Opinions needed on non-1911 .45s


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mccook8
April 19, 2008, 01:33 AM
Considering getting a new .45.

Candidates:

S&W M&P .45
Springfield XD Tactical
HK USP
Sig P220
Glock 21SF

Who has experience with these, and what praises or curses can you direct at them?

Help me out here.

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LawofThirds
April 19, 2008, 02:05 AM
Have you thought about the FNP45 or the Sig 250?

Tom Fury
April 19, 2008, 11:21 AM
not 1911, 4506, 4566, 4516. 457 and variants?
Cheers, TF

The Lone Haranguer
April 19, 2008, 11:30 AM
I had one of those, a SIG P220. It was accurate and reliable. The newer single-action version of it is a very appealing gun.

not 1911, 4506, 4566, 4516. 457 and variants?
Agreed. Those are Smith & Wesson's older all-metal autos, also excellent guns. Most of the .45s are all steel and a little heavy for all-day CCW, but are accurate and extremely reliable and durable.

gcrookston
April 19, 2008, 11:33 AM
P220

jehu
April 19, 2008, 11:34 AM
Usp 45!

bannockburn
April 19, 2008, 12:51 PM
mccook8

SIG P220; the one I had was as accurate as a Colt Gold Cup I owned, and the SIG was much more reliable and durable.

Ghost Tracker
April 19, 2008, 12:54 PM
In that list...there's nothing to curse (dammit!). I've shot them all & owned most of 'em. Not a dud in the bunch. Happy Shopping!

Daryl Licht
April 19, 2008, 01:14 PM
Not familiar with most of those. I do have a P220 Sig though, and of those it's probably the only one I would personally consider, since I'm not a fan of the trigger on striker fired pistols. Many love them, however, and I can't fault them for it, it just doesn't work for me.

DawgFvr
April 19, 2008, 01:39 PM
I don't have one...but if I were in the market for a .45 ACP at the moment...I'd take a hard look at the Para CCW:

http://www.gunsandammomag.com/ga_handguns/para_0904/

I love metal and wood...and the smooth DAO is the final come-on.

Old Dog
April 19, 2008, 01:54 PM
Own or owned 3 of these 5, but have tested all 5 extensively ... for me, best ergos are: SA XD, SIG P-220, S&W M&P ... worst, by far: Glock 21, with the H&K USP not far behind (don't particularly like Glocks, but carry a USP on duty and would ... much rather not).

You should wring the most accuracy of the SIG and the H&K. As for reliability, they're all pretty proven (although the M&P doesn't have much of a track record, yet).

As for what Tom Fury noted, yeah, the S&W 4506 was one of my old favorite (non-1911) .45s, for sure ...

MCgunner
April 19, 2008, 02:08 PM
Think I'd go with the Sig if I could afford it. I prefer DA and like the decock set up on the Sigs. They are reliable and accurate, of course, as they should be for the price.

I don't care for safe actions, but I've thought some about the G36 for carry, anyway, just would have to get an 8 lb trigger on it for sure. I'm not comfortable with lighter on a carry. Now that the XDs have not only a grip safety, but a thumb safety option, I sorta need to research the choices there, though. Do they offer a 45 single stack comparable to the G36????? Of course, non of this paragraph relates to the OP as it does not say for CCW. If not for CCW, the Sig would be MY choice out of this list.

mccook8
April 19, 2008, 04:13 PM
am now the proud owner of a new .45 ACP (non-1911) pistol.

I did a side-by-side comparison of all those pistols, except the Sig P220 (looking for more magazine capacity). The USP was a compact, and I wasn't looking for a compact. Also, the trigger guard rubbed uncomfortable against the 2nd knuckle of my firing hand middle finger, just like the Glock does. So, the HK and the Glock went back in the case.

That left the XD and the M&P. Both felt good in the hand. Both had a decent sight radius.

Then I tested the trigger pull.

....and bought the XD.

Thanks for the input, guys.

Chilean
April 19, 2008, 04:26 PM
I really like my CZ 97B, accurate, 10 rounds and very well made.

bwavec
April 19, 2008, 04:42 PM
I have used the HK USP45 for a long time, and I like it for it's utter reliability, even with my sometimes sloven cleaning practices.

The Match trigger is a much better trigger than the stock USP trigger. I liked the gun even more with the Match trigger.

Some complain about the large grip size of the USP45. It fits my hands fine, but I have strong hands and somewhat long fingers, so for me it has never been an issue. But take the time to wrap your hands around one for yourself.

I think it is a great reliable gun that will handle a variety of situations and uses.

Also consider the newly released HK45. It does have a smaller grip size, but as a result you give up a few rounds of capacity. But it does come stock with a better trigger.

9mmepiphany
April 19, 2008, 07:38 PM
i've owned or extensively shot every gun on your list except the glock 21FS...but i have shot the Glock 30

BTW: the HK USP is being replaced by the HK45

i prefer to DA/SA for duty use and would rank the 220 just a hair over the HK45 just based on trigger feel...but the grips on the HK are fantastic.

of the others striker fired pistols i prefer to XD...mostly because it balances better for me

xsquidgator
April 19, 2008, 09:07 PM
I have an M&P45 and would recommend either that or a Springfield XD45. I like the XD also but the ergonomics on the M&P worked better for me than the XD did.

I just got a 1911 also and am getting used to it, however, perhaps because I'm still breaking it in, it's jammed FTF a few times with all kinds of ammo. I like the 1911 but my M&P has never malfunctioned that I can recall in something like 1500 rounds through it in the last year. There's certainly something to be said for modern plastic-framed pistols!

distra
April 19, 2008, 10:11 PM
I personally prefer the XD45, Glock 21, and Glock 36 as non-1911 .45ACP pistols.

wally
April 19, 2008, 10:44 PM
SIG P220R SAO.

Wonderful gun. Make mine cocked and locked if that first shot has got to count!

I have all except the M&P (which I have in .40S&W). I like the M&P best of the plastic guns, XD second, Glock distant last place (although I have the older 21, not the 21SF which does feel a tad better in my hand). The USP45 is nice but they are very high priced for a plastic pistol and they gouge on spare mags, but they make variants that do cocked and locked.

A sleeper that is steel framed is the EAA Witness Elite match -- about $500 and actually has a better trigger than my SIG SAO. Its also has 10+1 capacity and is what the CZ97 should have been.

--wally.

10-Ring
April 19, 2008, 10:47 PM
Hands down - no brainer - go w/ the HK USP 45 ;)

possum
April 20, 2008, 02:52 AM
i can comment on the xd .45's, what else can you say they are reliable, accurate, and they are at a great price, plus they are backed by a great comany. all in a packagae that is barely bigger than the 9mm and .40 models.

i don't like glocks in any other caliber than 9mm so that is out of the question for the 21 or 21sf.

also check out the ruger p345. they are inexpensive and they are accurate. they are 8+1 if that is a big deal to you. i can tell you this, that my p345 is the most accuarte handgun that i own or have ever owned.

roguejestyr
April 20, 2008, 02:54 PM
gratz on the XD purchase, the first handgun i ever bought is a XD45Compact.

misterwhipple
April 20, 2008, 03:21 PM
I'm really pleased with my XD. I shot half a dozen alternatives, including a Glock, a Sig, and an M&P, and I liked the XD the best.

One suggestion: If you decide to go XD, consider the Compact 5-inch. It has the same slide and barrel as the Tactical, but you can use either the short-grip, 10-round magazine or the 13-round extended-grip magazine (which gives the same size as the Tactical).

S&W620
April 20, 2008, 03:22 PM
Add one to the list for the HK.

My USP (in .40) is the most rock solid reliable, dead nuts accurate pistol I have ever owned.

I've owned an M&P (albeit a compact and in .40) but I wasn't overly impressed. YMMV. The .45 may be a different animal.

I've also owned a couple of Glocks. Great guns, but I prefer certain features (SA, manual safety, etc). The two examples I had were both boringly reliable. Generally excellent firearms.

DougDubya
April 20, 2008, 04:18 PM
The P220 and the USP 45 are the two with the best grip frames FOR MY PARTICULAR HAND.

No experience with the others, but the Glock 30, while feeling a bit fat, still has good trigger reach and "feel."

Yosemite**Sam
April 21, 2008, 03:30 AM
Yesterday I shot over 1000 rounds of 45 acp through a Smith & Wesson M&P trying to put it through the ringer. I was shooting Federal AE ball ammo and experienced my first malfunction at around 380 rounds and the gun was smoking hot. It was a failure to go into battery. Two more malfunctions at around 480 to 520 rounds. Both were failure to go into battery. I disassembled the gun and saw that it was dry and dirty. I cleaned the gun at this point and it went another 400 rounds before I again had a malfunction. It was another out of battery malfunction. Again I disassembled the gun and again it was dry and dirty. I continued to shoot the gun with no more failures. Out of 1000+ rounds fired I had 4 out of battery malfunctions and all occurred at 380+ round count after cleaning.

If I had to lay blame for the malfunctions, I would say they were caused due to a dry and dirty gun.

I wouldn't discount the M&P. It feels great in the hands. I think Smith & Wesson have out done themselves with this one.

denfoote
April 21, 2008, 04:11 AM
http://usera.imagecave.com/denfoote/RugerP97.jpg

Ruger P97.

None of the Sara Brady inspired "bells and Whistles"!!
Just a good solid .45!!

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