[Girlwithagun]

Due to a pestering husband (hehe), I have decided to purchase my very own handgun for target shooting and home defense. I have decided I would like a 9mm since I don't want an intruder to laugh in my face when I come out with a .22 and a .40 is a bit much for now- I'll work my way up.

I am a medium sized girl but I like big guns;) . I feel uncomfortable holding smaller guns and I like a bit of room underneath my hands.
I have been to the range a few times and have narrowed down my search to 4 guns. Any opinions as to which I should pick? I would tend to just go with the least expensive since they all feel about the same to me, but my husband says that's a no-no. On a side note, I really wanted a Ruger but I tried a 95, 94, and 89 and they all jammed up more than a couple times in just the five rounds I shot through each one.

Here are the guns I am deciding between. Opinions?

(all in 9mm)
Walther P-99
Glock 17 or 19
Beretta Cougar or Vertec
Taurus 92

[braindead0]

Do you intend to seriously practice self defense? Or is that home defense usage just an afterthought?

The reason I ask is that unless you are prepared to practice failure drills a lot, a semi-auto probably isn't the best choice. I'm not suggesting that semi-auto's fail a lot, just that when they do you have to know what to do in order to clear them.. and that takes practice.

That being said, my Wife loves her Glock 17 (and she has small hands, but it still fits) and I've had excellent luck with my Taurus PT92 (1500 rounds and only one hickup, due to bad ammo failing to chamber).

Personally I think the Beretta's are a bit overpriced..

Just my 2cents...YMMV

[cslinger]

Well at least two of those are favorites of Sheslinger.

She loves her P99 and it has been stone reliable. All are good guns. I am not a big Taurus fan but those Beretta copies seem to run as good as the original.

[Skunkabilly]

Are you mechanically inclined? I find that some new shooters (men or women) respond differently to the number of controls on the gun.

I have small hands but can work around a grip well, I love my Beretta but if you can't can't manipulate the controls, look elsewhere.

[Raz]

Well, I would suggest trying a service (4" bbl) model Springfield XD9.

Mine is incredibly reliable, durable, fairly light, easy to strip and maintain, and is a chunk-full in the hand (especially with a Handel grip sleeve). Very stable platform and a lot of fun to shoot.

Like I said, it's a bit chunky ... but if you don't like little guns you may like this one. Of course, if you want BIG ... I suppose you could go for the tactical model...


-Raz

[Kalrog]

That experience with the Ruger is a bit strange! They have the reputation for being the tanks of the gun industry - ugly and relatively large, but will feed anything and go bank when you pull the trigger. And you had this happen with multiple P-series guns... was there anything that was constante that could have caused the problem (like using the same magazine in each gun and it was an (unknown to you) bad mag)?

If the Rugers fit your hand the best, and you aren't going to try to CCW the pistol (they have a rep for also being more dificult to conceal because of the size/shape/weight), then that might be the way to go. Especially with the price being as low as it is. Just try and figure out what was wrong with those guns because that sounds a bit fishy.

I would agree with your husband that price is the last concideration when picking out a self defense weapon, especially when the cost of ammo will shortly be more than the cost of the gun. But if all of the 9mm autos feel good and are quality products with a reputation for support and functionality, then having price as the final determining factor isn't such a bad idea.

Don't overlook revolvers though (don't know if you have even tried them yet). If you like the 9mm idea, I would probably have you look at some .357Mag handguns and shoot mostly .38Spc. That way when you get more comfortable or just want a change you can load it up with +P rounds or even all the way to full mag rounds and just have a blast (pun intended)! I like the GP100 for home and probably the SP101 for CCW - depending on size. There is something nice about knowing that your firearm will take anything you can throw at it and ask for more (that whole tank reputation with Rugers again).

[rappa]

Either Glock is a good choice (have an 11 yr old G19 that still throws bullets downrange and spits out the brass without fail).
Don't know much about the Walther except that everyone who has one likes it.
Beretta is okay too (had a Beretta 96 Centurion .40 traded it towards a SIG P229).
Taurus - friend has a Taurus DAO 9mm. The few times I've shot it, it was fine, but I didn't like the DAO and the sights sucked, no bar, dots, outline, nothing! It was like my dad's Remington Rand 1911!
The Springfield XD seems to be a good pistol and priced right.
Did you rent a Ruger or shoot a friend's? Rental guns don't get the TLC that they should thus resulting in poor performance. I had a P85 that was pretty flawless. It was just chunky, ugly and heavy, but did not malfunction at all. Give Ruger another chance. They're pretty reliable pistols and priced right (they have a $40 rebate going right now).

Just my $.02 since you asked. Good luck.

[Berg01]

Sounds like your short list would be a good start; I have heard the Walther P99s are good, I know the Glock 19 and the Beretta Vertecs are very good; I'd also throw the Sig P225, P239 and P228, the Smith & Wesson 908 and 910, and the CZ P-01 into the mix;

Of these guns I would venture a guess that the Glock 19, S&W 910, and the Sig P239 9mm would be the ones that you would most likely be able to rent at a local range (YMMV); shoot the ones that you can, and them take your pick.

[Waitone]

I second the advice for a Glock 17. That's what my daughter picked out when she purchased. It is as reliable as any slide gun out there. No external controls, just point and pull the trigger.

I also second the advice to consider a revolver. Ruger in SP or GP series is a freakin' tank. S&W and Taurus are brands to consider. A 9mm is comparable to a .38 spl // .357 mag in size. .38 spl and 9mm are close in performance and both are relatively cheap to shoot. Both come with personal defense ammo which will be important for defensive applications.

A revolver can be found at a price less than a slide gun. Go to the revolver forum and read the floater on how to pick a used revolver if you're inclinded that direction.

In any case break your decision down to two handguns then shoot them both. That way you'll find out what your hand and eye likes.

[MikeJ]

After 20 years of handgun shooting I have become a firm believer in letting the handgun pick you rather than you or someone else picking the gun. All of the options that you listed are more than acceptable, but what feels right to me may not work well for you at all. I too am wondering why the Rugers gave you so much trouble, it could quite possibly be that you were limp wristing the guns resulting in the jams. My opinion is that you need to try out several more of your choices and see if the jamming problem continues or if one of these or something else just "calls" to you. If you continue to have jamming problems with other pistols I would strongly suggest that you look at a revolver in .357 as your first gun. As mentioned, you can shoot .38's out of them and there are many models to choose from. I stick with S&W and Ruger when it comes to revolvers and with a wide variety of aftermarket grips you can really make it fit you nicely. Best, Mike

[Oleg Volk]

All good choices. Pick the one which fits your hand better: which requires least adjustments after grabbing, which points more natuaraly, on which you can reach controls without shifting your grip.

I would also HIGHLY recommend a .22 conversion kit (http://www.olegvolk.net/newphotos/aack/) for the gun. Useful for learning trigger control, for learning point shooting cheaply and for plain fun...and later for teaching others. I shoot several rounds of .22 per round of 9mm in my G17.

I admit to a bias towards the guns with consistent trigger pulls. Of the guns you named, Glocks fit that requirements, and the P99 can fit it if you don't manually decock, Taurus can fit it if you use cocked and locked option. Also, check availability of un-crippled magazines (P99 would be most costly, others are cheaper and easier to find).

Also, if Ruger malfunctions were from limp-wristing, then maybe guns with light frames and heavy slides (pretty much all four which you named, but Glocks and P99 more so) aren't the best choice...at least P99 and Glock bore axis are lower than on Rugers, making limp-wristing less likely.

[Keith]

Get the .22 first and the larger caliber later!

If you don't have a .22 you'll never practice enough to get really good with a larger caliber.

I can't emphasize that enough to a new shooter. For ten dollars you can put 500 rounds of .22 down range in an afternoon. To do that with a centerfire caliber would cost you about $100 and you'd likely walk away with an ingrained flinch that will be difficult to overcome. The best shooters are the ones who put the most rounds downrange - and the ones who do that own a .22!

It's all in the training.


Keith

[mattk]

Dont forget the Browning Hi Power. Great for little hands. So is the Kahr T9

[kalibear45]

Glock 19

[toddler]

I bought a G22 for my first gun. Great bedside safe gun, otherwise mostly useless to me. Too big to carry. Then I got a Kahr K9, Ok size to carry, but a bit heavy. Now I want a 642 with the larger laser grip on it. Small enough to carry, light enough to carry, will fire any .38 reliably. Wish I'd got the MK9 instead of the K9 too.

If you had jams in 3 Rugers, and it wasn't a mag problem, I'd have to guess limp wristing. That would lead me to a wheel gun. Even if it's just with several semi-autos, it could happen at that bad time with any of them, so why risk it. Sounds like your husband has some you can borrow when you feel like it, so get a gun that you can carry with you if you ever decide to. I understand the grip thing, but I'll bet if you borrow a J and shoot only 25 rounds for 3 or 4 sessions, you won't feel it's too small. May not be a G17 grip, but unless you're wearing a duty belt, the G17's about as useful as my G22 for ccw.

Of your choice list, I'd say G19. As far as 9mm vs .40, I don't think the felt recoil is really different, just the sound. Try a G30, .45 is for me easier than 9mm I've discovered (too late), because the "boom" is less bothersome than the "crack".

Have fun,

Todd

[Penforhire]

Spend some time holding each one. The P99 comes with three backstraps to change its size AND the front sight is replaceable for height. Light weight. You can tell which one I like.

The Vertec and 92 are too big for my taste.

Hmm, I would have also recommended a wheel-gun before an auto for a first-gun. And a .22 too, even though its defense use is limited.

[terlingua]

Glock 19

[Baba Louie]

Any one of the four (or five) listed will do you well.

IS weight an issue? Would you ever carry it or will it be just a house and/or range gun?

Can you actually picture yourself using it against another human in defense of your life or the lives of you family? I assume yes to that one.

If you ever do have to, it'll be fast and furious, probably dark... don't want to be fumbling with safetys or catching it on clothes.

Then again, if target shooting is desired, better sights (or after market replacements) might be a factor in determining selection and they're usually not snag free.

Shoot them with both strong and weak hand.

Narrow it down to 2 choices.

Plan on shooting a couple of wally world 100 rd boxes through each. Buy your favorite of the two. Buy some spare magazines, a holster or zippered pillow case, cleaning stuff, snap caps and more ammo.

Find out which loads it likes and dislikes (you could try several brands of ammunition during the 2-gun test in lieu of, or in addition to the 100 rd box of cheap stuff if you're rich).

Practice dry firing.

I'd like to try the Walther some day, but I've got the other three covered and enough other 9mm guns that... one more wouldn't hurt... would it?.

For an interesting experience shoot an all steel CZ-75 after shooting a polymer framed 9mm and see if you wonder where the recoil went? Heavy to carry, but that weight (and other design/mfg factors) kinda help many CZ owners to shoot them with confidence and accuracy... such a heavy gun for such a little bullet :D in todays world of smaller, lighter nines.

Don't forget the accessories.

Adios

[Stevie-Ray]

I'd go with the Glock 19. When you want to carry, you'll then want a 26. :D

[modifiedbrowning]

I recommend the Walther P99, it was my first pistol.

[4v50 Gary]

I recommend trying more pistols and seeing what feels good for you, handles well, and you feel comfortable with.

[slh02]

Hello. First, its great to see another Marylander on the board. Seems like we have a lot of members for such an anti-state.

Second, while it is hard for me not to come out and say "Get the P99!!!" (it was my first handgun and it is great; not a single malfunction in over 2k rounds), you should really get what feels best in your hands. All of your choices are quality handguns so you cant really go wrong with any of them.

While I may catch some flack from other member for saying this, if you want the beretta or walther, you really need to act now. Those two guns will soon no longer be available new in Maryland due to our current gun restictions (they do not have a built in lock). Prices are only going to go up on these models due to lack of supply. The prices for Beretta's are already crazy ($499 for a heavily used model 92 at On Target).

My Walther P99 is honestly the only one I have seen anywhere. The gunshop it came from has not had one in since and will no longer due to the current law.

[PeteyPete]

G17....but if you plan on getting a CCW, you might want to look at the G19.

You also can't go wrong w/ a XD-9 or Walther P99...it all comes down to what feels most comfortable in your hands.

[only1asterisk]

What Oleg said!

My wife compared all the handguns on your list recently and a few more. She chose the Springfield XD. I think fullsize guns are the best to learn on. The 9mm is a good choice. .22's are great for learning, but there is nothing wrong with learning with a 9. Lock those wrist and give those rugers another go. If you have trouble limp-wristing autos, consider a revolver. There is no shame in them (and in some circles instant repsect).


David

[gulogulo1970]

Glock 17 is a great gun. It's has little less snappy recoil than the model 19. My 5' 2", 60 year old Mom loves her Glock 23. Glocks work and they are easy to shoot well.

[Preacherman]

Of the guns you list, my first choice would be (and is! :D ) the Glocks. I prefer the 19 to the 17, but that's just my "feel" for the gun - if you prefer the 17, go for it. The Walther would be my second choice.

I second Oleg's opinion about the .22 conversion unit. These are available for the Glocks, but I don't know about the other guns on your list. They make a wonderful "second gun" out of the major-caliber "primary" gun, and practising becomes much, much cheaper! :D

[anapex]

The jams she had with the Rugers wasn't from limp wristing, They were all range guns. The experience has still left a sour taste in her mouth. I've already hinted at some pistols she should look strongly at especially since they'll be rarer soon in MD, the P99 being one of them since we already have one in .40 (she doesn't like the felt recoil of that though). We have a couple .22s already so she'll be able to practice with those. Revolvers also just haven't "felt right" for her. I appreciate everyone helping her out though, no matter how much I try to train her she just doesn't believe me until someone else tells it to her ;)

[Paladin7]

From your initial post, you said you wanted the gun for target and home defense.

For a first gun, I would put home defense above target shooting in order of priority.

Prior to looking into which gun(s) to buy, I would ask myself a few questions;

1. What is your "threat profile"?

What is meant by this is what type of crime is prevalent in your area? What could you reasonably expect to encounter? You can find this information by researching crime statistics (especially trends) in your local area.

2. What is your experience level with handguns?

If the answer to this question is, this will be my first handgun and you have no formal training or experience, then I would STRONGLY suggest a .357 magnum revolver. The revolver is safer to operate, easier to maintain, and versitile in that you have a choice in two effective calibers .38 and .357. It will also be a great gun to learn on and improve your skill.

Also, I would recommend you get at least an NRA basic gun safety course and take a more advanced shooting course like Mas Ayoob's LFI-1, which will cover both the legal and the mechanical aspects of shooting.

Lastly, I want to commend you for your interest in guns and shooting and for exercising your 2nd Amendment rights.

Best Regards,

Paladin7

[Ala Dan]

Greeting's And A Big Ole' Hearty Welcome To THR-

From your list, it would be hard to beat the Glock 19;
however, please let me offer a couple more suggestion's?:uhoh:
Of course, these choices are SIG's, so get ready
to up the annie!:D First, for persons with small hands
there's the P225; a single-stack 9m/m that has
a huge following, in both the civilian world and as a
GERMAN police sidearm. Then there is MY favorite, the
P228; a double-stack (14-shot) 9m/m with the
U.S. military designation M11. In use by several federal
agency's, including the U.S. Army C.I.D., Naval Investigative
Services, Bureau Of Printing & Engraving and other's.
It's also a favorite of many police agency's throughout
the U.S.A. Then, somewhere in between there is the
P239; dang near as large as the P225/P228,
but still an excellent performer. One thing you get
with SIG's is Extreme Reliability; and to
me that is the most important factor in choosing a
sidearm for personal defense, or home defense!:)
SIG's are excellent performers on the range as well;
as I have carried a .45 caliber P220A since 1988,
and NEVER-EVER experienced a problem with it.

Best Wishes,
Ala Dan, N.R.A. Life Member

[Girlwithagun]

Thank you all for your help! And despite what ANApex says, I DO listen to him *snicker*.
Now that I am officially a member of On Target, I'll be seeing some of you Marylanders out there! I'll be the girl with a gun! (Ok, I'm corny sometimes too).

[Trisha]

I'd recommend the Glock or the Walther, as either have good ergonomics and wonderful track records!

I'd also like to suggest you look into some diversified instruction, if I may:

http://www.aware.org/

Be safe, and have fun!

Trisha

[Soap]

My wife has found the best success with a 5" 1911. She does not carry it however.

[Spot77]

GWAG, trust me, you won't be the only girl at On Target. There's always a few there when I go, and there's a couple of nice ladies that work there.

Sorry about your Ruger experience....since they were rentals I can assume you used the same box/type of ammo in all of them...maybe that had soemthing to do with it. I feel the same as you though; once soured on a gun it's hard for me to change my opinion. Had a bad experience with a Walther PPK and now I won't look twice at them....

You guys should really plan on attending the next Maryland THR Shoot....Chaim and I pm'd about it today...It's a great chance to shoot a LOT of different guns....especially 9mms. Norton's HK USP9 (I know you said it's out of your price range, but still fun to shoot), Chaim's CZ75 (SWEET shooter), you can try my Ruger P95 (500 rounds so far and not a single hiccup). Plus all of the revolvers. .380's, 22's, 45's and so on.

[BHPshooter]

*Uh-oh, here comes Wes. We all know what he's going to say.* :rolleyes:

You really ought to look at a Browning Hi Power. Mine has 1709 rounds through it so far. No problems at all. Definitely worth a look, especially if you want a 9mm.

Hi Caps are also easy to come by. What other gun can you get 17-round mags for 19 bucks?

Good luck.
Wes

[jercamp45]

Oleg said it best!
It the Glock fit your hands, of the ones mentioned I would buy it...AND a ceiner .22 conversion unit for ALOT of cheap practice of sight alignment and trigger pull, using your defensive gun.
The Glock is dirt simple and will last forever. And you have the added benefit of having options for smaller Glocks for CCW using the same trigger.
Full capacity mags are available($$$) and I think I'd get the newer model with the rail inserts so I could mount a M3 light, if I so desired(nice for HD!!)
would stick with the 115 to 124 grain JHP for self defense...Miami PD was using the 147 gr subsonic for awhile...and their 'round count' per stop went way up. Makes the Nine a 10(or 17!!) shot .38

.02
Jercamp45

[Wedge]

I wanted an autoloader for my first handgun. However, every time I went looking at guns my preference moved back in time more and more until I finally ended up with a Ruger Blackhawk in .45 Colt. It is blued, it fits my small hands (for a guy, they are pretty much the same or a little larger compared to a lady) very well and I like making big holes in paper and hunting. After buying one, I have to say I am hooked on SA's.

When looking I liked the way that the SIG P229 felt in my hands. However, I did not fire one, and it was out of my price range so I can't report on it much more.

[Black Snowman]

I'll throw in for Glock or P99, whichever you feel more comforatable with. As mentioned the Glock has a 22 conversion kit available for it but 9mm military surplus would be almost as cheap and when you throw in the price of the kit doesn't really seem worth it to me. Plus with crappy surplus ammo more chances to do failure drills under real conditions ;)

[Frohickey]

Sig P239

[Black Snowman]

I just re-read the title of the thread "HOW TO CHOOSE?"

OK, here is how I choose. I narrow down the guns to the ones with the features I want (as you appear to have already done). Then I do everything in my power to try those guns out and see which one points most naturally for me and has good ergonomics. Things like sights I put a lower priority on because they can be changed later, if it's a perment feature and it's just "a little annoying" that's a big negative in my book.

Another gun you my want to try if the Glock or P99 don't seem to fit the bill you might want to look at the Steyr pistols. I REALLY like their sights and the grip and I REALLY don't like the sights on the Glock (I've since replaced them on the 1 Glock I own).

I hope that helps you come to a decision :)