I don't mind shooting a jackrabbit here and there, I leave the cottontails alone. They're just so darn cute.

I mostly leave raccoons alone, but if one of them is jacking with one of the few feeders we have on our deer lease, I'll make it a point to go out one night and call near that feeder.

I'll call in and shoot coyotes all day and leave them for the hogs. Unless one or two has a particularly nice pelt, and I'll tan the hides. Coyote hunting holds me over between deer seasons, and I don't have to pay to do it. Other than fuel to get to the land I have permission to hunt on, that is.

I don't actively hog hunt much, but the landowner who lets me 'yote hunt said to kill as many as I could, as they were wreaking havoc on his land. Smart buggers though, and since my hog hunting experience is zero, I've only ever heard them a couple of times. I'd like to get a youngin' for some nice ham and bacon. Say an 80 to 100 pounder.

Deer - I prefer big antlers, but I eat the meat. I'll shoot a doe for herd management purposes, and naturally I eat the meat. I give a lot of deermeat to family and friends too.

[X-Rap]

Unicorns and Jackalopes all get a pass with me.

[H&Hhunter]

I dont shoot animals for the fact that I dont want to have to gut and skin them after I do it. I'd honestly rather go to war and shoot a human than kill an animal for sport.


Now if the thing was atttacking me, then yeah, id blow the thing away.....



I still wouldnt gut it though.

Darth,

Do you hunt at all? I just curious to know if you have hunted in the past and didn't like the gutting thing or if you just think you wouldn't like it?

[K3]

Interestingly enough, I sort of enjoy field dressing deer.

[Heavy Metal Hero]

I shoot anything that I see (sans Scrub Jays).

With that being said, I am a lousy hunter.

[Ske1etor]

I'd personally eat a bald eagle if my life depended on it.

[MCgunner]

Happiness is a warm gut pile. :D

[H&Hhunter]

I guess growing up around agriculture and having been around animal processing my whole life it never has bothered me. Not to mention I've been hunting since I was a small child.My wifes a Veterinarian I've been helping her with surgeries for nearly 20 years. This stuff just never has bothered me.

My wife did a dissection of a fetal calf for a middle school class this morning. With the exception of one kid who simply wasn't interested in any way shape or form. By the end of the session each and every kid was gloved up and poking and prodding everything they could get their hands on. It is actually fairly unnatural for a even a small child not to be interested in the internals of animals once they get "into" it.

I've yet to meet anyone who when taught how to process game didn't become interested in it and was still grossed out afterward.

It doesn't stink, it won't harm you, it's a perfectly natural thing and has been part of the human experience for thousands of years. So to be scared of it is unnatural phobia. If you are scared of animal guts I recommend that you confront it and get that little quirk out of your head.:)

[cornman]

There is no animal that I would kill unless i had to. I have hunted small rodents as a youngster, but it always made me feel sick. As I grew and began to understand the wisdom of the life around me I learned that killing, even small creatures is a road that can diminish one soul. I have no problem with others hunting abundant animals for food, but otherwise I see it as a sin.

[Darthbauer]

Do you hunt at all? I just curious to know if you have hunted in the past and didn't like the gutting thing or if you just think you wouldn't like it?


I have hunted dear before. Just didnt like the gutting part. I have a pretty weak stomach. It sucks but theres nothing I can do about it.

[dagger dog]

Lions and tigers and bears, Oh My!

[brighamr]

Personally, I'm a member of PETA. (People Eating Tasty Animals).

All creatures look best next to the mashed potatoes and gravy.

[Savage Shooter]

I eat what I kill 95% of the time the other 5% is nucience animals and then theres possums an adult (2yrs) can have 2 litters a year of up to 12 each litter there a nucance they get in my traps before the coons cause they come out before they do i hate them my dad calls me the possumslayer cause I usually get obout 3possums to every coon last weekend i was coyote hunting and had my 12ga with #1 buckshot and I was going through the woods and I saw a possum it went into a thorn bush about 6 inches tall and acted like i couldn't see it got about a foot away and well... needless to say bye bye little devil.:evil:


hold real still now this is going to leave a mark

[koja48]

Personally, I couldn't harvest a Griz (I'm blessed to have observed many), Polar Bear, Elephant, or Whale . . . nothing against those who may have done so or would like to . . . just answering the Op's question as honestly I can, from my perspective. Now if they were posing a threat, why all bets are OFF! Each could represent the "hunt of a lifetime," they're just not on my "to-do" list (plus, paying the taxidermy fees to get a life-sized mount of a whale would seriously compromise. if not totally decimate my retirement plans . . . ).

[koja48]

Regrettably (or not . . . war is hell), I've also done this . . . never had a desire to tag or mount one however . . . to still be alive is sufficient. Darth, may I respectfully suggest you avoid the "Hunting" forum?

[H&Hhunter]

As I grew and began to understand the wisdom of the life around me I learned that killing, even small creatures is a road that can diminish one soul. I have no problem with others hunting abundant animals for food, but otherwise I see it as a sin.

Interesting point of view corn are you Buddhist or Hindu?

[Darthbauer]

never had a desire to tag or mount one however . . . to still be alive is sufficient. Darth, may I respectfully suggest you avoid the "Hunting" forum?


Not saying that I would "mount" one, just saying that if someone is trying to kill me and its me or them, its going to be them. Last time I checked the bears and deers are not out there with hunting rifles and orange vests shooting back. Just don't see sport in killing.


Or am I just not understanding what your getting at?

[koja48]

Please see post below . . . my bad . . .

[GRB]

Primarily, rabbits, chipmunks and skunks. For one, I am not fond of eating scavengers, none of them taste good IMO and I really have a soft spot for all 3. I don't get it. Sinc ewhen are rabbits and chipmunks considered scavengers. Skunks may scavenge, but are also fearless hunters.

Now I would not kill a skunk for food unless desperate - just because of the stink. Rabbits, they are delicious, and I imagine chipmunls would be okay. I would kill whatever I needed to survive in a bad spot.

[koja48]

You are obviously not understanding . . . if you are NOT a hunter (and I respect your right to to your opinions, likes, & dislikes), why are you perusing the hunting forum? Herein reside discussions about hunting, the harvesting of game, skinning, mounting, stalking, and otherwise processing game animals/birds, and related subjects. I'm glad you would defend yourself, but am perplexed as to why one averse to such activities would frequent this particular area of discussion. If "bears and deers <were> out there with hunting rifles and orange vests shooting back," I'd likely still be out there. My "sport/passion" to enjoy is as rightfully mine as is yours, whatever that may be. Simply stated, there are criitters I do hunt (and with a passion) and those I have no desire to pursue . . . to each his own . . . it's the "life, liberty, and pursuit of happiness thing." And I happen to view it as "hunting," not "killing. God Bless . . .

[coyotehitman]

I kill only what I eat, unless:

A. It is bothering or trying to harm me
B. It is damaging my property
C. It is sick and in need of taking a long nap

[LJH]

I limit what is harvested to what is needed on the table. Unless it is a threat to health or safety. With that said I have never had an animal threaten my health or safety.

[Selfdfenz]

What about introduced species.

On the east coast the coyote is an introduced species, ditto for the nutria everywhere in the US, as well as pythons and Nile Monitors in the Everglades. I guess we could add wild hogs in TX to the list.

I've never shot any of the above but sure would if the opportunity presented itself because the native species and sometimes the environment is harmed by these interlopers.

The whole idea of "I only shoot what I'm prepared to eat" might be misplaced in these cases, no?

Best

S-

[eliphalet]

I guess I would kill a knat to a blue whale under the right circumstances.
There are thousands of species including the whale, I would prefer not to though.

Picked up a used Marlin 22 Mag today, second shot it killed a ground squirrel. I don't eat ground squirrels and don't subscribe to that " if you kill it you eat it" train of thought. I don't particular enjoy killing stuff for the killing I don't believe, but it in no way bothers me to do it. Unless I need to put my own dog or the like down, that never makes for a good day.

[H&Hhunter]

Along those lines.

Us "evil" sport hunters who kill African big game and by doing so assign value to the species in question thus providing them a financial base which protects their habitat from encroachment and keeps them form being wholesale slaughtered for market purpose. There are many reasons to hunt which don't include the false morality of "only if I eat it".

How about without us hunters this million acre reserve would in short order be void of wildlife and would be chopped up into low yield migrant farm patches. How about all of the meat that comes from my activity goes to supplement the diet of the local villages that surround this million acre reserve.

How about here in the US. The revenue from our hunting activities. Over a billion dollars each years from hunting licenses alone. Over 500 Million from sportsman's taxes. This money is used in part to maintain, manage and keep wild places wild. Hunters assign value to the animals they hunt. When animals have value they will not be destroyed rather managed to healthy level. Humans have been doing this from the beginning of time. It is nothing new.

When I see things like it degrades your soul to hunt and it is sin to kill animals. I respect your thoughts and beliefs. But the hard cold truth is without hunters their would be no animals left outside of private reserves and national parks. If you love wild life and respect it. It is a sin not to hunt. We hunters are the front line of conservation we always have been and we always will be.

Their is no other group of people on the planet that provide the benefits to wildlife that the hunter does. Not by a long shot.

[ronwill]

Us "evil" sport hunters who kill African big game and by doing so assign value to the species in question thus providing them a financial base which protects their habitat from encroachment and keeps them form being wholesale slaughtered for market purpose. There are many reasons to hunt which don't include the false morality of "only if I eat it".

H&Hhunter, I agree that controlled hunts benefit game populations in many ways. The only time I would even consider thinking of someone as an "evil" trophy hunter is in the case of canned hunts. When a person pays thousands of dollars to go to a "reserve" where a guide points to an animal (which may be drugged in some cases) and says that's the one your going to shoot, I don't consider that hunting. This type of "hunt" happens far to often in the U.S. where exotic game species are often drugged and released shortly before a hunt for someone to "bag" a trophy. Those who hunt in the traditional manner, pay their license and tag fees, and work at getting their game are true sportsmen that contribute immeasurably to managing game populations. This is true for "sport" hunters and those who hunt for food.

[koja48]

Well stated, H&H. Thank you.

[H&Hhunter]

ronwill,

Some very good points their. I agree with what you have to say about the "Jimmy Houston" syndrome. These guys are scum.

Two points I'd like to make.

1. Not all high fenced hunting is canned. Some of these places that are 10, 15 20,000 acres with a perimeter fence can be a very good hunting experience. If the animals are left alone not ever penned etc etc. There are many high fenced places in the country of South Africa. But when you've got 50,000 acres with a perimeter fence around it mainly to keep undesirable critters OUT. It is a very good hunting experience. If the animals that reside within are left alone and are wild.

2. And this is kind of a pet peeve of mine. the term "sport" hunter is a term that the radical anti hunters have made into a negative connotation. Unless you are a pure subsistence hunter who actually must hunt to live. In my opinion you are a sport hunter. We hunt for the enjoyment of the human experience of hunting. the food we derive from that experience is a bonus. But we can survive with out hunting therefore we choose to hunt we are not forced to.


I am a sport, trophy, meat hunter 100%. I eat most of what I kill. And I am always looking for a fine head as well. You can't eat horns but they don't stop you from eating the softer parts of an animal either.

In Africa nothing goes to waste. When I hunt in South Africa with my South African friends every bit of the meat is processed and eaten by their respective families. Or it is sold or given away to the locals none of it goes to waste.

In deeper darker Africa most of the meat goes to the local tribesmen. The rest will come back to camp to feed the staff and hunters.

The last buffalo I shot in Zimbabwe was about 3 miles form the nearest track. We quartered that buff and 6 of us packed him back to the track where we cut a trail in for the land cruiser to pick us and our precious cargo of meat.

My point is the term "sport" hunter does NOT preclude the consumption of your target species.:)

[Rule556]

I kill only what I eat, unless:

A. It is bothering or trying to harm me
B. It is damaging my property
C. It is sick and in need of taking a long nap

Same here.

[Mr. 16 gauge]

I'm not really a fan of hunting ducks because they mate for life.

Don't know where you got this little tidbit of information, but it's pure B.S.....if you've ever watched ducks mate, you then know that you have a bunch of males pursuing one poor hen and jumping on her any and every chance they get! Talk about a gang bang!

I hunt whatever I can when I can.....usually eat most of it, but I don't eat crows, coyotes, or fox, and they do eat rabbits, grouse, pheasants, ect., and I do enjoy eating them as well.

[eliphalet]

Killing only to feed/eat almost eliminated the big horn sheep. I believe was the cause of the extinction of the passinger pigeon. Until hunter/sportsman's demands and the Gov. began to manage our game animals this country's big game was in real trouble. It has been sportsman's lobbies/tax dollars that have for the most paid for the successful management of deer, elk, wild turkeys etc. to including many non-game species so we all can enjoy them as much as we do today.

With most "mate for life" critters it is just that. As long as both are alive they stay with the same mate. Once one of the pair dies the other will then find another mate to "mate for life" with again.

[ArmedBear]

I believe was the cause of the extinction of the passinger pigeon.

Actually, I've heard that it had something to do with some other uses for them.

Let's just say that, finally, someone invented something called the "clay pigeon."

Now, it's probably time that we start rounding up and using city pigeons (rock doves) for the purpose, just to control their population. However, some people don't like the idea.

[ronwill]

Killing only to feed/eat almost eliminated the big horn sheep. I believe was the cause of the extinction of the passinger pigeon. Until hunter/sportsman's demands and the Gov. began to manage our game animals this country's big game was in real trouble. It has been sportsman's lobbies/tax dollars that have for the most paid for the successful management of deer, elk, wild turkeys etc. to including many non-game species so we all can enjoy them as much as we do today.

With most "mate for life" critters it is just that. As long as both are alive they stay with the same mate. Once one of the pair dies the other will then find another mate to "mate for life" with again.

Eliphalet, I disagree with you on this instance. The Passenger Pigeon went it's way because it was a nuisance to farmers. The Big Horn Sheep is in trouble because of low birth rate and over hunting. I can't think of any instance where killing solely for food resulted in a problematic game population. One very good example of this is the American Bison. When Native Americans hunted them their populations remained large. It wasn't until the "buffalo hunter" started taking them simply as trophy's that they became endangered.

[eliphalet]

Actually, I've heard that it had something to do with some other uses for them.

Some reduction in numbers occurred as a result of loss of habitat, when the Europeans started settling further inland. However, the primary factor emerged when pigeon meat was commercialized as a cheap food for slaves and the poor in the 19th century, resulting in hunting on a massive scale. There was a slow decline in their numbers between about 1800 and 1870, followed by a catastrophic decline between 1870 and 1890.[6] In 1896, the final flock of 250,000 were killed by American sportsmen knowing that it was the last flock of that size. Afterwards passenger pigeons were rare and beyond the point of recovery. 'Martha', thought to be the world's last passenger pigeon, died on September 1, 1914 in Cincinnati, Ohio. Excerpt from Wikipedia.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Passenger_Pigeon

The Big Horn Sheep is in trouble because of low birth rate and over hunting.
I ave read they, big horned sheep, were a very popular meat in the mining towns of the 1800's that professional hunters had severely damaged sheep populations making a buck to feed the miners.

I believe it was for the hides that the buffalo was eradicated that and the fact they were the staple meat of the indigenous peoples who were in the way so to say. Same with the the Beaver at the time it was for the fur. Our fore fathers were not the best stewards of the land to put it mildly.


I am no expert in the matter for sure.

[H&Hhunter]

The Passenger Pigeon went it's way because it was a nuisance to farmers. The Big Horn Sheep is in trouble because of low birth rate and over hunting. I can't think of any instance where killing solely for food resulted in a problematic game population. One very good example of this is the American Bison. When Native Americans hunted them their populations remained large. It wasn't until the "buffalo hunter" started taking them simply as trophy's that they became endangered.

Ronwill,

This sir while it sounds good to support your argument your statement about buffalo and bighorn sheep are maliciously incorrect. What wiped out the buffalo was large scale market hunting for their hides and tongues. It had nothing to do with "trophy" hunting. Not to mention a concerted government effort to wipe them out to cut off the plains Indians food supply.

Elk and bighorn were nearly shot to extinction for meat. Same as mule deer and Mt goats in certain areas.

It was a trophy hunter who stopped all this and made sensible laws and hunting seasons and was one of the true fathers of American conservation and is THE reason we have any wild places and wildlife left in this country. His Name was Teddy Roosevelt.

It is the same thing that happened to the elephant in Africa. When elephants were commercially hunted for Ivory by professional hunters their numbers began to dwindle. However about the 1940's most countries began regulating the hunting both commercial and sport. Elephant populations were just fine. they were stable or growing in many places.

The major elephant reduction did not occur until the 1970's when most of Africa was decolonized and game laws were unenforceable. That is when gangs of mechanized heavily armed poachers began wiping out wildlife by the thousands for profit.

Once again it was sport hunters who have stepped up forced various countries to get this under control.

There is no over hunting of bighorn sheep sir! Once again it was hunters who brought the bighorn back from the brink of extinction. Bighorns and the hunting of them is highly regulated and extremely limited. The most recent culprits in sheep population reduction have been scabies and low lamb survival due to lion depredation. And I sir worked with the New Mexico Department of Game and fish as a contractor to try and limit the lamb kill problem in several key bighorn ranges in New Mexico.

To state that the bighorn is trouble because of over hunting is simply a fabrication. I'd very much like to read your source on that because I and whole bunch of game biologists would VERY much like to have public debate on that statement.

[ronwill]

I think I used the incorrect terminology. When I refer to trophy hunting it is the type Buffalo Bill did, simply shooting standing bison from trains and leaving the carcass to rot on the prairie. It is true some of the bison killed by buffalo hunters was used but much of it was left to waste. When I refer to hunting for food, I mean where it is done for yourself, your family or your "tribe" in the case of Native Americans. Market hunting results in over hunting and, in the case of low reproducing animals such as the Carrier Pigeon, can lead to a troubled game population, or extinction. As an example of the "trophy" hunting I am referring to I give the following excerpt from an article in "Legends Of America" a site that is dedicated to those times.

"The Indians watched in dismay as buffalo hunting took on an almost a carnival atmosphere when railroads began to advertise “hunting by rail.” This occurred when trains sometimes encountered large herds of buffalo crossing the tracks. Seeing a way to capitalize on the problem, the advertising flooded the newspapers and in no time, sporting men with rifles were shooting buffalo by the hundreds just for fun. Those animals shot from the train were simply left where they died."

[106rr]

I have a soft spot for monkeys. Other than that, I would take anything edible, profitable or annoying.

[langenc]

To answer poster #1 and others__

Eat the rabbit-excellent eating. Kill the skunk and all friends and soon you will have more rabbits IF you dont have a couple cats hanging around. Just watch the cat-it is nothing more than a minaturized lion as it stalks and slinks about.

[eliphalet]

I think I used the incorrect terminology. When I refer to trophy hunting it is the type Buffalo Bill did, simply shooting standing bison from trains and leaving the carcass to rot on the prairie.IIRC Buffalo Bill was a hide hunter as a young man, among several other occupations before becoming a entrainer.

Shooting from trains was probably encouraged by more than the rail roads. The locals at the time's lifestyle revolved around those buffalo. Destroy the Buffalo, get rid of or control the people that depend on them. Pretty simple strategy really.

[H&Hhunter]

"The Indians watched in dismay as buffalo hunting took on an almost a carnival atmosphere when railroads began to advertise “hunting by rail.” This occurred when trains sometimes encountered large herds of buffalo crossing the tracks. Seeing a way to capitalize on the problem, the advertising flooded the newspapers and in no time, sporting men with rifles were shooting buffalo by the hundreds just for fun. Those animals shot from the train were simply left where they died."

Yes this was a horrible waste. But it took a sportsmen, a trophy hunter, Teddy Roosevelt to put a stop to these kinds of senseless slaughter.

Teddy was truly a man who was wise beyond his years and had almost uncanny foresight.

Even with the train shooters leaving hundreds of rotting carcasses on the plains the true destruction of the buffalo was a concerted and effort by market hunters and was promoted if not backed by the US government.

I have always read that the passenger pigeon was destroyed for it's plumage which adorned ladies hats.

In any case none of the examples we've brought up here have anything to do with sport hunting. These have all been examples of commercial market hunting or downright poaching for profit.

In the case of the train shooters this was simply a symptom of the times. These buffalo were limitless in the minds of a mid to late 1800's man. With manifest destiny being what it was we didn't have respect for anything or anybody that got in our way. When the man of those times saw a redwood forest he measured it's value in board feet. When he saw buffalo on the plains they were nothing more than an impediment to their plans to restock with domestic cattle. We were conquerers and treated the land appropriately. Much like the Roman legions and any number of other conquistidors past and present.

Eventually it was conservationist sport hunters who started to see the intrinsic value in these animals. And are the ones who eventually stopped the slaughter and created sensible game laws. Unfortunately it was to late for the American bison.

If you want to have some fun go find the game numbers form the turn of the century and compare them to today. And when you do that think who pushed for these reforms and these incredible turn around in population density.

[eliphalet]

I have always read that the passenger pigeon was destroyed for it's plumage which adorned ladies hats.My guess is that this is correct. Sounds far more logical for the time period as with the beaver for hats than "feed the poor" which I had not heard before either. My recollection was the pigeon population was destroyed beyond repair by professional hunters with punt types of shotguns. The wiki I referred to was what I found with a 2 minute search looking for a reference for my earlier statement.

Boy have we strayed from the OP's original question, but hasn't this been an excellent thread?

[sixgunner455]

I hunt birds because I like working with dogs. If I ever get to where I don't care about the dogs anymore (not likely), I'll have to reassess whether it is worth it to hunt birds. Dove and quail, mostly, but sometimes pheasant, too.

Just love seeing a dog get on a bird. Don't even have to be hunting, or get a shot, if the dogs get to work.

I can't think of many things I won't shoot. I can think of things I will shoot that I won't eat, but there are other reasons than eating to have to do that, as discussed earlier. I don't see me going on a hunting safari anytime soon, so most of my hunting will be confined to the native and feral species populating my region of North America. Most of them, I'll have to confess, I'd shoot if the occasion warranted it, even though I haven't had that opportunity on any but deer, elk, quail, dove, pheasant, some other birds, rabbit, squirrel, coyote, rattlesnake, skunk (passed, thanks!), and a few others.

Why didn't I shoot the skunk? Didn't want to!

[Selfdfenz]

H&H

And a hat tip to you this AM for once again putting in words a well considered and informed set of comments in regard to hunting.

I have always read that the passenger pigeon was destroyed for it's plumage which adorned ladies hats.

I've encounter that comment myself but I've seen a stuffed PP and I can't imagine those hats were very attractive or much in demand. Small feather dusters I could believe. Still that concept seems to share top list billing for the explanation of the PP's demise with other human based causes. Based on my reading I've come to believe these specific human-activity-oriented explanations are only partly correct or perhaps not at all accurate. There was something going on with the PP other than ladies’ hats and #8 shot and it's something writers of the day missed. I believe something happened to their breeding grounds or perhaps more than one critical element of their food supply that closed the deal on them. They moved in massive flocks as we all know. What a perfect scenario for an introduced avian pathogen from domestic poultry to get into their flocks and cause havoc. It's speculation on may part but what if there was some connection between eradication of the buffaloe and conversion of much of their range to agriculture and the demise of the PP. Where would we find that connection in the literature. Who would have even considered it when it was happening. It’s the kind of thing that may not have been evident to casual observers of the day.

Many books of the time identify shooting and similar as the cause of extinction of the Carolina Parakeet. A few biologically oriented observers of the day pointed out that CPs nested in big groups in hollow tree cavities. The disappearance of the CP coincides very well with the first full scale logging of large area of their habitat and as we all know that was clear cut type logging of a type few of us have ever seem other than in old pictures and illustrations.

Again, casual observers of the day wrote about seeing people of the day shoot PPs and perhaps CPs in considerable numbers. Those comments come down to us through time and become the unquestioned explanation for extinction, when in fact they may be only one piece of far more complex scenario.

Don't get me started on man inducted extinctions of ancient North American mega-fauna.

Best,

S-

[Mr. 16 gauge]

My guess is that this is correct.

Your guess would be wrong....passenger pigeons became extinct because of wanton greed & market gunning. Ladies fashion had nothing to do with it.
The bird in that you are thinking about, with re: ladies fashionable hats, is the egret....looks like a blue heron only smaller and all white.
Buffalo Bill never shot carcasses and left them lay; he shot bison for the railroads and the meat was used to feed the railroad workers as they lay track across the west. This was prior to the 'hide hunting' that took place later in the century; Buffalo Bill was to busy scouting for the army when this was taking place. The bison were hunted to extermination for two reasons: 1.) the bison was the main food source for the Native Americans, which the army was trying to move to reservations.....remove their food source (and the hides, which they used to make their teepees), and you now have starved your enemy into submission. 2.) the leather from the bison hides was superior to that of domestic cattle when it came to making belts to drive the machinery in the mills back in the east; with the industrial revolution at it's hieght, the demand for belts (and the leather that was used to make them) was high.
Geez.....nothing like rewriting history, esp. to the benefit of the Peta folks!:uhoh:

[eliphalet]

We also deal with the tabloid type of reporting of the day. Much of which tended to exaggerate to being a outright fable.

[xring44]

There are few animals, resident to my state that I haven't at one time or another killed. I grew up in rural Arkansas, times were tuff, (50s) any game that I managed to kill was a welcome addition to the dinner table. I shot many skunks, the prime reason being that they were a prime carrer of rabies, and no, they were not included on the dinner table. Possums on the other hand were considered fairly good eat'n, raccoons on the other hand never agreed with me. Rabbits were delicious, as were squirrels, quail, soft shelled turtles, deer, ducks, geese, and the occasional dove. As the economy allowed, the hunting of necessity declined. I still love the hunt but the "need" to susceed has vanished. The areas I hunting in my youth are now shopping centers, manufacturing plants and communities.

Hunting itself has changed dramaticly, corn feeders and food plots, scent-loc clothing and mechanical decoys, four wheelers and travel trailers have displaced wooden boats and a pair of oars, good ole shoe leather and britches that are no longer good enough for wearing to school constituted hunting wear. New fabric's that wicks away moisture, remain warm when wet and dry in minutes replaced two pairs of levis when it was bone chilling cold, lots of changes in the half century + that I have hunted.

The question of what animal I would not kill, That goes to mans best friend, I just can't quite pull the trigger on a dog.

[ronwill]

Sorry, but the killing of the remaining Passenger Pigeons by those who knew they were the last and the "train safari" bison hunts are historical fact. True hunters respect the land and all wildlife on it. They don't hunt for profit or simply to kill. Maybe I'm not stating my point correctly because I believe hunting strengthens game populations if done correctly. I still hunt wild hog and would still bird hunt if the area allowed it. The problem is most bird hunting around here now is reserve style hunts where the birds are released just prior to the hunt. I just don't believe that is true hunting.

[Art Eatman]

Bison and passenger pigeons are bad examples. They were not "hunted" in the 20th Century usage of that word.

The train-hunts were more common in the earlier times, just because of the large numbers. The demise in large part resulted from offical US government policy, to destroy the commissary of the Plains Indians. Add in, then, the commercial hide hunters; buffalo robes and coats for the eastern US and European markets.

The passenger pigeon's natural mortality rate was very high, which meant very large breeding populations were mandatory for continuation of the species. The harvest for restaurants and for homes reduced the population below a level sufficient for the species to survive. And it was indeed "harvest". Night time capture by the hundreds, from roosts.

FWIW: Even today, the natural mortality rate for dove and quail approaches 80%.

[eliphalet]

True hunters respect the land and all wildlife on it. They don't hunt for profit or simply to kill. Thank you for informing us all what a "true" hunter is or was over 100 years ago. I kinda think a "true hunter" definition is a matter of opinion and that one seems a somewhat narrow definition to me.

Get yourself a copy of a book titled "Hunter" by a fella named J. A. Hunter. Of his experiences in Africa in the first half of the last century. Read it, then tell me he wasn't a "true" hunter. Different times and places tend to change one's out look on things.

[brigadier]

Get yourself a copy of a book titled "Hunter" by a fella named J. A. Hunter. Of his experiences in Africa in the first half of the last century. Read it, then tell me he wasn't a "true" hunter. Different times and places tend to change one's out look on things.

From a natural point of view, he is actually pretty close to the point. When he speaks of a true hunter, he is defining the difference between someone who understands the nature of the sport, keeps good balance in the practice and respect for wild life VS guys like Elmer Fudd.

[ronwill]

From a natural point of view, he is actually pretty close to the point. When he speaks of a true hunter, he is defining the difference between someone who understands the nature of the sport, keeps good balance in the practice and respect for wild life VS guys like Elmer Fudd.

Thanks Brigadier, exactly what I was trying to say. Most hunters today follow that simple principle but there are a few who don't.

[McCall911]

Any animals you won't kill?

Yes. Cats, both big and small! I love those creatures! Admire their prowess. Respect them greatly.

Would I defend myself against a big cat? Sure, but I'm told that by the time you see them, it's generally about too late!

[ranger335v]

Cape buffalo. Them buggers are MEAN!

[G17Steve]

Bear,Cats(large and small),Birds of prey (Owl, hawk,ect)Aligator,I try not to kill sankes but sometimes have to.

Mind you if left with no other option I would shoot a bear or gator but only to defend myself or another.

[airman]

You must never ate bear meat before. I hunt and enjoy killing anything in season. I eat all game animals i kill. I do not eat non game animals,such as the name. These animals are non game mostly to help with population control. I like to help out ranchers all i can by knocking down yote's, ground squirrels, and Farrel cats. If i can help with taking care of these animals, i'm always there with a smile!

[Rugerlvr]

I don't find big game all that appealing. Deer, Elk, etc. I would gladly shoot nuisance varmints, and I'd like to go pheasant hunting someday. Other than that, I avoid shooting anything living.

[leathermanwave]

I won't shoot bald eagles, whooping cranes, and spotted owls.:)

[Vern Humphrey]

I won't shoot bald eagles, whooping cranes, and spotted owls.
Man, you're missing some good eating!:p

[eliphalet]

Never ceases to amaze me the fella's that come to hunting forums and impose their personal or "what we have read" code of ethics, which if you do not fit into close enough to suit them, your not a "true" hunter and fit into a slob or Fudd category or some other such nonsense.

We hunt because we love it, not necessarily for food, to remove vermin, or to please anyone, but for the hunt itself, which if you don't understand I am in no way able to describe it for you, and doubt you'd understand anyway.

[btucker1947]

McGunner nobody can beat that one LOLO:D

Back to the subject , rabbits , squirrel , Oh yea fried in the pan UMMM
Deer , but the same as everyone else . If I shoot it I eat it.

No killing just for the sake of killin. I let a cougar go, because I didn't know how to cook it.

[freakshow10mm]

I mostly kill for meat. Certain animals simply get shot on site, such as coyotes and fox. Especially coyotes. I absolutely hate coyotes and kill one every chance I get.

[Flyin Ashtrays]

only a non-attacking dog. and if i ever get that Sabre-toothed Jackalope in my sights...:scrutiny:

[ronwill]

We hunt because we love it, not necessarily for food, to remove vermin, or to please anyone, but for the hunt itself

I couldn't agree with you more, you should hunt for the love of it. I thoroughly enjoy wild hog hunting. Tracking, locating and making the kill is something I believe is part of what we are. I also believe we shouldn't forget to respect the wildlife and the land.

[clemsonu0219]

no humans...

[stevereno1]

I wouldn't hunt a bear. I'd kill a bear if I had to, but I wouldn't hunt one. I also let won't kill bobcats or foxes. My personal preferrance.

[ExSoldier]

I'll kill anything in defense of myself or my loved ones. But I won't hunt any animal that I can't make a tasty meal of.

As Ted Nugent says: Gotta kill it to grill it!

[jimbob86]

I grew up on a small farm, and was brought up to kill any animal that was a pest- if it competed with man for food or territory, it was THE ENEMY. Coyotes, coons, rattlesnakes, rabbits, crows, grackles, house sparrows, woodpeckers...... bullsnakes were not killed unless you actually caught them eating eggs, as they did a better job controlling rattlesnakes than we did..... song birds were off limits, and kingbirds and barnswallows were seen as allies, as well.

[esq_stu]

I do not hunt. If survival is at stake, I'll kill for food to survive and the main criterion will be safety (my health), economics, and convenience. Cuteness is not a factor.

If survival or safety is not at stake, I will not kill any animal. Killing animals for food I leave to the slaughterhouse.

My guns are for predators that would do me harm, whether two legged, four legged, or otherwise..

[Thernlund]

I don't hunt. That said, I'd shoot anything given the right circumstances.

But... I wouldn't shoot William Shatner. No matter what.


-T.

[cowssurf]

Unless it were for survival or food, I wouldn't kill anything. As a boy scout I once killed a number of chipmunks. I still feel bad about it and it's been almost 20 years. I don't hunt. I keep guns for personal defense and for fun at the range. That said, I have no problems with those who hunt for food. I like a good steak as much if not more than most. I'm not a hypocrite. I just don't really want to hunt.

[cowssurf]

"Even today, the natural mortality rate for dove and quail approaches 80%."

I thought the mortality rate for organisms on earth was 100%.

[Thernlund]

"Even today, the natural mortality rate for dove and quail approaches 80%."

I thought the mortality rate for organisms on earth was 100%.

Natural mortality rate. That is, death from natural causes, as opposed to being shot.


-T.

[308win]

Not to pick nits but I believe you are really refering to the annual mortality rate as the actual mortality rate of living organisms is 100%.
Life expectancy: 70-80 percent of all newly-hatched doves do not live one year (i.e., for every 100 hatched in a summer, only 20-30 will live to breed the following summer). If a juvenile survives its first year, the attrition slows: adults have a 50 percent mortality rate. Average annual mortality for a stable population is estimated at 60 percent - PA Game Commission
In the AAES study area, population changes usually appear as long, slow, continuous declines in the number of adult birds over the course of a year (see Figure 1). Stated simply, for every 100 birds alive on November 1 of one year, only 20 will still be alive on November 1 the next fall. This translates into an 80% mortality rate, or what is referred to as an 80% “turnover rate.” The timing of this mortality is important. In the AAES study area, there appeared to be no single period with an unusually high mortality rate. This property averages carrying 60% of the birds through the end of the hunting season (February 28) and usually still has almost half the birds alive when nesting begins in late April. A “textbook” 20% of the fall population is still around the following fall. While this has long been considered a “normal” survival curve, recent research around the country has not backed this up. Auburn University's Albany Area Quail Management Project

recent research around the country has not backed this up. The study indicates less carry-over resulting from several factors such as hunting harvest, milder weather, quality of cover.

[cowssurf]

Before anyone gets too carried away, my crack about the 100% mortality rate was just that, a crack. I was only trying to make a joke and nothing more.

[qajaq59]

Snakes..... I figure anything that eats bugs, mice, and rats should be left alone to do just that.

[PercyShelley]

Interesting thread. Sounds like this is an intensely personal thing.


Myself, I couldn't kill birds of prey, primates, sirenians, cetaceans or elephants.

Elephants? I understand the need for proper population control of elephants, especially in places where they're beginning to make themselves a nuisance to humans. Pretty sure I couldn't squeeze the trigger, just the same.

Cetaceans? I like to eat what I hunt, and I have this gripping fear of mercury poisoning. Again, I understand that in some cases, hunting of cetaceans may be an appropriate population control measure, knee-jerk reaction of certain under informed "environmental" concerns aside. Again, I couldn't pull the trigger, although those harpoon guns are pretty cool.

Sirenians? Well, to me that's just like clubbing a puppy to death. Pretty sure it will never come up, since I'm unaware of any sirenian populations that need their numbers brought down (sadly).

As for primates, unless they mean me harm, I would be rather upset at the thought of killing them and doubly so at eating them.

And killing birds of prey is just low-rent. Good heavens, it used to be that birds of prey were the means by which men hunted!

[plexreticle]

Penguins and Sea Turtles are on my no shoot list.

[DKA]

I was brought up, if you shoot you get it and eat it, guess if it meant survival would eat almost anything.

[scythefwd]

well, pretty much anything is game, but I only hunt deer. I will kill poisonous snakes if they are near my house, and I will kill animals known to carry rabies if they are near my house, else they get a free pass from me.

[roscoe]

I only kill what I eat, except in self-defense.

[Thernlund]

I only kill what I eat, except in self-defense.

I'd eat something I shot in self defense. Why waste it. :D


-T.

P.S. I do know what you meant though. ;)

[ara27499]

I thought the mortality rate for organisms on earth was 100%.
And therefore the leading cause of death is birth.:D:D

ara27499

[phantomak47]

I would not and can't understand why anyone would want to hunt
Giraffes , just about everything else in Africa is fair game.

[Scratchy]

Puppies, Kittens, and snakes that leave me alone.

[308win]

I only kill what I eat, except in self-defense.

Then what do you do, eat it alive?:-)

[cooch]

Please number me amongst those who would hunt just about anything as long as it was (a) Not an irresponsible reduction of the breeding population, and (b) Fun.

Recreational hunting is about enjoyment, and there is nothing wrong with that.

Peter

[Water-Man]

bear - wolf

[Claude Clay]

cause 20 attend the funeral and 10 stay.


i do my hunting at stop & shop
stalking the wild tufo....a slippery adversary

..........clean up in aisle 2