[Focke-Wolf]

I keep hearing SAP is the ultimate etc. etc.

Recently, I've grown less fond of batons, while it has reach advantage, it seems that to take full advantage of it, you need to place the shots carefully with the tip etc.


what's your opininon on it? I train Krav Maga ish stuff as well and I feel like I can deliver MUCH harder blow with my shin kick to thigh than with a baton, but then I'd lose reach advantage.



see ya

[PTK]

http://www.gp.lib.mi.us/information/about/Tools/sledgehammer.jpg

:D

[theken206]

a baton is a force escaltor no more no less IMO.

a knife in one hand and a metal ASP baton in the other is pretty good combo IME.

I am QUITE fond of my sap though, hell of a short range weapon.

[hso]

You're going to have to define "powerful" for us.

A 4' maul is powerful to some.

A sap is powerful to others.

A baseball bat to others.

It's a question of what do you want to do with it and how you will use it.

[Stainz]

1. Concrete. Easily found - available.
2. Ball pein hammer... bonk bonk! ('Maxwell Silverhammer')

Stainz

[Dksimon]

I dont really care which is the most powerfull, I dont want to be hit with any!

[CZ.22]

Remember Austin Powers? Steam roller.

[Mandirigma]

I dont really care which is the most powerfull, I dont want to be hit with any!

+1 even in training. Owwie!

[theotherwaldo]

Automobile.

http://www.wreckedexotics.com/h2/h2_20040126_001.jpg

[alaskanativeson]

PTK's post reminded me of the end fight scene in the movie Streets of Fire (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0088194/) with Michael Paré and Willem Defoe. The movie is a cult classic and I guess I'm part of that cult. I think it's a fun movie (plus, I just love Diane Lane.)

It definitely depends on what kind of impact you're trying to make. Given the right pressure point my Sharkie Pen from Cold Steel will make a devastating impact. The old blackjack is still a formidable tool.

[Starter52]

The Asteroid.

60 million years later and still the impact king. :evil:

[RyanM]

Of the easily portable ones, I'd go with a blackjack.

[jgo296]

learn to punch properly impact knockout
nothing escalated to aggrevated

[Sans Authoritas]

I'm particularly fond of this little tool. Impact Kerambit. Provides a concentrated blow. You can hit whatever you want, as hard as you want. You could probably easily break a humerus, should someone else's poor choices force you to. It's discreet, non-metallic, and handy for carry in a back pocket.

http://www.force-ten.com/safety1.html#IK

-Sans Authoritas

[Rachen]

Two words. DA DAO

Here, see more:) http://chineseswords.freewebspace.com/custom4.html

[Coronach]

The Asteroid.

60 million years later and still the impact king.Interplanetary rocks FTW :D

[Funderb]

mosin nagant beats all!

[sm]

Another vote for Vehicles.

I prefer rear wheel drive, V8 engines, and believe in Weight to Horsepower ratio.
This has been a Non-Firearm weapon for me, and mine, and more than once.

Often over looked is Footwear, another useful non-firearm weapon, as the impact it has when evil is around, and the predator is no longer obtainable.
Good footwear allows one to get distance...

[Acheron]

+1 on the Mosin.


Club 'em with one end, poke 'em with the other.

[CWL]

Nah, the most powerful impact weapon is...Chuck Norris.

He's so tough, he clogs the toilet just taking a leak!

[LawofThirds]

Going to have to vote for Nun-chuck Norris.

It's chuck norris cloned and chained to the original chuck norris.

[Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow]

I was gonna say a baseball bat until I saw PTK's pic - I'll have to go with that maul. :)

[BattleChimp Potemkin]

Seriously, I carry a 8 pound sledge in my SHTF pack. It has many uses:
-Door locks
-anti-vehicle
-anti-face
etc...

The neat thing is, they are attempting to keep the weight down, but cant keep the idea of a hammer unless they lighten something else. For the tacticool crowd, there are a variety of poly-handle models with powdercoated black heads. I went traditional with a good ol' Craftsman. It slips into the sidepouch/tent pole keeper on my bag. You would be amazed how a few hours of practice and watching how you swing can make a maul/sledge an effective weapon. Just remember to make the hits you can (if used as a weapon) b/c you will be unblalanced after your swing. Its also interesting how such a heavy weapon with such a brutal multi-role requires so much finesse to handle properly (seriously, took me about a week to be accurate, swatting melons off the fence posts in the back yard, but training=tasty treat afterward :D Yum Melon!).

[sm]

ASP and other batons are not legal for me here.
Not to mention folks I run with, had problems with these not coming out, or staying in.
So some that are legal in ASP/Baton use, do not like, or even use them.

For them, being legal, they find the old fashioned tools of the trade still work best and afford a better way to conceal and blend in.
Some are in plainclothes, or Undercover, or civilians that have taken the training and certs to be legal to carry in certain job descriptions that allow these things, a regular civilian cannot.

In a court of law...one would be best to consider what perception one is going to give out in a court of law if matters ever get serious, and what their legal definitions are for them.

Go sit in on some Jury Trials if you can.
This is some of the most educational training a person can get.

If you have been involved in a case, even served on the Jury, you know of what I speak.

El Tejon calls this Problem 2