[CZF]

Hi Guys.

Thought I'd post my initial impressions on the new SP101 Spurless DAO .357 Mag.
http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/bb26/czrami/CZ%20SP-01%20PHANTOM/R357-8.jpg

I like the gun and Ruger company, but I don't think the gun liked me.


Some informal testing:
http://onfinite.com/libraries/1351196/905.jpg



Saturday, April 26th

Improvised shooting range. Washington state.

Distance: Approx 15 yards. Targets: 2 gallon water jugs.

I had never shot the gun before and it had been about 10 years since I last dropped the hammer on any revolver.
Modifications: Internal and outside polishing. No attention to the mainspring.

Load: Glaser 38+P Blue. (advertised velocity over 1,400 fps)

Two rounds toward the left target.

None of them impacted, as they both shot low and hit at the base of the rock.

Mild recoil but loud.


Next up:

The famous Remington 125 grain .357 magnum JHP.

2 rounds of the barn birner Remington that some people find to be the very best defensive load for
.357 carry. ( I believe the velocity is 1,450 for a 4 incher)

Both rounds impacted low. Massive muzzle blast and loud!


Next load:


Remington 38 Special +P ( velocity is around 950 I think)

5 rounds. All impacted low except the last. I held at the neck of the bottle.Target was hit and exploded with luckluster results.


Funny thing: I was aiming for the other target and hit the one next to it on the Right!


Load number 3.
http://onfinite.com/libraries/1351051/905.jpg
Double Tap Ammo's 158 grain Gold Dot JHP ( velocity is 1,400 fps from a 4 inch barrel)
More recoil than the Remington .357, but less than the 10mm Glock that I shot in March.

5 shots, all missed.

CUSSING and Reloading from Speedloader

5 more shots- Missed again.

By this time, I was having the Worst shooting session in my life!

The DAO trigger pull is smooth but heavy. You can see the results.

Because I was fighting with the trigger pull. I moved up to approx 7
yards.

5 more rounds with the 3rd impacting the water jug and spinning it off the
rock with an explosion of water.

I said. "Finally!" my camera person//better half just laughed.

I busted out 5 more rounds downrange in frustration, then put the
Ruger away for the day.

Unlike with the Glock, my hand didn't sting after the first few rounds, nor did it hurt after
20 rounds-until two days later.

http://onfinite.com/libraries/1351073/905.jpg

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Then i took my Stainless 75B and loaded her up with some Blazer practice ammo.

The targets were set up again as I did this.

My First shot was high, the next one hit the jug.

I then connected with the second one.

30 rounds later. I had experienced one FTE and cleared it, but made those jugs dance around and
felt a bit better.


Conclusion:

Nice gun with good ability to go from mild to wild in power, but the heavy DAO pull throws me off.
I should learn the master the gun, but really have no desire to do so.

A lighter spring might be in order- but I don't want to compromise reliability.

The gun, tax, and Hogue grips have cost me almost $500.

I feel that if I'd bought a Glock or CZ, even a Ruger 9mm. I'd be a lot happier.

This means that I'll stick with my autos, but will consider a Ruger SA (owned them before- loved them)
in the future.

[Siaharok]

I don't get it. I have the exact same gun. I've only fired two handguns in my life: a Ruger MKII, and my Ruger .357 SP101 DAO. I've had some training, but I'm obviously no expert. Anyway, my point is that even I can get decent groups at 7 or 15 yards.

It took me a while to figure it out. After firing a box and shooting low, the gentleman at the range took a look and decided that my gun is sighted "for combat", whatever that means. Basically, if I cover the target with the sight (rather than placing the target just above the sight), then it shoots where I want, assuming that I don't flinch or jerk the trigger. The box of 158 grain .357s seemed to be the most accurate, although I had no trouble with various .38s after some practice.

Is it possible that there's something wrong with your gun?

[eliphalet]

MIne woulda hit thoses jugs every shot if I did my part. Never has it FTF.
I betcha ya just need to shoot a little bit more and it will all come together for you.

[REB]

With a good internal polish job you can greatly reduce the trigger pull on the SP101. Ruger has a tendency to over spring to make up for their lack of smoothing the internal parts. I use a 8# trigger return spring and a 10# hammer spring in my SP101 with 100% reliability and a much better trigger.

[BlackDrop50]

I bought mine with the hammer, couldn't do with only DAO. 2-3" groups with 158 gr at 15 yards are cake with the Hogues

[Ben Shepherd]

CZF-
Poster # 2 has it. Use a 158 grain 357 load, put the front sight on your target, pull trigger.

Couple things:

1. I think you got the best all-purpose grips. I've wore out three sets of them on one of my sp101s now. Having that third finger on the grip makes a big difference. Also the way that grip fills my hand, and the angle it's on are perfect for me.

2. Just practice. One of my sp101s is over the 70,000 round mark, and still works flawlessly. Under 25 yards, I'll hit it, every time. But it didn't start out that way......

[wuchak]

the gentleman at the range took a look and decided that my gun is sighted "for combat"

You mean the idiot at the range. The fixed sights on the SP101 are regulated for 158gr 357 magnum loads. 125gr loads will impact lower. If the desire is to carry 125gr rounds the front site can be shortened.

Don't give up on the SP101. The snub nose revolver requires more than one session to get properly acquainted.

Reb is right. You need to spend a couple of hours polishing the internals and get yourself a wolffe spring pack. The springs will run you about $15 shipped. You'll get 9, 10, and 12lb hammer springs and an 8lb return spring. 12 should provide reliable ignition with all primer brands even without an smoothing of the internals. The 10lb spring may not provide reliable ignition with CCI (very hard) primers even after slicking the internals. If you go with the 10lb test with your carry ammo and check the depth of the firing pin dents in the primers to be sure they are deep enough. If they are not there are some things that can be done pretty easily. The 9 is only for competition. Changing the return spring to the 8lb one will slow lock time but lighten trigger pull (no free lunch) so you will need to try it an see if you like it. With the 12lb hammer spring I didn't like the 8lb return spring and stayed with the factory one. When I went to the 10lb hammer spring the 8lb return spring felt fantastic. It's all in the balance between the two and how they feel to the individual.

To find out where to polish things head over the http://www.rugerforum.net. Register, introduce yourself, and please post the report you posted here. Then PM Iowegan and ask for a copy of the IBOK on the GP100. All steps apply to the SP101. With the IBOK and some 600 and 2200 grit sandpaper in 2 hours time you will be amazed at your trigger even with factory springs. If you have a dremel with polishing kit and jeweler's rouge for a final buff after sanding/polishing even better. Once it is really polished and all the contact points are like mirrors and you have the 10lb and 8lb spring in it your jaw will hit the floor when you pull the trigger.

I tried the Hogue's on my SP101 and while they were comfortable at the range they sucked for CC since the sticky rubber grabbed any and all cover garments. The extra bit of length was also just enough to make them print more than factory. I went back to factory grips. I can get my pinky on them, just barely, but enough. The smooth sides don't catch clothing. I put wood inserts in it to dress it up but after wearing the finish off them by carrying I went back to the factory plastic. Not pretty but effective and I don't find that much of a difference in recoil between factory and the Hogues up to 50 rounds. Beyond that the Hogues are more comfortable but 50 magnum rounds is my limit for the day. Did 100 magnum rounds in a couple of hours once and my hand hurt for a week. 38 specials in the SP101 are another story. I can shoot those all day every day with no problem.

[19-3Ben]

CZF, don't wory. You've got yourself a FINE hunk of shooting iron right there. Here's the deal, as said above, it's combat sighted. C'mon we're talking about a DAO gun with a heavy trigger pull, and a 2 inch bbl. It's not going to be a target grade gun, so yeah, they set it up for fast target sighting in a fight. It's also sighted for 158gr loads byt he way. 158's shoot the most accurately for me. simple as that.

I loved my 3" SP101 so much that I sent it to Gemini for work. My indoor range only goes out to 50 feet, but I can keep all shots in about 3 inches and I'm not even a great shot. I'm sure others can do much better.

[19-3Ben]

The 10lb spring may not provide reliable ignition with CCI (very hard) primers even after slicking the internals. If you go with the 10lb test with your carry ammo and check the depth of the firing pin dents in the primers to be sure they are deep enough. If they are not there are some things that can be done pretty easily. The 9 is only for competition. Changing the return spring to the 8lb one will slow lock time but lighten trigger pull (no free lunch) so you will need to try it an see if you like it. With the 12lb hammer spring I didn't like the 8lb return spring and stayed with the factory one. When I went to the 10lb hammer spring the 8lb return spring felt fantastic. It's all in the balance between the two and how they feel to the individual.


Mine's got the 10lb. spring and shoots absolutely everything very reliably, even CCI. Then again, I also have full hammer, so it has a little more momentum when it falls.

[spwenger]

...are what make horse races. I prefer to use Wolff's nine-pound main spring and leave the trigger-return spring alone as I initially had trouble with the trigger return on my SP101 due to a small bump inside the trigger-guard housing (subsequently removed). I was intrigued to learn that Teddy Jacobson (http://www.actionsbyt.com/) agrees with me that trigger return is the weak spot in the current Ruger double-action revolvers offerings.

[MCgunner]

Mine will group it's best loads into 2" at 25 yards off a rest and it's quite natural with the Hogue grip off hand. Very accurate and rugged little toot.

For some reason, and I don't know why, the thing puts .38 wadcutter, 140 JHP, 158 JHP, and 180 JHP to the same POA! I mean, I ain't complainin', but this is the FIRST revolver I've ever owned that did that and it defies physics, can't understand or explain it. But, by gawd it does!

[ECVMatt]

My SP is great and will hit with all rounds at that distance. I have the 3 1/8 w/ a hammer. I would follow the suggestion already mentioned here and see what happens.

Hope it works out for you,

Matt

[Quoheleth]

I would suggest buy a couple boxes (or reload a couple hundred rounds) of general .38 Special and go shoot at 10 yards. Then, keep it handy at home, CHECK IT FOR EMPTY (or load with snap caps) and dry fire it until your finger won't work anymore. It'll smooth out that stiff Ruger action. That, coupled with the Wolff springs, will make a big difference. The range time will help you get used to the gun. The mild loads will help, too, with your getting used to the DA revolver. Work up to warmer loads. CCI Blazer (aluminum) is good .357 ammo, reasonably priced, and will let you shoot a moderately warm magnum load without high-end magnum prices.

Go ahead. Try to wear it out. I double-dog dare you. :D

Q

[Deputy Doug]

I just had my local smith replace the internals on my 2" .357, with Wolff Springs, it feels like a new gun. The double action "hump" is gone, in single action it's just a dream. Not only is the guy who re-worked it ordering one, his son (the gunsmith) is getting one too.

Stick with the sound advice as posted above, and work with milder loads until you're more comfortable with it. Best utility gun ever.

[Wolfeye]

I'd recommend letting the internals break in on their own instead of having them polished. Mine smoothed out noticeably after a few hundred rounds.

DAO snubs take some getting used to. I was paranoid about the learning curve when I bought my SP, so I loaded up a set of snap caps and kept pulling the trigger until the sights didn't wiggle. After that, at very my first session with the gun I got decent groupings at 7 yards. To my surprise the gun was more accurate with magnums that it was with specials.

[Guillermo]

Nice revolver

Let me join the choir telling you that the practice will get you accurate. Put a couple of hundred rounds through it next time and you will have a new friend.

As to the spring and polish suggestions I would first ask if you are going to carry it. If so I wouldn't go any lighter than 7 or 8 pounds, at least at first.

Best of luck
Guillermo

[19-3Ben]

To my surprise the gun was more accurate with magnums that it was with specials.

I definitely find that to be the case. 158gr magnums are THE most accurate out of mine.

[wuchak]

I'd recommend letting the internals break in on their own instead of having them polished.

They will never break in on their own like you can make them in a couple of hours. The difference is not just noticeable it is dramatic. The difference between throwing a bullet and shooting it.

[springmom]

It also looks, from the photos (second one especially), like you're holding the revolver sort of canted to the left. Try changing your grip and see if that doesn't help your accuracy.

And yes, snubbies take a while to get good at. I was at the range yesterday with my m37 and my 66-3. The 37 is an airweight; the 66-3, a good old fashioned piece of hardware. Both are difficult to shoot really well DA.

Springmom

[Commander Crusty]

Give yourself a chance to get used to the little Ruger by firing 300-500 rounds of standard .38 special loads before trying any more magnums.

[rdrancher]

I agree on using 158gr rather than 125gr in the SP101. I practice with 158gr .357 magnum reloads and carry Buffalo Bore 158gr Low-Flash Gold Dots. They shoot to POA out of my 2.25".

I surprised the heck outa myself the other day point shooting (no sights) at 7yds DA. A 5-reload-5 string in rapid fire netted all but one round on one of those yellow 4" stick-on targets. The stray round was 2" out of the circle. Maybe I should just point shoot from now on. :D

I never thought that I would find a snubby that felt as natural in my hand as a 1911 - but the SP101 does. Keep shooting that little Ruger - I love mine!

rd

[cowssurf]

I have a Ruger sp101. (I'm selling it, but not because I don't like it. But because I want an LCP and don't have enough dough.) I've only shot the gun twice, putting about 250 rounds through it. It was my first time with a double action revolver. I shot it double action and was able to hit some tin cans between 7 to 15+ yards without a lot of effort. And that was even with the rough trigger pull that has now smoothed out quite well after only the 250 rounds. I say shoot what you're good at shooting. But I also say that there are many people that may be able to step into the DA revolver game with zero prior experience and still enjoy it. The sp101 with the Hogue grips is a very nice little gun.

[chris in va]

Branching out a little from your CZ's I see.;)

I just put a lighter hammer spring in my SP, 10#. Makes a LOT of difference in DA. Understand that the hammerless snub SP is not a target gun, primarily a close range defense weapon. Load it, slide it in a pocket or backpack, done.

It'll grow on you. Might want to trade for a hammered model if you like a decent SA pull.

BTW you're holding it wrong. Put your left thumb OVER your right hand. Put your left knuckles right on top of the right. Really helps stabilize the gun. Just remember not to do that with your CZ's!

[wuchak]

Stick with the hammerless for ccw. The hammer spur catching on the draw is a real concern. SA has no place in a sd scenario. There won't be time to cock the gun and even if there was you shouldn't. You'll only be making the trigger that much easier to pull accidentally under the stress of moment. If you have the gun on the perp and he is complying the last think you want is to have the gun cocked. At self defense ranges the difference in accuracy between DA and SA is almost nothing. Surprisingly I'm often more accurate with DA. I think the extra tension helps to stabilize the gun. Once you go out to 25 yards the SA might become an advantage but 25 yards is well beyond self defense range.

My SP101 is DA/SA and I had the local smith take the spur off and put serrations on the top of the stub. I cannot remember the last time I fired a round in SA.

You can send your gun to Ruger and they will fit a DA/SA hammer to your gun. Then you can have both and swap when you feel like it. If you do send it in and you have changed springs in it they will replace them with a factory set.

[MCgunner]

Mine will group 2" at 25 yards off sand bags. Off hand, I can easily hit 6" plates at 25 yards, not a problem. Thing shoots to POA with a variety of ammo from 180 magnum to .28 wadcutter. I don't quite understand this, but I ain't complainin'. Just that it defies the laws of physics. :D But, it's about as accurate a snubby as I've ever fired.

I don't carry revolvers without a hammer spur. I just don't. I don't have a problem with 'em hanging up, even in pocket carry. On the ankle, the hammer spur is handy for the thumb snap. I don't have a thumb snap on my IWB, but I want to be able to pull an SA shot if I'm shooting at longish ranges. Yeah, I know, spare me the speech about all gunfights occuring at 12 inches. I wanna be ready for anything.

[BikerRN]

SA has no place in a sd scenario.

Very true. :)

With that said I will just chime in this this little "tidbit".

Double Action Revolvers are the easiest gun to learn, but the hardest to Master. I am working on "mastering" my D.A. Revolvers and in fact prefer to carry them off duty.

You have been given some very good advice here. Give it time and practice, practice, practice. If you practice "right" you will see a noticable improvement in time.

BikerRN

[MCgunner]

I shoot DA just fine, but I carry my revolvers when I'm outdoors, my Kel Tec for social occasions. And, I'm used to drawing with my thumb on the hammer, probably because I've been an SA shooter for so long and learned on an SA .22. Anyway, it's reflex for me.

I carry my snub when fishing, often when hiking and don't have a bigger gun, taken a rabbit with it a few times and always using single action. My hunting handguns are all single actions, not a DA in the lot. Yes, I know the average gunfight range. I can handle DA just fine. I just don't like revolvers I can't cock and fire when I want to.

But, in a pocket, a DAO auto rides most of the time anyway, so I guess I'm a DA guy after all. LOL! I shoot that auto a lot at the range. I have a bunch of DA revolvers I also play with, but 9mm seems to be what I shoot the most.

[Stumpy.357]

love the gun. .38's are a pleasure to shoot. Full-bore .357 not so much. I stick with 125 grain .357's. Dead on accurate with them and it's fun to shoot.

The only thing I don't like about the gun is the trigger. I'm taking mine to the local gunsmith and have him do his magic

[Big Bill]

I just inherited another SP101 from my son. (He got in trouble with the law and can't have a gun till he gets off probation.) He complained that the cylinder wouldn't rotate properly. When I got it it was very dirty, so I cleaned it and started looking it over. Then I decided to load it. When I was loading the .357 cartridges, two if the cartridges wouldn't seat properly. Another was a little better, but still wouldn't seat (.38 specials were no different...) all the way and the other two cylinders accepted the cartridges ok. I couldn't get the cylinder to close loaded unless I forced it, so I didn't and took the gun back to the store where my son bought it. That was about Christmas time and when I called Ruger, they still never had it in their system.

Has anyone else had a problem like this? I've bought lots of Ruger handguns, but I've never seen anything loke this before.

[LKB3rd]

Get some snap caps and practice your double action trigger pull. I find that after doing this a lot, my semi auto's feel like target triggers, and my revolver accuracy goes way up.
Revolvers are excellent for dry fire practice also because you can just fire away until you get a blister, or your hand cramps up lol. No slide racking required.