[ice monkey]

So I am watching Cold Case Files on A&E. Two Police officers (1957) pull over some d#@k that proceeds to shoot 6 shots from a stubby and kills both officers.

Travesty .

What struck me was that they were shot with a 9 shot .22 stubby. Best I can tell it was a .22lr.

So the inevitable question is:
Are we getting carried away with all these “caliber wars?” Why are we so large caliber crazy?

P.S. 45 years later, they got the guy!

[RickH]

The caliber arguments get a little heated online. Truth is a person that can shoot well and has a .22 is more dangerous than a person that doesn't shoot well with any caliber.

[Big Boomer]

Well let's see here, this is a gun board. So we have 2 things to talk about...

1. Guns
2. Ammo (calibers)

What are you trying to do close the board down!? :D

But seriously anything that can poke a hole in you can be deadly. This includes BB guns!

[jakk280rem]

+1 on a good shooter being more efective w/ a smaller cartridge than a novice with a big one. i think thats why when you see all the "what first gun?" threads, most sensible members recomend the 22. then tell the person to work their way up till they hit their comfort zone. i think that in most cases, when a manufacture comes out with "something bigger" its a combination of capitalizing on a growing number of handgun hunters, and exclusivity. one could literaly cover all there handgun needs with two pistols. a good .22lr and another larger pistol round that the end user percieves as adequate for the task at hand. if i had too, i would probably pick the 44mag. shoot it out of a levergun for hunting, a medium frame for defence and a large frame for woods protection. load it with 44 spcl and it turns into an acccurate pussycat.

[jon'76]

I would rather face a 10 man gang with AKs at 50 yards than my grandfather at 100 yards with a bolt action .22. Pappy don't miss ;)

[easyg]

Can a .22 kill a man?
Yes.

Will a .22 kill a man?
Not reliably.

A couple of years ago I X-rayed a guy who had been shot twice in the back with a .22, from a rifle no less, and he was able to stand up and walk.
And every now and then I'll X-ray folks who still have .22 slugs in them from years ago.
I have zero faith in the .22 being able to stop someone reliably.

[redneck2]

When I was a kid, we'd kill steers for slaughter with a .22 to the head. If it will kill a 1,200# steer, it will work on a human.

Shot placement and all that. Even a .470 Nitro is relatively very small compared to the elephant it kills.

I believe it was Reagan that said "never say always, never say never"

[Chief 101]

I shake my head when someone relates scriptwriters and reality

[jackstinson]

I believe it was Reagan that said "never say always, never say never"
And he was one of the four people shot by John Hinckley Jr with a 6-shot RG14 .22LR revolver: James Brady, officer Thomas Delahanty, Secret Service agent Timothy McCarthy, and President Ronald Reagan (hit by a richochet). Yes, it was loaded with "Devastators", but I don't believe any of them actually detonated. So I'm sure he said, "never say always, never say never"!
You'll have to excuse me, but I'm one of those who would not like to be shot with a .22LR .
As for X-rays? My step-dad still has the little bits of shrapnel he collected in WWII, makes a fine X-ray picture too! But it put him out of action at the time and on lifelong disability.
Jack

[fletcher]

I shake my head when someone relates scriptwriters and reality

?

IIRC, this show covers real events/cases.

[easyg]

Now I'm curious....

Redneck2 and Jackstinson, do you guys carry .22's for self defense?

[jackstinson]

Redneck2 and Jackstinson, do you guys carry .22's for self defense?
Not that it's anyone's business, but sometimes I do. I carry different guns/calibers in different situations.
Hell, sometimes it's an old Beretta 950B in .25acp....wait for it; here come the replies! :D
BTW: I often wonder how many of us have actually ever been mugged, stabbed, shot, or even shot at?
I've been all of the above in years gone by.

[easyg]

BTW: I often wonder how many of us have actually ever been mugged, stabbed, shot, or even shot at?
I've been all of the above in years gone by.
Sounds like you're one real unlucky guy....or one very lucky guy....depending upon how you look at it. ;)

And I've never been stabbed....but I have stabbed someone, does that count?

[ice monkey]

I never thought about it … I guess Big Boomer is right! What else is there to talk about on this forum lol.

I guess I am just sick of hearing how my choice of handgun SD caliber will get me killed (.380).

Thanks for the replies – it’s good to hear now and again that short of a .454 … everything else is NOT useless. :)

[SG1]

I don't think I want to be shot, period. By any caliber.

I too wonder sometimes how come a .380 isn't suitable for SD. If I were fighting military soldiers I'd understand, but normal SD I'd think would be suitable.

Of course shot placement is everything, but that includes large calibers too.

I have a friend who said "you'll need that .22lr rifle if civil unrest breaks out and you need a tactical weapon." I said, "why wouldn't I use my .308?" He says, "try carrying around 500 rounds of .308! 500 rounds of .22 will fit in my front jacket pocket." :D

[ice monkey]

good point!

[Regen]

Considering that in something like 13 out of 14 cases, when someone pulls a gun in self defense, they don't even fire it to get the criminal to stop their crime, the caliber doesn't even matter in these cases.

Well, on second though, maybe there are some cases were you pull a .22LR pistol out and the criminal laughs when he see how small the bore is :D

[BlindJustice]

The title sez "Caliber Crazy"

Seems it should be about Bor Diameter but y'all are
talking about specific CARTRIDGES in various calibers.

Randall

[pyle]

I'm just thankful I live in a state where I'm allowed to carry concealed. Although it wouldn't be my choice - a .22 LR would be better than nothing - wouldn't it?

[Fat_Tony]

Hey easyg, you cannot drop a comment like that and then not tell the story. I'm all ears (eyes) here! :eek: :)

[easyg]

Considering that in something like 13 out of 14 cases, when someone pulls a gun in self defense, they don't even fire it to get the criminal to stop their crime, the caliber doesn't even matter in these cases.
Where did you here this stat?

[easyg]

Hey easyg, you cannot drop a comment like that and then not tell the story. I'm all ears (eyes) here!
There I was, surrounded.
And I'm not talking about your standard run of the mill Iraqi conscript....I'm talking about hardened spec-op warriors!
Within minutes we were ankle-deep in blood and guts, bodies were flying through the air, and the screams of the wounded filled the night.
When it was finally all over, we, the lucky few who had survived, all agreed....

That was the worse bar-room brawl that we had ever seen!

:D


Seriously....
I was sixteen and an older guy tried to molest me.
I pulled my Buck knife and tried to stab him in the crotch, but it stuck in his thigh instead.
He ran off faster than a jackrabbit, but it scared the hell out of me for weeks afterwards.

[figment]

a .22 may kill a man but he may die after he kills you.

[Ltlabner]

Hey, I hear Wall-Mart might start video taping gun & ammo transactions.

[Moonclip]

This case happened not too far from where I live. I wonder what gun was used? I had always assumed or remembered it was a High Standard sentinel.

[jackstinson]

Sounds like you're one real unlucky guy....or one very lucky guy....depending upon how you look at it.
Call it what you will. I look at it like this: I am just about to turn 55, I'm still breathing, relatively healthy, and I only have some scars to remind me of the incidents. Most of which I brought on myself. :uhoh:
BTW- I learned (the hard way) a long time ago that my brain is my best weapon for self preservation.
Jack

[Checkman]

Chief 101 I shake my head when someone relates scriptwriters and reality

Go back and read the first posting. The OP wrote that he was watching A&E's Cold Case.

Not the other television show by the same name that airs on Sunday night on CBS. Now that is a stupid show. Inaccurate and politically correct.

I can remember a couple of seasons ago (I'm talking about the CBS show not the A&E show) when there was an Amnesty International poster on the wall of the detective's squad room. I've been a cop for many years. I think it's safe to say that the last thing you're going to see on the wall in a police department (at least in the U.S.A., can't speak for Canada or England) is an Amnesty International poster. But I digress - sorry.

The show Cold Case on A&E is about actual unsolved crimes and therefore the details are factual not fictional.

[Supertac45]

A .22 wouldn't be my first choice. It'll kill, but not always fast enough.