No CCW @ gunshow?!?!?


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TarpleyG
January 12, 2003, 04:05 PM
***? I go to the FTL gunshow and meet two friends out front, right? Upon entering (after they robbed me of $3 for parking in a field) I noticed signs everywhere that state "No loaded firearms" whatsoever, even CCW. Now, this is my first gunshow and had I not been with two other guys, I would have turned around and walked out and still never seen one. I doubt that I could've gotten my $3 back for the parking anyway. Well, I had my gun like I always do and decided to go in anyway. Nobody made me and I would have been suprised if they had anyway. Concealed means concealed.

My rant is this (don't give me the BS about it being private property and they have the right... blah, blah, blah. That's not the point), if the guys selling the guns don't trust us to carry them then why should anyone else? I would expect that in this type of environment that carrying would be accepted. Guess not. I won't ever go again, not to mention they charged $7 to get in and all they had was a bunch of tupperware, beef jerky, and plastic knives for terrorists to buy.

Anyone else feel the way I do?

GT

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MitchSchaft
January 12, 2003, 04:08 PM
That's policy at every gunshow in America. It's for insurance purposes.

P95Carry
January 12, 2003, 04:30 PM
If it's policy then, the last 2 I went to last year in PA were lax with notices .... didn't see one anywhere ... and carried anyways! Concealed - of course.!:p

OF
January 12, 2003, 04:38 PM
I take my direction on policy here from the President of the United States: Don't ask, don't tell. Thankyouverymuch.

- Gabe

answerguy
January 12, 2003, 04:46 PM
This was debated very devisively on a Michigan gun board. The insurance excuse is just that, an excuse. How do you tell a retail store that you're not going to frequent them because of their no-CCW policy when a gun show does the same thing?

larry_minn
January 12, 2003, 05:32 PM
If not being held in a National Guard Building or school I carry.

larry_minn
January 12, 2003, 05:40 PM
If not being held in a National Guard Building or school I carry.

Redlg155
January 12, 2003, 05:45 PM
Same thing at the Pensacola show.

I would bet that half the dealers are packing heat somewhere.

I decided to just "declare" my carry gun anyway just in case. If It takes me 1/2 second to break that silly zip tie they put on them if I needed it. Loaded mags just go into my pocket.

For me it's kinda hard to carry a .45 and not get "made". :D

Good Shooting
RED

stans
January 12, 2003, 06:22 PM
All the gun shows I have been to in Richmond, VA do not allow loaded firearms, concealed or not, inside the buildings. You are allowed to have a firearm checked at the door and have a nylon strap placed around the weapon in such a fashion as to render it unfireable. I really do not feel that I need a CCW at a gun show. There is a strong police presence by officers that frequently show great interest in firearms and shooting (nice to see) and I have not heard of any assaults or robberies at these shows. In Virginia, owners of private property can stipulate that no concealed firearms are allowed. A violation will result in the loss of a CCW permit at the very least.

Jason Demond
January 12, 2003, 06:49 PM
I carry everywhere that's not mentioned in MI's CCW law. I pay no attention to signs! My local dealer just put up a no carry sign a couple months ago, I pretend I don't see it evertime I go in, not to buy anything.:evil:

benewton
January 12, 2003, 06:52 PM
We had that in NH a couple of years back, two mom march or something b*tching about how come nobody can carry at a GUN SHOW!

Bottom line here is, no more!
No signs, and so forth, so I merely wander through, armed with whatever weapon the season demands.

And, so, for a change the TMM (two mom's march) has done some good, although I doubt they'd be especially appreciative of the outcome.

'course, we still have the couple of morons, with signs, marching around out front, hoping for TV cameras, I guess...

Just once, I'd like to walk up, pull the USPCc .40, and ask them just how commited they were...

I won't, of course, but I can dream, can't I?

The Reaper
January 12, 2003, 07:05 PM
I think we all know why gun shows are usually posted with no CCW or no loaded firearms on the premisis.

IDIOTS(tm) !!!!!!! :banghead:

You know the guys who pull their piece to show it to their buddy and violate one or more of the first three major safety rules.

Now since there is no way to ban IDIOTS(tm) we all get to suffer.:banghead:

The one that got me was the local range and gun dealer banned CCW in their facility by everyone except LEO's who were required to declare at the desk. :what:

That policy lasted less than a month.

sanchezero
January 12, 2003, 07:12 PM
If It takes me 1/2 second to break that silly zip tie they put on them if I needed it.

We had a goofy IDPAish stage where we started w/guns zip tied and had to run to cover where there were, coincidentally, wirecutters :D .

Removing the zipper added a considerable amount of time to e'ones score. I'd say from 7secs to over a minute (this guy got a chunk of plastic jammed in his gun and had to fieldstrip it haha:p ) went on everyone's score.

The targets were all w/in 10yds too :rolleyes: .

Was kinda fun tho...

AR-10
January 12, 2003, 07:24 PM
Most gunshows require you to check and unload all firearms before bringing them on premises, as a couple posters have already mentioned. They are trying to keep some braindead idiot from shooting you accidentally.

As I walk from table to table being swept by muzzles the whole time I am in the building, I like to think none of the firearms are loaded. News reports imply that this is wishfull thinking.

Some guy in Texas put a hole in the floor and the roof at a show the other day with an AR that was unloaded. Last year a thirteen year old kid got shot in the head with a revolver. NDs happen every year even with the "no loaded guns" policy. I for one am glad promoters try to keep these incidents to a minimum. Checking my weapon on entry seems like a small thing.

willp58
January 12, 2003, 08:36 PM
Myself and a collegue are attending the SHOT show in Orlando in February.
They emphatically state that NO GUNS ccw will be allowed.
Also all guns on display will have the firing pins removed..

I believe it's the PC reasoning behind this. Plus insurance.

Somehow at the biggest "gunshow" in the country, this doesn't seem right but why fight city hall?

johnhurd
January 12, 2003, 09:25 PM
I am with ya all the way, when the signs went up here in MI. I quit attending.

Boats
January 12, 2003, 11:03 PM
Heck, I went to a Beretta 950 Jetfire for any questionable venue where I still want to pack but don't want the hassle of hiding a duty sized pistol from prying eyes. If 8+1 .25 ACPs won't get me through a gun show or endure the Nutcracker, then it must be Chechen rebels taking the place over and my Champ or Officers wasn't going to get it done either. Sometimes a mousegun is the best compromise, especially when the mere prospect of the perp getting shot is itself enough to end most criminal attempts.

Boats
January 12, 2003, 11:04 PM
Heck, I went to a Beretta 950 Jetfire for any questionable venue where I still want to pack but don't want the hassle of hiding a duty sized pistol from prying eyes. If 8+1 .25 ACPs won't get me through a gun show or endure the Nutcracker, then it must be Chechen rebels taking the place over and my Champ or Officers wasn't going to get it done either. Sometimes a mousegun is the best compromise, especially when the mere prospect of the perp getting shot is itself enough to end most criminal attempts.

Boats
January 12, 2003, 11:05 PM
Heck, I went to a Beretta 950 Jetfire for any questionable venue where I still want to pack but don't want the hassle of hiding a duty sized pistol from prying eyes. If 8+1 .25 ACPs won't get me through a gun show or endure the Nutcracker, then it must be Chechen rebels taking the place over and my Champ or Officers wasn't going to get it done either. Sometimes a mousegun is the best compromise, especially when the mere prospect of the perp getting shot is itself enough to end most criminal attempts.

Boats
January 12, 2003, 11:06 PM
Heck, I went to a Beretta 950 Jetfire for any questionable venue where I still want to pack but don't want the hassle of hiding a duty sized pistol from prying eyes. If 8+1 .25 ACPs won't get me through a gun show or endure the Nutcracker, then it must be Chechen rebels taking the place over and my Champ or Officers wasn't going to get it done either. Sometimes a mousegun is the best compromise, especially when the mere prospect of the perp getting shot is itself enough to end most criminal attempts.

Midnight
January 13, 2003, 12:45 AM
Stans, do you know for a fact that you will have your permit revoked if caught carrying? I don't believe you will. Private property can stipulate no carry, but if you carry and are made, you are asked to leave...that's it. If you won't leave you can be cited for trespassing, but once again, your carry is legal. Let's not just jump to the conclusion that if you carry somewhere you're not technically supposed to that your CCW permit will be revoked.

Hkmp5sd
January 13, 2003, 02:17 AM
I think it is a reasonable safety precaution and since I don't want to leave my handgun in the parking lot, I will obey their rules. On occassion, whenever there is a long line at the table getting checked, I just go on in the show with my CCW.

One thing I do find interesting is at some gun shows, that ask that you leave the magazine (and bullets) at the check-in table or in your vehicle and get them when you leave. This is in addition to tywrapping the action open.

If I found someone inside the gun show that I wanted to shoot, you think I *MIGHT* be able to find a magazine and bullets somewhere inside the show to reload my handgun?:rolleyes:

larry_minn
January 13, 2003, 02:31 AM
I have been known to carry a loaded 45acp mag with me in building I can't carry in. Every third table has a 1911 on it. My pocket knife would make short work of tie and slam/clank/BOOM. Have heard them say no loaded mags but then they don't see them so no problem.
BTW many dealers at shows carry a loaded mag for pet gun on belt. (it is the one with a price $400 MORE then reasonable closest to them. :)

rick458
January 13, 2003, 02:48 AM
the Gunshows down here bring out the scariest people, and besides all the shows I attend down here are on City or County property so you do what THE MAN says

Lennyjoe
January 13, 2003, 04:19 AM
Most gunshows require you to check and unload all firearms before bringing them on premises, as a couple posters have already mentioned. They are trying to keep some braindead idiot from shooting you accidentally

I have to agree with AR-10 here.

Even though the majority of us know and abide by the 3 golden rules of gunhandling, others might not be so careful.

Better to be safe and have all weapons checked and safed with the preverbial tie strap than have guys walk in thinking they unloaded and accidently discharge the weapon. No need to give the anti's any more reasons right.

CCW is just that, Concealed. If its properly concealed you should be the only one that knows your carrying. Your the only one held responsible should you decide not to obey the posted signs.

Me, I just unload my CCW at my vehicle, put my loaded magazine in my back pocket and tuck in my shirt so the weapon is exposed. Get it tie strapped and shop away.

MitchSchaft
January 13, 2003, 04:35 AM
"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."
- Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759.

TheEgg
January 13, 2003, 12:09 PM
Even though I don't agree with it, I can sorta understand some of the reasoning behind no CCW at a gun show. What I don't understand is why some shows have even more and more stident signs saying "absolutely NO cameras". Any ideas on why this prohibition?

Double Naught Spy
January 13, 2003, 12:29 PM
No loaded guns at gunshows isn't about private property or insurance although insurance has become a real issue for some. No loaded guns at gunshows is because there are a bunch of idiot gun owners (some dealers fall here as well as it happened at on Dallas show) who don't have the faintest concern about whipping out their loaded gun in a gun friendly environment like a gun show to show somebody or to try to sell. Somewhere in the process, some idiot doesn't bother to check to see if the gun is loaded and pulls the trigger. All to often and for no productive reason, the same idiots aren't abiding by safe gun handling rules and end up shooting themselves or somebody else.

How many times have you found yourself in the sights of a gun being looked at by a customer while at a gun show? While not always at me, I see people scanning others in the crowd at EVERY gun show I have been to and it sucks. I've even seen them drop the hammer. Somewhere in going through the door, the idiots think that all guns are all unloaded at gun shows and that the safety rules need not apply since the guns are loaded and then they do stupid stupid stuff with the 'unloaded' guns.

I have been to a couple of shows where a large target is hung high on the wall at end end of the room and is the designated 'sighting' target. I think it is a great concept as people have a safe direction to point guns without pointing through the crowd. It isn't a perfect solution, but it helps reduce the risk of there being a really really stupid negligent (not accident) from occuring.

I popped a pistol skyward at own show that was being held two-handed by a Bubba and I happened to walk into his sighting spot which was apparently something across the isle. His comment to me was something like, "What, don't you trust me?" to which I replied, "NO, I don't even know you." Moron.

JohnBT
January 13, 2003, 12:53 PM
Amen to that.

I've been to 2 shows in 8 days and I'm tired of ducking and dodging idiots pointing guns in my direction. They should be tossed in the parking lot and not given a refund.

One man carrying a rifle around with a for sale sign on it started to say something when I grabbed the muzzle as it swung toward my face and jerked it straight up in the air over his head. He thought about and decided not to really tick me off.

John

Hkmp5sd
January 13, 2003, 12:56 PM
"absolutely NO cameras". Any ideas on why this prohibition?

Because they don't want to be on the front page of the newspaper or become VPC's newest poster child. Some guy wearing camo and playing with a tricked out 10/22 scares the sheep when they see it on the evening news.

St. Gunner
January 13, 2003, 11:27 PM
I carry to them most of the time, just depends on what I am planning on doing, if shopping for a new holster, I check the gun in and keep the mags in my pocket.

I was walking a show about a year ago when some cheeseball dealer who is one of the guys who offers you 1/4 of what something is worth then chastises you for not selling it to him, was looking at a Marlin lever action, I saw him point it straight at me and saw his finger taking the slack out of the trigger. I was about 20' away and saw the hammer fall. When I got next to the table the AH told me, "I killed ya 20' back", to which I took the Marlin from him, handed it to the owner and pinned him against the wall with my left hand while I had my right hand wrapped around his fingers twisting his arm around and then whispered some sweet nothings in his ear about the ailments he would suffer if he ever pointed a weapon at me again. Then I accidently smashed my heel into his foot, put all 230lbs behind it and walked away. I think he realized the importance of gun safety, I notice the last few shows I attended he has been very careful about muzzle control. I can honestly say that day I have never been so freakin mad in my entire life, somebody like that is supposed to be an example to the idiots, not an idiot.

I was just the other day thinking about not going to anymore shows, I get so sick of being painted with lasers, or looking to see somebody pointing various things at me. I missed the last two months because I just get sick of the garbage hauled there and the sellers who refuse to deal on things when they are $50 higher than the local dealers.

My gunshop is pretty liberal about CCW, shoot I sat on a stool and unloaded my carry gun and reloaded it with some fresh ammo just the other day, while I sat and talked for a couple hours, the rule is when you rack the slide or decock have it pointed into the floor and away from anyone in the store. Never been an AD in the store, but then I don't think just any customer gets to load and unload.

Another store had its insurance company demand the employees and owner be unarmed because of possible accidents. After an armed robbery at the store that cost the insurance company a huge chunk of money, everyone carries, including the patrons.

Woodchuck
January 14, 2003, 12:38 AM
Like what "Slick Willy" said "Don't ask, Don't Tell" . If they somehow find out, tell them you didn't see the sign, or can't see the sign without your glasses on, or you can't read or whatever . What they going to do ? Shoot you? In Michigan it's considered tresspassing and the owner (gun show) could only ask you to leave. So what!

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