[Doug Add]

I know you all can't tell me what gun will be best in my situation, but I want your opinions on these two. I am considering them for my wife, and also as a potential carry gun for me (if I choose to do so). My wife has not shot my Browning Hi-Power, but shoots the Walther P22 no problem and slightly preferred it over the SIG P239 I used to have.

The Bersa and Kahr are very similar in size and in magazine capacity. The Kahr obviously has the advantage of 9x19 over .380, but is that worth twice the price?

What are your opinions on these two compared side-by-side? Thanks.

[Dorrin79]

the Bersa, in my experience, is smaller, lighter, has a better trigger (DA/SA instead of striker-fired DAO) and is generally more pleasant to shoot. It is a much better value in my opinion.

That said, the Kahr comes in 9mm or .40S&W, both of which are far superior to .380ACP for defense purposes.

If I was looking for a new all-around CCW piece I would probably take the Kahr, assuming I had the money. If I was looking for another glovebox/nightstand/backup/range gun, I would probably take the Bersa.

It's really about what you want - the guns aren't really that comparable.

[mlk18]

Bersa Thunder 380. Very well made, accurate, reliable, compact and priced right. Especially when you consider you have holsters, spare mags and ammunition to buy as well. For less than $300 you can have everything you (or your wife) needs for concealment or defensive applications. With the Kahr, even if you get the E9, you will be spending $200 more for a similar setup. Which would buy you another Bersa Thunder 380! I would also recommend the Kel-Tec P11, another definite value in the small and light handgun market.

mlk18

[Redlg155]

If you are on a budget, then the Bersa gets the nod, if not then the Kahr.

My wife has never found a blowback operated .380 comfortable to shoot, especially with +P loadings such as Corbons 95gr JHP. She has found that she can shoot 9mm, even +Ps and not complain about wrist/hand pain. Sure she can handle the .380 for a couple of mags full, but this is no where near the amount she needs to practice with. Your wifes recoil tolerance may be a bit different. If at all possible get her to test fire one and see if it is comfortable for her.

.380 ammo is also relatively expensive if you don't reload. 9mm can be has as cheap as $10.50 a box of 100. This leads to more practice, which is a good thing. You also have an extremely large selection of JHPs to choose from when compared to the .380.

Stopping power is a bit better. You need all you can get when using a handgun.

The Bersa is a nice pistol. I've been impressed with them. My arguements go towards the virtues of the 9mm vs the .380.

Good Shooting
Red

[gbelleh]

Your wife needs to try both before deciding. Whichever one she shoots better, more accurately and is more confident with is the one to get.

[PCRCCW]

You have two good and different guns...the only similarity is they are both s/auto's.

If its a CCW get the Kahr and hell yes, its worth twice the Bersa.

If you want a good reliable 380 get the Bersa...but not for a CCW.

If its a plinker...I may still go with the Kahr..ammo is way cheaper for a 9mm

Just my take on things.

Shoot well

[jacketch]

I would agree with Redlg. Unless you really want a PPKlone, the Kahr is really worth the extra money due to better caliber selection, manufacture quality and resale value. The Bersa is a great gun for the money, it just isn't the gun that the Kahr is.

[Doug Add]

Knowing your experience and preferences from messages I have read here and on czforum, let me ask you a further question. How would you compare the Kahr K9 with the PCR? I finally got a PCR in my hand at the gun show this past weekend, but have not shot it yet.

I have shot both a 75 BD and a pre-B 75, and found them similar to my Hi-Power in comfort, control and accuracy, if just a bit wider in the grip. In fact, when I bought the BHP it was between that and a CZ 75 BD, but I got such a deal on the BHP I could not pass it up.

[Matthew_Q]

Well, I went with the Bersa. It's small, light, inexpensive, and accurate. I can get everything I need and spend less than $200.

Yeah, I can only shoot 100-150 rounds before my hand starts feeling sore. That's with standard pressure

(warning, DO NOT SHOOT +P IN A BERSA THUNDER! I've heard reports that it can crack the frame, whereas standard .380 is just fine.)

I shot a Kahr in .40 once. Didn't like it. Didn't like the trigger, didn't like the feel, and it wasn't very accurate.

[clubsoda22]

matt, that's a myth propigated by people who still don't understand aluminum in gun construction. That's like saying don't shoot +P through a beretta or sig, In reality, the +P 380 is only another 50 ft lbs of energy. Not enough to crack an aluminum frame.

Doug, people who complain of excessive recoil in blow back 380's have been shooting walthers, not bersa's. The grip on the bersa is immeasurably better than the walther.

As far as which to pick, try them both. If your wife can handle the larger caliber Kahr, I would recommend it, but if she does consistantly better with the bersa, I would recommend that. I have no problems with the idea of carrying a 380 because i can put the entire magazine into the head of a shillouette at a very fast rate of fire at 10-15 yards while moving. Granted, I can manage that with a similar sized compact 9mm, but i'm sure my mother or sister couldn't. Just things to think about.

[Snowdog]

If its a CCW get the Kahr and hell yes, its worth twice the Bersa.

I like Bersa and have heard few negative things about them, but I'll have to agree wholeheartedly with the above qoute.
In comparison here are two distinctly different beasts, with both representing excellent values for their asking price.
However, I will say that though I am impressed with Bersa, I would much rather have one Kahr over two Bersas (especially if personal defense was the role it were to play).

BTW, my K9 has a butter smooth trigger, and I've found all the Swiss-watch-of-the-gun-world Kahrs I've examined follow suit.

Is a Lincoln Navigator worth twice the price of a Ford Explorer? To some, perhaps. Just like your question, it depends who you're asking.

Good luck with your decision. I'm sure you'll do well either way.

[PCRCCW]

Knowing your experience and preferences from messages I have read here and on czforum, let me ask you a further question. How would you compare the Kahr K9 with the PCR? I finally got a PCR in my hand at the gun show this past weekend, but have not shot it yet.

In all honesty....two of the best guns Ive owned and carried. The Kahr is a runner for sure, with nights and +P's Its in my top 5 favorite guns off all time. It carries very very well and once the trigger is mastered will shoot with almost any gun.

The PCR, frankly, after 2 of them, I sold my Custom:banghead: :fire: , is still my main CCW and is still surprising me all of the time. My "new" one has about 3-4 thousand rounds through it..hasnt burped, stalled or failed in ANYWAY ever. The slide/frame is still "no movement" ...like a Baer, etc.
With HI Caps 14+1 it weighs less than 30 oz's and conceals very well.

Id put this gun up against anything in the way of accuracy, reliability and everyotherbloodything on the market...regardless of cost or reputation.

If I "HAD" to only have 1 gun....Id sell my others inc. my STI and keep this little shooter. After close to 2 dozen CCW's...its the king.

Now if I could just find a good hoslter for it :D :evil: :what:

Shoot well

[mlk18]

Congratulations Doug! Excellent choice in the Bersa, mine has been utterly reliable and very accurate. Holster selection is a little bit of an issue, but fobus makes a good one for the Thunder 380. I am going to have my trigger guard rounded so I can use a Bianchi 100 Professional (and I don't like the hooked trigge guard).

mlk18

[PCRCCW]

Congrats on a good little gun, the Bersa will do you well.

A little reply to "I shot a Kahr in .40 once. Didn't like it. Didn't like the trigger, didn't like the feel, and it wasn't very accurate."

Wow..surprising. Kahrs are the most ergonomically freindly gun made.
Ive got big paws and I love the way it feels, my 9 year old son can shoot it all day and has never limp wristed the thing....says alot.
The ones Ive shot were very very accurate...but youve got to get used to the trigger before this happens....But they arent for everyone.

Either way, you got a good little gun.

Shoot well.

[10-Ring]

I like the Kahrs, if I had to choose.

[Vitamin G]

I had my choice of a Kahr and a Bersa also. I ended up with the Bersa and have been VERY happy with it.

[denfoote]

First, I think it was Matt, not Doug that went with the Bersa. ;)
I have the Kahr MK9. I like it because it is not +P, but +P+ rated for 115gr rounds loaded to 1300fps!!!:what: That power in such a small package makes it well worth twice the price!! The Kahr is accurate and easy to place on target for follow up shots, even with +P rounds!! :)

Now, I'm not saying that the Bersa is a bad gun, but that the Kahr is a far better weapon!! ;)

[chaim]

The Bersa and Kahr are very similar in size and in magazine capacity. The Kahr obviously has the advantage of 9x19 over .380, but is that worth twice the price? It sounds to me like you are asking if it is worth twice the price to have 9mm instead of .380 in the same size package. I don't know the answer. Only you know what the answer is for you.

For me I'd say that I would be comfortable with .380. Yes everyone says that it is the minimum acceptable caliber for defense (not including mouseguns). Well, minimum acceptable is still acceptable! It will certainly stop an attacker, especially with a good shooter behind it.

That said, if I could equally afford either (meaning, I could buy either without major sacrifices) for me buying a 9mm is worth double the price. Kind of the inverse here, minimum acceptable is still minimum. With modern defensive loadings a good 9mm round is a very good defensive round these days, a premium 9mm is very close to a good .45 or .40, and it performs worlds above a .380. I love my Bersa. When I get to a CCW state it will sometimes come with me (often in my pocket, occasionally on my belt when in a more "low threat" situation). However, I just bought a S&W 908 online so that I could have a similar sized 9mm instead (and buying used it isn't double the price- I got it for $235 plus transfer fee and shipping, still under $300).

Now, Bersa v. Kahr without the caliber considerations...both are great guns.

My Bersa is incredibly accurate, and most people find it pretty accurate without much time to get used to it. It is a fun gun. It is completely reliable. Good trigger, both in SA and DA. My only issue is a sharp spot on the "beavertail" that I just haven't gotten around to filing or having filed. Due to that spot I can't shoot more than a box or two or the base of my thumb will start to get a sore or even develop a cut. I do love this gun and if I did a little filing I could probably shoot it all day.

My best friend has a Kahr MP9. 100% reliable. Very nice gun, great DAO trigger. Absorbs recoil nicely. I like this gun a lot too, and I'd love to get one someday (though I'd probably go with a K9 or K9Covert). I do find this, with its somewhat less orthodox sights and short sight radius, harder than the Bersa to fire accurately. I wouldn't say it is inaccurate though, and with practice it is very accurate (it is just harder to master than the Bersa).

Caliber independent I'd say the Kahr is a great gun and it is a bit nicer than the Bersa. However, the Bersa is such a good gun that it would get the nod over the Kahr due to price considerations (at least at first- I bought the Bersa first due to price, always intending to eventually get a Kahr).

Only one thing left to add, how do you feel about DAO with no safety? I'm comfortable with it so for me that is a non-issue, but some people just like to have an additional safety. If that is you then the Bersa wins because it does have a safety/decocker (up to fire, down is decock/safe).

[Doug Add]

Thanks to everyone for your input. We may go shoot the Kahr soon. I am leaning toward the Kahr, if for no other reason than I have a lot of 9mm ammo already, so no further investment needed to shoot for a while.

But my wife and I both like the styling of the Bersa. Actually, she picked a SIG 232 out of the case last time at the gun shop as the one she would buy. But that is based on appearance alone, not experience shooting. I have shot a Walther PPK, she has not. It would not be on our list.

After all this, we may even end up with a Ruger SP 101!

[jade]

your wife definitely needs to try both of them before making a decision. i actually asked this very same question a while back. my husband ended up buying a kahr k9 so i got to try it. i hated it. i haven't been able to shoot a bersa yet, so no input there. if i had bought the kahr myself, i would have been very miserable.

[Doug Add]

My wife and I finally got to the range today to try out a few handguns. She is a great shooter! We did not try a Bersa Thunder--no rental at the range, and I have decided for now to stick with 9mm or .38. We rented a Kahr K9 and a Ruger SP101. The DAO trigger on the Kahr was much lighter and smoother than the DAO trigger on the spurless hammer Ruger. We both shot the Kahr better, but she was much more accurate than me with the Kahr.

Guess what she likes best? My Browning Hi-Power. She is not as accurate as I am with the BHP, but it's only her first time shooting the gun, and she was still able to get at least half her shots per magazine in the 2" diameter center circle at 15'!

When we came off the range to turn the guns in I commented about her outshooting me. The young lady that waited on us said, "So that's why you always bring your son and leave her at home!"