help with reloading 30-30


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Llywelyn
April 25, 2008, 07:17 PM
Hey everyone,

I am just getting into reloading and have been trying some lead bullets for my 30-30. They are 170 grain at a standard load.

I tried shooting a few tonight at 50 yard and they are all over the place. Most of the time they don't even hit the target, I am not an incredable shot, but I know I'm not missing by that much. A couple hit a foot to the left or right. At first I thought maybe the sights were out on the gun, so I fired a few factory rounds through just to check, they were dead on.

so I guess my question is, what is causing my bullets to "disapear" Are they not making it to the target? Are they loaded to hot? Is it possible for a gun to simply not like a kind of bullet.

Any suggestions would be welcome...so far the reloading thing hasn't worked out very well.


Thanks,
Llywelyn

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paperpuncher49
April 25, 2008, 07:58 PM
Lead bullets are very particular. You need to look in the bore to see if it is getting leaded. You didn't mention what kind of rifle you are using and how old it is. Inaccuracy can be caused by any numer of factors, but my first guess would be that the lead bullets are not properly sized to the bore of the rifle. Using the wrong powder can also result in poor performance. Finally, lead bullets are often more accurate at lower velocities, and you did not indicate if you are talking about a "starting" load or one that is getting close to the maximum load.

Llywelyn
April 25, 2008, 08:54 PM
Yes, I am using a starting load. and the gun is a '62 winchester 94 The bore was clean when I started.

I will try some lighter loads and see if I can get accuracy to improve. How do I know what the "right" powder is. In the book I have it lists a number of different powders for each bullet type etc. As long as the powder I have is on that list why wouldn't it work?

Llywelyn

dakotasin
April 25, 2008, 09:05 PM
cast loads in my 300 wsm are driving me up a wall... i am still getting it all sorted out, but it is looking like h-4895 driving a 170 cast bullet at 2000-ish f/s will be about right... i would expect this will be very close to what you want to do w/ your 30-30.

a light charge of 4895, and work up 1 grain at a time until you get to where you need to be (i started out at 20 grains of 4895 in my 300 wsm - probably won't be too far from where you want to start w/ the 30-30).

bore condition is critical. after you think the gun is clean, give it the barnes cr-10 treatment. when you get thru w/ that, some hoppes overnight will likely reveal your rifle wasn't nearly as clean as you thought. get it squeaky clean, then start over.

or, get some 150 sierras, winchester 748, and just forget the cast stuff. its easier, anyway.

Galil5.56
April 25, 2008, 10:23 PM
As mentioned, and from what you describe sizing could be too small, alloy not good for the velocity, and improper velocity (driven too fast). I never pushed lead slugs too fast (less than 1800 fps) when loading for the 30/30, and found 2400 and even Unique in proper charges pushing .310-.311" bullets with or w/o gas check according to velocity needs to be very accurate.

I really think if you fatten up the slugs a bit so that they are a good fit for your barrel (.002" over groove diameter), properly lube them, and keep velocities moderate, you will see a marked improvement. Good luck.

nicholst55
April 25, 2008, 10:42 PM
If you're serious about shooting cast bullets, by all means check out the Cast Boolits forum at: http://castboolits.gunloads.com/

Spend some time doing some reading, and I'll bet you'll learn a lot. I know I did.

With properly sized cast boolits, you should easily be able to get 1-2" groups at 50 yards. The trick is to use the proper alloy, lube, and powder.

SASS#23149
April 25, 2008, 10:52 PM
When I first started with cas boolits in my old Marlin,they were doing good to hit a very large berm,almot.
Then I got some copper cutter and REALLY cleaned the bore.It may have looked clean,but but it was not.
Some rifles dont mix lead and copper jacket well
It's a tack driver now with 170 LaserCast gas check bullets that I have.
Give the rifle a suiper duper cleaning job and see if it helps.

Jim Watson
April 25, 2008, 11:33 PM
As said, the barrel must be clean and the load should be light. I do not have the recipe at hand but I load .30-30 or even .30-06 with cast bullets only to .32-40 ballistics, 1200 fps or so.

qajaq59
April 26, 2008, 06:33 AM
What powder are you loading? And how much? If we know that, it would give us a place to start.

bglz42
April 26, 2008, 08:02 AM
My favorite load is 8 grains of Red Dot and a 170 plain base lead bullet. Very accurate, cheap to shoot and ultra low recoil.

Galil5.56
April 26, 2008, 09:14 AM
My favorite load is 8 grains of Red Dot and a 170 plain base lead bullet. Very accurate, cheap to shoot and ultra low recoil.

Interesting. I looked at a 1983 Hercules reloaders guide where I wrote in some Red Dot Data, and at the time I was using 7-8 grains of RD with a 150 grain cast as a super fun plinker load. Velocity would have been around 1300 fps. At the time I was shooting a lot of trap, so I just pinched powder from my 4 lb kegs. I experimented with and w/o fillers, and as I remember I found little difference.

Perhaps the original poster is using full bore jacketed data... *might* be one reason for his poor results?

Jim Watson
April 26, 2008, 09:24 AM
Yeah, you have to wonder about a "standard" load and what that meant to the OP.

I notice in reading Handloader magazine that Al Miller seldom has any trouble shooting cast bullets well over 2000 fps in most rifles. Stuff like that gives us mere mortals some funny ideas. Friend of mine shoots .30-06 Squibbs with 20 grains of 2400. Works fine with his hoard of linotype, but with pistol type alloys, 16 is about it.

GooseGestapo
April 26, 2008, 05:44 PM
I routinely use "standard" .30/30 data to load my cast "lead" bullets. However, I DO use a gascheck, and I DO size to .311" for my micro-groove barrel on my Glenfield/Marlin M30.

32.0gr of Reloader 15, or 30.0gr of IMR3031 give near MOA accuracy for 3-shots.

However, most of the commercially available cast bullets are .309" and don't have gaschecks. They're good only for about 1,600fps.

I too have shot a lot of 150-175gr bullets from my .30/06 and 20.0-25.0gr of #2400. But, those bullets are also sized to .311" and wear gaschecks.

The last I shot, the Lee 155-.311 Spitzer-gaschecks would shoot sub-moa for 3-shots. A deer hit in the shoulder/spine looked exactly as he would have looked if I'd hit him with a 150gr Sierra jacketed bullet.

So, I'd guess the problem is with the bullets.............. and removing the copper fouling from the barrel will help, too.

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