[kalibear45]

With companies like Kahr and Kel-Tec rounding out the "pocket 9" category (surely a far more effective caliber) and the popularity of J-frame revolvers - Has the Walther PPK & PPK/S lost its popularity among gun owners that are in the market for a carry pistol? It surely is an interesting design (blow back system) and it has been around for a while. Perhaps its now merely a novelty/collector piece at best?

I'd like to think so otherwise...

Mine has given me zero problems, the accuracy is there, and well... it just looks "cool" :)

http://home.comcast.net/~kbug1/images/ppk_tripp2.jpg

[gremlin]

I agree with your sentiments and I love my stainless, Alabama made PPk. I have had mine for five years and the only thing I have had to do was replace the extractor this year (a $45 problem). Mine's accurate, easy to carry, and easy on the eyes.

Having said all that, it's a pain-in-the-b*** to shoot at the range--and I'm not talking about the dreaded Walther-bite.

I'm referring to the uncomfortable amount of recoil pressure that the blowback design puts between my thumb and forefinger. After four or five magazines of .380, I'm ready to put the Walther down and take a break by shooting .357 magnums out of a 2" snubbie...:rolleyes:

[Standing Wolf]

My Interarms Walther PPK in .380 A.C.P. is the only gun I've ever bought because it was irresistibly cute. It's been an excellent pistol in all respects, but I doubt I'd buy it today: I've read too many complaints about PPKs in too many places, and anyway, the new models are manufactured by Smith & Wesson. I think it's a pretty good design that's probably been eclipsed by more modern designs and manufacturing methods.

[WonderNine]

The PPK sure looks alot nicer than a Kahr, but yes, I believe it's obscelete. If they could come out with one in 9mm that's as pocket carry friendly as the MK9 then they would certainly regain in popularity.

[XLMiguel]

I had an Interarms PPK/S that was a jam-o-matic POS. I have friends who do have PPK/PPK/s's that seem to work fine. It's still a nasty little gun to shoot (for me with big paws), too much kick for its size, slide bite, crappy DA trigger. James Bond charisma aside, I'm real happy with my Kahr P-9 alternative.

[Matthew_Q]

I had a stainless PPK/S a few years ago. Accurate as hell. Nice little pistol. Only ever had a couple misfeeds. The trigger was sweet. Did I say accurate? I regret having traded it off... If I still had it, it would be my carry pistol. I now have a Bersa Thunder, and I love it. It's a great pistol, but it's not as solid as the Walther. It's been completely reliable.

My $.02

[PCRCCW]

Honestly I think they will never lose their charm and appeal...but thats about all they will keep, also. Years ago it was the smallest "reliable" s/auto that shot a decent round. It had the Bond thing going and were exalted with the "Walther" name. They are not famous for being the most reliable gun, my dads bit me the 15 years I shot it..I have the scars to prove it :D and the DA trigger pull never got any better. With many small 380's coming out in the past 15 years....Sig, CZ, Bersa, all were light years ahead of the little PP's in reliability and lack of pain. Then came the little 9's and 40's that pretty much closed the door on the little Walthers.

Its progression at its best that Walther didnt want to keep up with. Its a classic, thin and comfy to hold...nice gun. Its also a Pain in the hand, hit and miss reliability and expensive for what you get. Most have to be smithed to get them to run VERY WELL. For what is offered in todays market, in 380's alone let alone the mini cannons, the classic lines, character and bloodline simply isnt enough. God speed.

Shoot well

[priv8ter]

From our own search for a .380 for the wife, I feel that the CZ-83 and the Bersa/Firestorm .380's are going to be the death of the Walther, AND the SIG P232.

Just my opinion, but gosh darn, I'm entitled to it!

[slh02]

I agree with priv8ter. While I love the looks of the ppk, I honestly dont think that they are worth the $500+ they command here in Maryland (not too sure what they are running in other places). I have also heard too many stories of slide bite and spotty reliability.

The bersa is in my opinion just as good, if not better than the ppk at half the price. Pick mine up tomorrow!

[10-Ring]

I'm gonna agree that they've lost their appeal. There are just so many other guns at about the same size & weight but at a more effective caliber. Cute doesn't win gun fights ;)

[Ala Dan]

Greeting's All-

My daughter has one of the stainless (Gadsden, AL)
made Walther PPK's that I bought her in Jan. of 1995.
It too has functioned flawlessly, with all types of JHP
ammunition. She picked it over my favorite, the SIG
Sauer P230!:uhoh: :D

Best Wishes,
Ala Dan, N.R.A. Life Member

[Kahr carrier]

Hey Kalibear45 nice Pic. Personally I still like the PPK /PPKS it has the 007 mystique and even though there are 9mms that are the same size ,some people find the 380 a little more easier to shoot. I think there is still a place for the little Walthers. P.S -nice Kramer pocket holster.;)

[Boiler_G]

I want to get a PPK, but it is mostly as a charm/collection piece just to be like 007. I will shoot it, but if I am going to carry a peice that size, I think I will choose a Kahr or J-fram Smithy before the PPK. I still want one though! I think everyone should have a 1911, BHP, and a PPK to round out there service/spy piece collection :D

[clubsoda22]

The walther has lost it's popularity, not only to pocket 9's, but to the Bersa Thunder. Bersa fixed a lot of the walthers shortcomings. A bigger trigger guard for gloved hands. A tiny change in the grip to prevent the imfamous walther bite and uncomfortable recoil. All that with a better trigger, lighter weight and half the price. Just as "cute" and a far better carry gun. It's not pocket 9's that are killing it as much as good competition. Some people can't control pocket 9's and prefer the light recoiling 380's, they look around and end up buying the bersa.

[BigG]

Like a high maintenance mistress, looks are about all it ever had. But then, for some, that's enough! :uhoh:

[FJC]

I have one of the newer S&W produced PPK/s, and I'm very happy with mine. 300+ rounds through it, and I have yet to have a SINGLE failure of any kind (with a variety of ammo, including hollowpoints). I bought a pocket holster and do carry it at times, though whenever possible I prefer my Colt Commander. :)

Sure there are more modern designs, and pistols that are easier for pocket carry due to weight, but there's quite a mystique to the PPK/s. Not every pistol purchase follows the "tactical commandments" :) As someone else once posted, the Walther PPK is "pure sex with a trigger." :)



http://www.condron.com/pics/walther/ppks1.JPG

http://www.condron.com/pics/walther/ppks8.JPG

[clubsoda22]

That was definately me who described the walther as "sex with a trigger".

That was 2 or 3 weeks before i went out and bought a bersa. It's sex with an even better trigger.

[David S]

I have a 1964 German made PPK in .32.
absolutly the most accurate little gun i have. Sure its a collectors item, but i still carry it in a tuckable High noon holster from time to time.
i have a .32 kel tec that holds the same number of rounds, but the PPK just feels like more gun..

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?s=&postid=252658

[otomik]

PPK is too heavy, it's uncomfortable, it's too snappy with recoil, the trigger sucks. all these things are solved in the Bersa Thunder plus it doesn't have the hyped-up inflated price.

take all the Bersa's improvements and the next generation PPK-type design should have a scandium frame (smith and wesson what's taking you guys so long?). to up the firepower while preserving the distinctive look make it a delayed blowback with rollers like the HK P9 or CZ-52 so you can put the design out in 9mm Luger. those would sell like hotcakes. until then the PPK is pretty good, even the 1911 has missed a few tricks.

[New_comer]

Wait till James Bond dumps the P99 and reverts to this classic... ;)

[jercamp45]

and, as such, has a place is the history books and in a classic collection!
It was the first(well PP was first) using the DA concept in an autoloader to make it to global popularity. It was small, and that was its main benefit...it could be carried alomst anywhere, instantly ready to shoot.
But as the first, it suffered too from a heavy trigger pull and a slide that bit some(me included). And it was only offered in mousegun caliber's!
The people that like classic will want one. The people that want more power in a modern package will not.
I had a couple, I tried them, I sold them and that was the end of that experiment.
I have a 'jay' for the pocket, maybe to be replaced by the Kahr PM9...but they are only back up to a pair of .45's.
If TSHTF, I want 'thump'! Not 'pop'.
Jercamp45

[jercamp45]

Bond is hollywood, fiction, not real........he'll carry whatever the writers give him.
Basically he is a well dressed Commando, working behind enemy lines, mostly alone......if the situations were reversed...do you want a .32 as your primary defensive weapon? Not me?
I do not care for the Nine, but in his line of work, the global availability of ammo might be the overriding consideration. Yet too, nowadays he'll either have to have various guns stashed at embassies all over the world or have something shipped by diplomatic courier. A Glock 26 with a 19 barrel threaded for a supressor may not have the glamor....but it certainly is more of a realistic gun for a true Bond-like operator.
Jercamp45(again)

[BryanP]

Just to chime in, having fired one if I were inclined to spend the $ I'd rather have a Sig P230/P232. For the bargain factor I'd be more likely to buy the Bersa.

[PzGren]

I have a MH PP in .32 ACP. Yes, it is an antiquated design ... but isn't the 1911?
The .32 served european lawmen well for most of a century and the PP is as accurate as its shooter, so is the PPK. The gun was designed in 1929 for the .32 cartridge. Sometimes it can give problems with ogival .380 projectiles but does fine with the right OAL cartridge.

Are there better guns out there now? For me there are a lot of better CCW guns out there but the PP/PPK still can hold its ground on the range and defend its historical place.

I took a .22 l.r ZM to bullseye practice and got an 8 ring average at 25m.
The .32 with WW Silvertips can duplicate this at $20 a box.

I have a hard time to get this with a Glock 26 at 15 yards and can't do it with my Kel-Tec P11.

[SelfProclaimedExpert]

I think the combined effect of the old designs weight, hammer bite, really heavy DA trigger and price have taken their toll. The bad US made Interarms guns didn't help much, and people are politically leary of the S&W ones.

Also, there are a ton of similar, or smaller, minor caliber guns out there now. You can buy a very similar gun from FEG, or something close like a Bersa or Makarov for cheap.

Like the P-38, it is a decent design that just doesn't compete with current guns, despite it's expensive production cost.

[Majic]

For an unmodified 70 year old design, being fed cartridges it was not designed for, and manufactored by several different companies thru it's lifespan I think it does very well against todays competition. In fact it has out lived alot of it's competitors over the years.

[George Hill]

Thread just below is about some people tickled with the CZ-70s they just got.

Those are PPK clones.

They remain as popular as ever with those that like that type of gun.

[SelfProclaimedExpert]

George,

Does the success of a cheap semi-clone reflect on the original? I have a tiny American Arms .22, but I don't think it counts as a TPH sale.

An FEG is less than half the price of a Walther PP.

[George Hill]

Well, yeah, it does.
Just because someone wants to pay 1/2 the money for the same pistol design?

I guess Ruger's Vaquero pistols have nothing to do with the popularity of the Single Action Army.

[PCRCCW]

Thread just below is about some people tickled with the CZ-70s they just got.

Those are PPK clones.

They remain as popular as ever with those that like that type of gun.

Goerge....your right.

BUT you can get a clone for 100$ that works

OR spend 500$ on a PPK that may not.

Classic or not........its a great point.


Shoot well

[SelfProclaimedExpert]

George,

Well, if Colt doesn't sell any SAAs and Ruger sells a ton of Blackhawks, does it? It would acknowledge that the basic design has appeal, but not that anyone likes it enough to pay the big price for the real deal.

Consumers buy on price point. When they look at Walther PPs and see the price tag they end up looking at other $500 options - and usually buy one of them. When they have less than $200 to spend, the PP knockoffs are good competition for the other cheap guns. In neither case is the real Walther the more attractive option, which is why sales of the real Walther are down.

Your argument is kind of like saying that Pargo (fake) flooring proves that hard wood floors are more popular than ever.

Cheap carry pieces popular (whatever the design).
Small 9 and .40 pieces are popular.
The Walthers are neither.

[Majic]

I will have to side with George Hill on this one. The people looking for Walthers or any other brand and have the money will purchase the original brand. The companies making the clones reconize the fact that something is popular, but not affordable, or available to everyone so they build a cheaper model for that customer base. The clones wouldn't exist and thrive if it wasn't for the popularity of the original design.
The originals have passed the test of time and gained it's classic status. It's price reflects that fact. The clones still have to prove that point, but in time it's price will still reflect that it is no more than a clone.
It's all in how you are willing to spend your money.


Bill Ruger built his empire making clones. The MKI .22lr pistol was a clone of the Luger, the Blackhawks were clones of the SAA.

Cheap carry pieces have always been popular. Only the cheap ones never survived the test of time.

9mm and 40SW may rule today, but .32 and .44 were the most popluar once too. Tomorrow may bring something different.

The classics will always be with us.

[Jaco]

I think the Walther PPK will stay popular as long as SA revolvers, the P38, Luger, and Broomhandle will stay popular. Very few shooters won't want any of the above, although all are outdated and impractical for self defense in the lieu of modern arms, BUT it is and will stay a classic. And then there is the shooters that will use it as their carry gun because they don't know any better, or they know better, like me ;)...

Every member on this board knows that the PPK is too heavy, too weak, too big, too expensive, but look at the amount of posts on this board about this outdated beauty

[Copperhead]

I purchased a new PPK/s-1 made by Smith & Wesson. The fit and finish on this pistol are outstanding. Smith & Wesson is now making the PPK/s-1 using Ruger's Pine Tree casting for the frame and Smith & Wesson produces the slide and other major components.
I can also shoot 3" groups at 25 yards using sand bags. This gun is very easy to shoot with the new longer tang on the grip. ( No bite..) The gun is easy to conceal and a pleasure to carry, and the accuracy is just outstanding.

[clubsoda22]

flyer, everyone who has shot my bersa has said the same thing. The PPK design is still as valid as ever.